Speeding and Dangerous Driving

[SPman]

And why do they have the crap goals in the first place? Because that is how they are funded these days. They get $$$ from ACC, LTSA and local bodies to deliver X amount of traffic enforcement hours. It's a contract that has to be delivered or they don't get the funding.
Again the problem is Govt related because it is their mickey mouse way of delivering the funding. Without the funding the police don't get the troops on the street that the public has asked for. But what they do with thoose troops again relates back to the need to deliver on contracts.

Sort of a catch 22 situation there, but is certainly up to the police chiefs, among others, to fight for a better system of funding. If the heads cant see what is happening to police/public morale through gummint policies, they need a good kick up the jacksie. Its already getting harder to get sufficient recruits of even, average calibre, let alone losing large numbers of good cops who are dissillusioned with the way the force is being run.Running a police force (among others), in a society with widely differing scenarois, by accountants rules, just doesnt work! The only winners are the book keepers! The beauracrats need to be reminded that the police force is meant to serve, assist and protect the public, not be a strong arm collection agency for treasury. Police can only operate efficiently with the goodwill of the public and that goodwill is being seriously eroded!
And part of that reminding has to come from within the force itself.

[spudchucka]

Sort of a catch 22 situation there, but is certainly up to the police chiefs, among others, to fight for a better system of funding. If the heads cant see what is happening to police/public morale through gummint policies, they need a good kick up the jacksie. Its already getting harder to get sufficient recruits of even, average calibre, let alone losing large numbers of good cops who are dissillusioned with the way the force is being run.Running a police force (among others), in a society with widely differing scenarois, by accountants rules, just doesnt work! The only winners are the book keepers! The beauracrats need to be reminded that the police force is meant to serve, assist and protect the public, not be a strong arm collection agency for treasury. Police can only operate efficiently with the goodwill of the public and that goodwill is being seriously eroded!
And part of that reminding has to come from within the force itself.

I agree with your sentiments. One of the problems is that we now have civilians, (beauracrats) making operational descisions on how the police will be run. It is an indirect method of Govt medalling.

Its a complex issue!!!!!

[spudchucka]

I guess I'm fortunate, spudchucker, I get a ticket about once every ten years. And there are ways of letting the cops know you don't think much of them without resorting to abuse.
Why don't you come clean, who or what are you? If you are a cop, stand up!
Lou

Well I think thats my business. People can form their own opinions about me from my posts, after all this forum is largely about opinions. I'm just passing on mine, for what it's worth.

[spudchucka]

Hmmm,This questioning of Spuds profession is pretty pointless,But I have to say I agree with most of what he says.
I have had three contacts with the police in resent times,During all three I was treated in a respectfull manner and have no issue with having been pulled over when I was.As far as I am conserned if I don't get pulled over in some situations then the cops are not doing the job.They don't make the rules and neither do their commanders.The poly's do that,if you don't like it join BRONZ and do something about it.If you can't be bothered doing at lest that,you are just another whinging Kiwi and don't deserve any consideration anyway.Lou, Writes letters to the New papers and I think that is one thing that can be done to be heard but as for most of the noise makers.
Damn not all the sheep in this country have four legs Aye!!!

Yes!! What brasses me off is the whinging attitude that most can't justify with actual negative experiences. If you believe strongly enough that things are that bad in the constablary then get off your butts and do something positive about it.

I don't agree with much that Lou has to say about the cops but I respect him for doing what he believes is his best course of action to force changes.

[Coldkiwi]

If you believe strongly enough that things are that bad in the constablary then get off your butts and do something positive about it.

i think we're all ears if you've got some bright ideas Spud!! We've tried writing letters to all and sundry and they appear to get met with disregard and ignorance (check out Jan issue of N&S) . What do you suggest? A large rideout to parliament perhaps? Well yes, great idea and lots of fun but we've seen that has a pretty limited effect and you can guarantee motorcyclists would get a bad wrap from 90% of the populace who already think we're menaces. hardly worth it is it?

so please... if you got ideas, speak up!!!!

[Jackrat]

[QUOTE=Coldkiwi]

If you believe strongly enough that things are that bad in the constablary then get off your butts and do something positive about it.
QUOTE]

i think we're all ears if you've got some bright ideas Spud!! We've tried writing letters to all and sundry and they appear to get met with disregard and ignorance (check out Jan issue of N&S) . What do you suggest? A large rideout to parliament perhaps? Well yes, great idea and lots of fun but we've seen that has a pretty limited effect and you can guarantee motorcyclists would get a bad wrap from 90% of the populace who already think we're menaces. hardly worth it is it?

so please... if you got ideas, speak up!!!!

So join BRONZ,They are the only voise we have,The gov't does not listen to people that don't even have a name.They know damn well that we don't support our own political lobby group so why should they take any notice of us.Join BRONZ,,How's that for an idea.And try to remember,any group like them are only as strong as their membership.

[Hitcher]

So join BRONZ,They are the only voise we have,The gov't does not listen to people that don't even have a name.They know damn well that we don't support our own political lobby group so why should they take any notice of us.Join BRONZ,,How's that for an idea.And try to remember,any group like them are only as strong as their membership.

Bronz could use a bit of marketing/communications support -- the column in Kiwirider is usually bloody hard to make sense of. Bronz may be our only political "voice" but it's hard for Joe Biker to see value in what it is they're doing for us. Hence my hesitation in joining (not a particularly robust excuse, I admit). Bronz needs to be more accessible and to have a clearer "brand" presence for bikers. I'm not disputing their integrity and that they do good work for all of us one-wheel-drivers, just that they need better marketing skills.

[Coldkiwi]

good point hitcher. I wouldn't even know how to go about joining although I suppose I can see teh merit

[spudchucka]

[QUOTE=Coldkiwi]

If you believe strongly enough that things are that bad in the constablary then get off your butts and do something positive about it.
QUOTE]

i think we're all ears if you've got some bright ideas Spud!! We've tried writing letters to all and sundry and they appear to get met with disregard and ignorance (check out Jan issue of N&S) . What do you suggest? A large rideout to parliament perhaps? Well yes, great idea and lots of fun but we've seen that has a pretty limited effect and you can guarantee motorcyclists would get a bad wrap from 90% of the populace who already think we're menaces. hardly worth it is it?

so please... if you got ideas, speak up!!!!

I'm not the one who thinks there is a problem so really I've given little thought to possible methods / ideas. Just so long as if you feel that strongly about something you actually do something and don't just whinge for the sake of it.

[RiderInBlack]

OK, might sound like a stupid question (but they are often the best), but who are the BRONZ? I just thought they were just a pro-active biker club. If they are a policial group, what are their policies? How do you get to know what they are? Do they have a pubication or a web site?
I like many people are not interested in joining a group without knowing who they are or what they stand for. So if there are Bronz members out there, how about running a "Thread" so we plain ordinary folk can ask you some questions, pick you brains, get to know Bronz better, and probably join.

[dangerous]

who are the BRONZ?

'Bikers Rights Of New Zealand' and thats about all I know

[matthewt]

To see more about BRONZ try www.bronz.org.nz

[Jackrat]

BRONZ was started in 1983 by Lee Hurley.
I was on the commitie for the first couple of years,At one time being secretary.In those first couple of years we held the first Blood runs,toy runs,
and got a motorcylist onto the NZ road safty commitie.In the time I was an active member I saw people moan like hell about everything and then not show up when the issues they had raised where put to the vote.
No body votes for an issue,it is not pushed on a national level,end of issue.
We had some people publicly put us down because they thought we were pushing the antii helmet law issue,even though we where not and never did had people publicly puting us down because we were not pushing this issue,They bitched but never showed up.Neither group ever approched us at any stage to find out what we were doing.
We had people saying we were unapprochable when they had never tryed anyway.I find that for somebody that owns a home PC with net access to say they can't find BRONZ is saying more about them than anything else.If BRONZ fails at anything it is directly due to a lack of support from NZ bikers nothing else.

[Timber020]

People join the police for a variety of reasons, the fact is that many of them are not there to protect society, but to play tough guy and ego trip and get paid relatively well when in the real world they wouldnt amount to much more than a checkout operator.

Those who do go in with good intentions often get changed by the system, its a boys club with boys rules. One of the cops in this rape inquiry was reknown for drink driving in Rotorua. And I quote "Its okay, I just put my car in D for Drunk and I get home no problem."

A cop knocked one of my mates off a bike while the cop (who was a detective) was pulling out of a pub carpark. He was obviously in the wrong but the cops that were called to the scene didnt even breath test him (although it looked obvious to my mate he had been drinking.)

There are some great cops out there, but it doesnt take much to meet the less than great ones.

Go get him Lou, Cops should insure safety, not create hazards.

[Lou Girardin]

I have to confess that I haven't joined BRONZ and I guess I should. But, they don't seem to be proactive in getting the message out to the public. Things like; the environmental benefits of bikes, reduction in congestion if bikes were encouraged (bus lanes!), etc.
A good example was Honda's US advertising campaign in the '60's. "you meet the nicest people on a Honda". That changed the publics perception of bikes and bikers.
We do need more public awareness, then we'll get more support on the issues.
I bet that the public don't even know how we get screwed over ACC.
Lou