Trump - 4 more years of this at least...

[sugilite:Me]

So here I am again at the crux of the issue - if Trump is a liar, let’s break down each scenario and use logic, data and common sense to address it.

Void of emotion and personal disgust.

Once I peel back the shiny layers I tend to find rotten fruit.

Heyya Dean, I think you missed my point. Trump swore black and blue he knew nothing about project 25, yet in the secret recording, the major architect of project2025 stated very clearly they have worked in lockstep with trump this whole time. This = trump being proven a liar again.

I will repeat - men like trump and those of project 2025 do not have the middle class interests at heart and they never will. There is a hell of a lot more to the picture than just property tax breaks. I "think" that those benefits are about to expire for the middle class tax payers soon. Trump did state in the interview with musk he was wanting to give billionaires more tax cuts and other benefits - he did not mention the poor old middle class getting an extension.

Did you see trumps explanation of inflation using packets of tic tacs? That should give you an idea he has no idea what it even really is. You can say he meant Shrinkflation, but if he did, he completely failed to articulate it with any clarity.

Further to the subject of inflation, what the mainstream media and politicians fail to address is as soon as corporations hear the word "inflation" they wring their hands with glee and jack their prices to gouge people while throwing up their hands and saying the magical gouge enabling "but inflation". Which if course makes the inflation even worse. PLENTY of NZ companies did the same.

[Pursang]

Further to the subject of inflation, what the mainstream media and politicians fail to address is as soon as corporations hear the word "inflation" they wring their hands with glee and jack their prices to gouge people while throwing up their hands and saying the magical gouge enabling "but inflation". Which if course makes the inflation even worse. PLENTY of NZ companies did the same.

Three Phases of an economy: Recession - Stagnation - Inflation.

Only one of these is Really Good for business & profits!

[pritch]

Yesterday I noticed a car parked near here with a MAGA number plate. I wondered if that MAGA referred to the obvious. This morning I mentioned it to the passenger as we headed out for coffee and she looked back and reported that the car parked next to it had a Qanon plate. The enemy is *that* close. What kind of idiots would pay good money for those plates? It's not as if the cars were anything like new.

[Dean]

So do I, so do I!

Pursang,

The heart of what I was getting at was that the middle class were not the greatest affected class in relation to the property state tax caps.

Which according to your post you don’t seem to disagree.

So maybe we have reached common ground on that point.

As for the links you provided - I have already touched on this - they measure the “largest tax cut in history” based off the cut relative to the GDP at that point in time.

Which is a flawed metric as you need to take into account the health of the economy (GDP) at the time of the cuts.

10% of a weak GDP and/or an era with extremely high inflation & interest rates (Reagan’s period upwards of 13.1% inflation and 19% federal interest rates in 1981) is less than 7% of a strong & growing GDP and/or with stable inflation..

What stands as truth is no other president has issued a 1.5 trillion dollar tax cut in their term, none, dollar value not % of GDP. Hence Trump was not wrong.

When you look at cuts like that of Obamas during a severe economic downturn - he is favoured by that metric for fronting less - even if you wanted to escalate his tax cuts by 2% YOY to 2017.

[Berries]

Yesterday I noticed a car parked near here with a MAGA number plate. I wondered if that MAGA referred to the obvious. This morning I mentioned it to the passenger as we headed out for coffee and she looked back and reported that the car parked next to it had a Qanon plate. The enemy is *that* close. What kind of idiots would pay good money for those plates? It's not as if the cars were anything like new.

I have a pretty good idea which two people might park next to each other, if you know what I mean................


Was one of them suffering rear end damage?

[husaberg]

trump issues trillions in tax cuts (aimed mainly targeted to help the rich) and also increased natuional debt by trillions at the same time ....i wonder if they are related?
#note this happened even before the covid pandemic.

Trump predicted that economic growth created by the 2017 tax cut, combined with the proceeds from the tariffs he imposed on a wide range of goods from numerous countries, would help eliminate the budget deficit and let the U.S. begin to pay down its debt. On July 27, 2018, he told Sean Hannity of Fox News: “We have $21 trillion in debt. When this [the 2017 tax cut] really kicks in, we’ll start paying off that debt like it’s water.”

That’s not how it played out. When Trump took office in January 2017, the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office was projecting that federal budget deficits would be 2% to 3% of our gross domestic product during Trump’s term. Instead, the deficit reached nearly 4% of gross domestic product in 2018 and 4.6% in 2019.

There were multiple culprits. Trump’s tax cuts, especially the sharp reduction in the corporate tax rate to 21% from 35%, took a big bite out of federal revenue. The CBO estimated in 2018 that the tax cut would increase deficits by about $1.9 trillion over 11 years.

The tariffs did bring in additional revenue. In fiscal 2019, they netted about $71 billion, up about $36 billion from President Barack Obama’s last year in office. But although $36 billion is a lot of money, it’s less than 1/750th of the national debt..

By early 2019, the national debt had climbed to $22 trillion. Trump’s budget proposal for 2020 called it a “grave threat to our economic and societal prosperity” and asserted that the U.S. was experiencing a “national debt crisis.” However, that same budget proposal included substantial growth in the national debt.

Dec. 31, 2020, the national debt had jumped to $27.75 trillion, up 39% from $19.95 trillion when Trump was sworn in.

Still, the deficit growth under Trump has been historic. Steuerle, of the Tax Policy Center, has done a comparison of every American president using a metric called the “primary deficit.” It’s defined as the deficit minus interest costs, because interest is the only budget expense that presidents and Congress can’t control unless they want to do the unthinkable and default on the debt. Steuerle examined the records of 45 presidents to see how the primary deficit had shrunk or grown relative to the size of the economy between the first and final years of each president’s administration.

Trump had the third-biggest primary deficit growth, 5.2% of GDP, behind only George W. Bush (11.7%) and Abraham Lincoln (9.4%). Bush, of course, not only passed a big tax cut, as Trump has, but also launched two wars, which greatly inflated the defense budget. Lincoln had to pay for the Civil War. By contrast, Trump’s wars have been almost entirely of the political variety.

was asked about this risk during a virtual discussion with the Economic Club of New York last October. “If we have another stimulus bill out of Congress, are you worried that the entire amount of federal debt will be too large for us to pay off in a sensible way?” asked David Rubenstein, a private equity executive.


Trump answered by falsely claiming that the U.S. was starting to pay off the national debt before the pandemic, and he claimed that future economic growth would let it do so. “I think you’re going to see tremendous growth, David, and the growth is going to get it done,” Trump said.

https://www.propublica.org/article/national-debt-trump

In May 2024, ProPublica won the Pulitzer Prize for Public Service for reporting on the billionaires giving gifts to the US Supreme Court's justices and covering their travel expenses. The stories were written by Joshua Kaplan, Justin Elliott, Brett Murphy, Alex Mierjeski and Kirsten Berg

one of 6 ...oddly Fox News has never won a Pulitzer, Emmy, Peabody, or Edward R. Murrow Award for journalism on the merits of its work.

[Dean]

“December 31 2020 the national debt had jumped to 27.75 trillion, up 39%”.

Wow that’s a huge leap!

It’s almost like something massive must of happened around that time…

Maybe a global pandemic that shook the world economy…

I wonder

[Kb2020dope]

Hey team.

I do not want anyone to reply this.

What I would like you to do is read this article from mainstream media.

https://www.rt.com/russia/602705-dirty-nuclear-ukraine/

I'm not saying this is right or wrong.

This is what majority of Russians will be reading. Is it possible mainstream media from new zealand or a America are potentially biased?

Once again do not reply to this. Keep an open mind and have a think about how important it is to get both sides of a story.

Thanks team

[husaberg]

“December 31 2020 the national debt had jumped to 27.75 trillion, up 39%”.

Wow that’s a huge leap!

It’s almost like something massive must of happened around that time…

Maybe a global pandemic that shook the world economy…

I wonder

Maybe instead of offering your clearly biased ill thought out opinion (without looking that it was clearly pointed out) trump had blown out the deficit, prior to the pandemic.
IE Trump prior had already blown out the deficit in 2019 to $22 trillion and it was increasing every day as he borrowed more and the interest racked up daily.
I am theorising you don't want to consider that, due to it not fitting your attempted troll...plus based on your other posts somewhat limited troll intellect.
Maybe you are too distracted by the then 19 year old in my avatar and imagining "KBdope" as being the chicken

[Berries]

Hey team.

I do not want anyone to reply this.

What I would like you to do is read this article from mainstream media.

https://www.rt.com/russia/602705-dirty-nuclear-ukraine/

I'm not saying this is right or wrong.

This is what majority of Russians will be reading. Is it possible mainstream media from new zealand or a America are potentially biased?

Once again do not reply to this. Keep an open mind and have a think about how important it is to get both sides of a story.

Thanks team

Not read the link as not interested in whatever it was. I cannot change what the Russians are reading so am not interested. I can't change American politics so not really interested in what you and your mate are posting in support of Trump, like the random tax cut shit that suddenly appeared in the thread. I struggle to see how anyone takes Trump seriously buy hey ho, it takes all sorts. That view is based solely on watching him speak, not articles written by him or about him by MSN, Fox, the BBC, Al Jazeera or your RT. What a statesman he truly is when he grabs them by the pussy.

If people cannot see that he is not president or even politician material then I just shake my head and laugh at them. The Apprentice was his obvious ceiling. I watched that for a laugh. Now I just watch all these, well, I can't call them redneck fuckwits because I quite like a lot of American rednecks and would be one if I lived there. Men in dungarees do look kind of cool.

Anyway, my only interest is that people like yourself feel so strongly about this and I find it rather funny. I live in NZ and don't even give a shit about politics here. In the long run it doesn't matter, I have no idea why you get so worked up about it.

I do not want anyone to reply this

Whatever.

[Dean]

So let’s look outside of this thing called the global pandemic:

Trumps presidency from January 2017 to February 2020 - total debt increase of approximately 3.9 trillion over 3 years = annual increase of 1.3 trillion.

And Obama an annual increase of 1.275 trillion.

And Biden an annual increase of 1.23 trillion.

Hey those numbers don’t look awfully different!? 2 & 6% respectively.
God forbid! “Blown out” he reckons.

[Kb2020dope]

Not read the link as not interested in whatever it was. I cannot change what the Russians are reading so am not interested. I can't change American politics so not really interested in what you and your mate are posting in support of Trump, like the random tax cut shit that suddenly appeared in the thread. I struggle to see how anyone takes Trump seriously buy hey ho, it takes all sorts. That view is based solely on watching him speak, not articles written by him or about him by MSN, Fox, the BBC, Al Jazeera or your RT. What a statesman he truly is when he grabs them by the pussy.

If people cannot see that he is not president or even politician material then I just shake my head and laugh at them. The Apprentice was his obvious ceiling. I watched that for a laugh. Now I just watch all these, well, I can't call them redneck fuckwits because I quite like a lot of American rednecks and would be one if I lived there. Men in dungarees do look kind of cool.

Anyway, my only interest is that people like yourself feel so strongly about this and I find it rather funny. I live in NZ and don't even give a shit about politics here. In the long run it doesn't matter, I have no idea why you get so worked up about it.



Whatever.

Buddy,

I am trying to teach you a lesson and you are acting like a new zealand male over the age of 50.

Wow! I am surprised! We have finally agreed on something! Donald trump is not a politician! He is certainly not! He is a businessman! He was won battles in the real world! He hasn't gone from university studying politics and then gone into politics. He has lived and payed tax in the real world! He is out there representing your average hard working person! He hasn't quite adjusted to the 2024 pc bullshit and that is why the majority love him and the media hate him.

Also I was not after a reply from my statement. I wanted you to shut your whore mouth and think. You couldnt do that. K rd, hunters corner, courney pl or Manchester St for you.

Thanks.

[husaberg]

He has lived and payed tax in the real world!

funny show us his records, as he is a convicted Tax fraudster. even as a troll its a bit obvious isn't it?

is out there representing your average hard working person! Hs.

Or Only the ones that started with small loans of 100 Million?
trumps lived off his old mans hard work, he has actually made less than if he put his inheritance in he bank.
Trolls should be clever. Not so obvious. 2/65

[husaberg]

So letÂ’s look outside of this thing called the global pandemic:

Trumps presidency from January 2017 to February 2020 - total debt increase of approximately 3.9 trillion over 3 years = annual increase of 1.3 trillion.

And Obama an annual increase of 1.275 trillion.

And Biden an annual increase of 1.23 trillion.

Hey those numbers donÂ’t look awfully different!? 2 & 6% respectively.
God forbid! “Blown out” he reckons.

Oh cool selective math, I remember yokel/albundy4eva/Austingtr were great fans of that also. I feel however using selective math is somewhat imbecility misleading...
.............................................Debt at start...................................Debt at end ............ increase%.........Total per year .............per year increase %
George W. Bush 2001–2009 ....$5,807,463,412,200.06 ..........$11,909,829,003,511.70 .......105.08%...... $6,102,365,591,311.64 ............13.5%
Barack Obama 2009–2017 ....$11,909,829,003,511.70.............$20,244,900 ,016,053.50 ........69.98% .......$8,335,071,012,541.80 ........8.75%
Donald J. Trump 2017-2021 ...$20,244,900,016,053.50 ..........$28,428,918,570,048.60 ..........40.43% .......$8,184,018,553,995.10 ........10.10%
Joe Biden 2021-2024 .............$28,428,918,570,048.60...........$33, 167,334,044,723.10 .........16.67% .......$4,738,415,474,674.50 ........4.16%

[pritch]

It’s almost like something massive must of happened around that time…

Maybe a global pandemic that shook the world economy…

There was no pandemic in 2017 when Trump told his wealthy guests at Mar A Lardo that because of his tax cut, "You all got a lot richer." Naturally the effect wasn't instantaneous.

In 2020 Trump was busy suggesting people try drinking disinfectant or shove light bulbs up their arse and predicting that the problem would disappear when the weather warmed up. All while a few hundred thousand Americans died unnecessarlly because of his inaction.