Moto GP 2022

[iYRe]

Crash just did a little bit of analysis of a race between Stoner and MM - worked out the bikes they would ride and the track..

Conclusion MM would probably win because they would be similar speed and MM would take it to CS, and has that bloody minded "not coming second" mentality.

It was an interesting thought experiment.

This comment was interesting:

I heard a podcast with the Italian engineer who had CS and (the next year) MM in Honda:he said Marc was the only rider to read Casey's telemetry at Stoner turn in Philip Island who actually did the same thing Casey did (going almost flat out).He also said that talent and speed wise they were very very close, he ultimately gave Casey a slight edge: but he thought Marc would've had the mental edge against him, thanks to his will to have close quarter fights, while Stoner was less prone to them.He said Marc's fighting style would've drove Casey nuts.

[F5 Dave]

I was expecting more from Remy etc, but it could be a sign of the times when things are so close that a dud bike will just hold you back. Pity it isn't 2020 (ok, no, but what I mean) for KTM when everything was aligning. At least for a little bit.

Bags will stop crashing soon and watch out. Heck maybe Honda could build a good bike before Pol loses his will, but alas.

Next year back to 500s on green alcohol, no aero or TC and rear tyres on the front and vice versa

[ducatilover]

I don't think Remy was ever going to work on the KTM, he's not aggressive enough and his riding is quite rear tyre biased

I think MM is the most alien rider we have seen in the modern era. His raw skill is incredible. Just look at his results pre 2020. He was fast from day 1 and it just became silly by 2019

Fabio is a remarkable talent and i think has a couple championships left up his sleeve. I do think there is a significant level of underperformance from Dovi and poor broke-knee Franky (that's a real bugger, he has so much ability) which makes him look even more incredible.

[ducatilover]

Next year back to 500s on green alcohol, no aero or TC and rear tyres on the front and vice versa

might as well put them all back on moto2 bikes if you want them to be slow and no rider aids eh

[F5 Dave]

Just like a moto2 but with a fuckton more power and less weight. So not comparable.

[iYRe]

I think MM is the most alien rider we have seen in the modern era. His raw skill is incredible. Just look at his results pre 2020. He was fast from day 1 and it just became silly by 2019

and riding this year on a crappy bike with an arm twisted 30deg out of alignment

[Reckless]

I think MM is the most alien rider we have seen in the modern era. His raw skill is incredible. Just look at his results pre 2020. He was fast from day 1 and it just became silly by 2019

Fabio is a remarkable talent and i think has a couple championships left up his sleeve. I do think there is a significant level of underperformance from Dovi and poor broke-knee Franky (that's a real bugger, he has so much ability) which makes him look even more incredible.

The difference is between MM and Fabio is MM's style put him on his arse 5 times per meeting, Fabio seems to be able to keep it shiny side up.

I agree with you on Franky he just cant seem to find the magic setting. Him and a few others.
I guess we will see that more and more when the top 10 are now separated by .1000s
Maybe F5 is right the bikes are just to good now less rider difference.

[Autech]

Yeah I'd place Fabio above MM for riding ability for the below reasons:

He toes the limit of grip and doesn't need to cross it to find it.
He went toe to toe with MM in his rookie season on a B grade bike while MM was at his peak showing us just what he's made of. MM was so worried in Germany (IIRC) he tailed him trying to psych him out and crashed on a cold tyre because of it.
He's a clean rider, even massively down on power you don't see him nudging out the Ducatis (like Mir did last year) out of frustration.
Pure riding style, he's seems to be the only one able to climb all over the bike like MM does getting the weight where it needs to be.

I also believe it's no coincidence that Marc crashed out trying to beat Fabio in Jerez in 2020. Fabio was throwing down the gauntlet and MM was trying to bitch slap him with it.

Doesn't take away from Marcs years at the top (just as Marc didn't take away from Rossi etc), we're just seeing the changing of the guard once more. In a few years time it'll probably be Pedro Acosta showing Fabio what for, nothing stays the same and the goal posts keep shifting.

[ducatilover]

The difference is between MM and Fabio is MM's style put him on his arse 5 times per meeting, Fabio seems to be able to keep it shiny side up.

I agree with you on Franky he just cant seem to find the magic setting. Him and a few others.
I guess we will see that more and more when the top 10 are now separated by .1000s
Maybe F5 is right the bikes are just to good now less rider difference.

That is why Fabio will never dominate like MM. Both incredible riders and both very different approaches.

I hope Franky finds his shoes again, he did some super impressive shit in 2020

If F5 was right all the Yamahas would be much of a munchness. It's not the case. We have been spoiled by VR46 early years dominating, Stoner doing incredible things on shit bikes, Sunday special tyres giving advantages pre '07, Lorenzo doing disappearing acts, and MM doing MM stuff. This is what makes the bikes seems less interesting, we just don't have a JL99, MM93, VR46 etc on the grid right now. Fabio is a best we have, pecco will figure himself out too
The average skill level of the new riders is higher than ever too, this also makes for less "interesting" racing


I'm holding out for Fernandez to get an RNF seat, he will be something special.

[ducatilover]

Just like a moto2 but with a fuckton more power and less weight. So not comparable.

Moto2 bikes are faster around Mugello than Doohan was on a 500.
The 500s were neat, but a current gp bike without all the aids would kill ya a million times easier. Given that the GP22 is a casual 100hp+ more than peak 500s were

[F5 Dave]

Yes quarter of a century of chassis and suspension development will do that for you. More even than that, the tyres they keep wibbling on about are also 25 years more advanced.

I still think the idea of reversing the tyres holds merit, just for comedy purposes. But oh no. Some stuck in the mud officials probably aren't even seriously considering it. When I rule the world. . .

[Reckless]

Repsol weighing in. Goes with my comments above about riders Vs bikes.
100%agree as we will see none of these aids on any bike in a shop at anytime.
Good read


https://the-race.com/motogp/a-veiled...ldest-sponsor/

[iYRe]

On crash net old Heuwen (spelling? meh) was talking about how motogp is better than F1, because in f1 is all about the car. Swap hamilton into a lesser car, and the lesser driver into hamiltons car, and the lesser driver will win. It doesnt work that way in motoGP. The rider still makes a difference. The danger is, imho, it is becoming less and less about the rider.

The days of the Aliens being able to beat the lesser riders will be over.. MM said that he prefers bikes with out all the aids on them, and you can see why. Would these younger riders be able to catch MM on his 2019 bike (or earlier)? No.. I dont necessarily think they are faster/better riders, I think the bikes are better/faster and require less of the riders. FQ is possibly the only rider left who could.

I dunno.. maybe I am wrong, but that's the way I se it going.

caveat: yes, I know the rider will still make a difference, just the difference will become less and less.

[george formby]

On crash net old Heuwen (spelling? meh) was talking about how motogp is better than F1, because in f1 is all about the car. Swap hamilton into a lesser car, and the lesser driver into hamiltons car, and the lesser driver will win. It doesnt work that way in motoGP. The rider still makes a difference. The danger is, imho, it is becoming less and less about the rider.

The days of the Aliens being able to beat the lesser riders will be over.. MM said that he prefers bikes with out all the aids on them, and you can see why. Would these younger riders be able to catch MM on his 2019 bike (or earlier)? No.. I dont necessarily think they are faster/better riders, I think the bikes are better/faster and require less of the riders. FQ is possibly the only rider left who could.

I dunno.. maybe I am wrong, but that's the way I se it going.

caveat: yes, I know the rider will still make a difference, just the difference will become less and less.

I'm pretty sure an ex Alien, name escapes me, talked about younger riders being able to ride a bike right at the limits of the electronics suite. Something they struggled with.

Aero, engine and budget - as ever - probably has a bigger impact than the regulated electronics package.

[iYRe]

I'm pretty sure an ex Alien, name escapes me, talked about younger riders being able to ride a bike right at the limits of the electronics suite. Something they struggled with.

Aero, engine and budget - as ever - probably has a bigger impact than the regulated electronics package.

I think Rossi said something like that...

The thing is, its going past the limits that means you can pass the guy in front who is at the limits of his electronics.. and use the aero/engine/bugdet

I think thats the point I was making, although that was a few hours ago and my memory is failing