Trump

[sugilite:Me]

Demonlord, if I get time to address your points I will. In the mean time if you manage to pull up the maga hat that has slipped over your eyes, look at the article below. Trump 100% fits every criteria with examples. It's indisputable to people with even a modicum of logic. Try to read it without being on Trumps sugar hit left triggering drug that you OD on regularly.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americ...t-sense-of-all

[TheDemonLord]

Demonlord, if I get time to address your points I will. In the mean time if you manage to pull up the maga hat that has slipped over your eyes, look at the article below. Trump 100% fits every criteria with examples. It's indisputable to people with even a modicum of logic. Try to read it without being on Trumps sugar hit left triggering drug that you OD on regularly.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americ...t-sense-of-all

I read it - I'm going to focus on a single line that I will use to sum up the Article:

Individuals with dangerous personalities have risen to the highest ranks of power throughout modern history – from Nixon to Mao

I'm no fan of Nixon - however The author's choice to put him in the same league as Mao is evidence enough that the writers either are ignorant or they are willfully deceptive. The rest of the article is the classic Garden variety TDS - and you know how rarely I use that phrase, because I find it loathsome.

[sugilite:Me]

I read it - I'm going to focus on a single line that I will use to sum up the Article:

That is not like you to cherry pick one aspect

I'm no fan of Nixon - however The author's choice to put him in the same league as Mao is evidence enough that the writers either are ignorant or they are willfully deceptive. The rest of the article is the classic Garden variety TDS - and you know how rarely I use that phrase, because I find it loathsome.

What Trump example do you disagree with or ascertain never happened?

[TheDemonLord]

That is not like you to cherry pick one aspect

True - but it wasn't in respect to Trump, so I couldn't have been accused of rose-tinted glasses.

What Trump example do you disagree with or ascertain never happened?

The over-arching theme of the Article is probably the easiest:

"Trump has character flaws/mental conditions/personality traits (whatever you want to call them) and this makes him dangerous, not just to the US, but to the world"

Now, I disagree with the assessment - first and foremost if the people making the claim are qualified to make such a judgement, to do so without interviewing him personally, in a clinical setting I think is reprehensible and unprofessional.

But let's put that aside for a moment, because I want to compare this claim to the real-world data:

He's started no new wars
He's had 2 instances that are historic moments for world peace
He appears to have defeated ISIS
He's opted not to use Lethal Options on occassion - such as the 2019 Iranian Drone incident

Those facts do not stack with the claim that he's a Bully and a danger to the world. The first one alone puts him above all the presidents in my Living memory, I'll grant you every disagreement about the other 3 that you want to raise (as there's a fair amount of opinion involved there) - I cannot from a purely logical point of view reconcile the claim in the article with the real world events.

From there one might raise a number of counterpoints, along the lines of 'this is due to the process of Bureaucracy limiting his power' or some other point - but then we would have to analyze that claim from the same perspective - would a Narcissistic Bully tolerate that? The answer by their own definition is unequivocally 'No'.

[pritch]

I'm no fan of Nixon - however The author's choice to put him in the same league as Mao is evidence enough that the writers either are ignorant or they are willfully deceptive. The rest of the article is the classic Garden variety TDS - and you know how rarely I use that phrase, because I find it loathsome.

"There are none so blind as those who will not see."

One of the authors is a clinical psychologist in Alabama so I suppose if you were desperate enough you could consider him biased. The other is a distinguished academic in Ireland, hard to see why he would be biased.

Trump's own neice, a quailified psychologist, considers Trump to be the most dangerous man in the world.

These views are not radical, that is how the vast majority of professionals in the field view Trump. Somebody is clearly suffering from a DS, but it is not them.

Nixon being mentioned in the same breath as Mao was suprising. Although Nixon ordered a nuclear strike on North Korea, I'd rate that as a seriously dangerous threat to world peace. He was drunk at the time and Kissinger suggested the Joint Chiefs wait until Nixon woke up the next morning and confirmed the plan.

[TheDemonLord]

"There are none so blind as those who will not see."

One of the authors is a clinical psychologist in Alabama so I suppose if you were desperate enough you could consider him biased. The other is a distinguished academic in Ireland, hard to see why he would be biased.

Trump's own neice, a quailified psychologist, considers Trump to be the most dangerous man in the world.

These views are not radical, that is how the vast majority of professionals in the field view Trump. Somebody is clearly suffering from a DS, but it is not them.

Ah yes, a field that has a demonstrable political leaning, they wouldn't be biased at all, would they...

Nixon being mentioned in the same breath as Mao was suprising.

Okay Pritch - serious question time.

We both know why it's surprising - so I want you to answer me this:

Why would "a clinical psychologist in Alabama" and "a distinguished academic in Ireland" who (let's grant maximum good faith here) are well-versed in both history and the field of Psychology - why would they make such a comparison?

I can think of a few reasons, if we are ruling out ignorance as a factor - but all of those reasons would compel anyone objective to dismiss the article as deceptive.

[Kickaha]

He's had 2 instances that are historic moments for world peace

If one of those was a Middle Eastern peace deal between two countries that haven't ever been at war, I really don't see that it could count

"The agreement normalized what had long been informal but robust foreign relations between the two countries"

[husaberg]

If one of those was a Middle Eastern peace deal between two countries that haven't ever been at war, I really don't see that it could count

"The agreement normalized what had long been informal but robust foreign relations between the two countries"

if the other was North and south Korea meeting, they did that without him he simply tried to cash in on the forth meeting.
He had zero to do with organizing it either.
2000 summit
2007 summit
April 2018 summit

[sugilite:Me]

The over-arching theme of the Article is probably the easiest:

"Trump has character flaws/mental conditions/personality traits (whatever you want to call them) and this makes him dangerous, not just to the US, but to the world"

Now, I disagree with the assessment - first and foremost if the people making the claim are qualified to make such a judgement, to do so without interviewing him personally, in a clinical setting I think is reprehensible and unprofessional.

I have very little time to reply, so you just get this snippet.
Many, many people close to Trump report there is no "private life" Donald, what you see is what you get. Now considering Trump is the biggest media attention seeking whore President ever, there is PLENTY of material for professionals to work with. Certainly entire truck fleets more material than the antifa t shirts and mums opera career you used to give a near thesis level analysis on Greta T's parents skills and methodology. With that in mind, forgive me for laughing out loud at your "I think is reprehensible and unprofessional." statement
I reckon that deep, deep down you realize your man Trump is every bit the turd he is being made out to be.

[pritch]

forgive me for laughing out loud at your "I think is reprehensible and unprofessional." statement

Poor TDL he spends too much time reading the wrong stuff. Had he been better informed he would know that the profession relaxed the requirement to have personally attended the patient. This was done specifically because of the massive concern in the profession at having a person with multiple obvious mental conditions in charge of the USA - including the nuclear football.

TDL is also ignoring trump playing secret squirrel with his medical records. And his taxes.

Trump reportedly demanded all staff with whom he dealt at Walter Read sign non disclosure agreements. They were not his employees, they are civil servants. None were permitted to speak. The few statements there were came from the White House osteopath. Accordingly the statements have little credibility accorded them by most.

[TheDemonLord]

If one of those was a Middle Eastern peace deal between two countries that haven't ever been at war, I really don't see that it could count

"The agreement normalized what had long been informal but robust foreign relations between the two countries"

Cool - so how come Saint Obama didn't manage to do it?
Or the US embassy in Jerusalem?

I agree they were not at war and that there was an good informal relationship - but considering the general Arab emnity towards Israel, it's a big win.

[TheDemonLord]

I have very little time to reply, so you just get this snippet.
Many, many people close to Trump report there is no "private life" Donald, what you see is what you get. Now considering Trump is the biggest media attention seeking whore President ever, there is PLENTY of material for professionals to work with. Certainly entire truck fleets more material than the antifa t shirts and mums opera career you used to give a near thesis level analysis on Greta T's parents skills and methodology. With that in mind, forgive me for laughing out loud at your "I think is reprehensible and unprofessional." statement
I reckon that deep, deep down you realize your man Trump is every bit the turd he is being made out to be.

Or perhaps even those close to him still get the public persona?

As for my opinion on Greta and co. Vs psychologists:

I'm not a professional, trying to make a judgment in a professional capacity.

And to be clear, this isn't restricted to Trump or to psychologists - anyone trying to make a public, professional assessment about someone or something, without the relevant information (be that a formal assessment or test results) and using their authority to give weight to the accusation is IMO irresponsible.

[TheDemonLord]

Poor TDL he spends too much time reading the wrong stuff. Had he been better informed he would know that the profession relaxed the requirement to have personally attended the patient. This was done specifically because of the massive concern in the profession at having a person with multiple obvious mental conditions in charge of the USA - including the nuclear football.

So, they shift the goalposts and you expect me to count the goal?

Yah ever heard of a post-hoc justification?

TDL is also ignoring trump playing secret squirrel with his medical records. And his taxes.

Trump reportedly demanded all staff with whom he dealt at Walter Read sign non disclosure agreements. They were not his employees, they are civil servants. None were permitted to speak. The few statements there were came from the White House osteopath. Accordingly the statements have little credibility accorded them by most.

Maybe....

Because I don't care about his Taxes? If he's done anything illegal, I'll wait for the IRS investigation. Until one is opened- it's a red herring.

As for his Medical records - that is fairly standard procedure for anyone high-profile - would YOU like your medical records and private and personal information made public?

[Viking01]

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...d-ballot-boxes

[pritch]

As for his Medical records - that is fairly standard procedure for anyone high-profile -

Complete fantasy.

There is existing law in the US covering the privacy of medical information. You'll most commonly see it referred to as HIPPA but that is incorrect, the correct abbreviation is HIPAA. Feel free to Google it.

When Trump was elected he started using non dsclosure agreements with White House staff, just as he had in business. Lawyers pointed out that this was legally dubious as there were already laws covering official information and these people were government employees, not Trump employees. That is yet to be tested in court. Maybe after the electionr?

Far from standard procedure, for a patient to insist that government medical and nursing staff sign non disclosure agreements is quite possibly unprecedented.

With reference to his taxes, the IRS may be a bit slow out of the blocks, but the Attorney General of New York is currently conducting an investigation.