Shotguns?

[spudchucka]

At some stage the rate of spin must create a gyroscopic effect on the projectile. Have you ever tried to hold onto the axle of a bicycle wheel or similar spinning at high speed? They sort of have a mind of there own and want to twist or gyrate around.

[idb]

ehehehe that too
but that canceled out not long after they left the bow.. the spline just had to overcome the archer's paradox didn't it?

Ah yes, the archers paradox..
"Would I have been better off choosing a gun....?"

[scumdog]

At some stage the rate of spin must create a gyroscopic effect on the projectile. Have you ever tried to hold onto the axle of a bicycle wheel or similar spinning at high speed? They sort of have a mind of there own and want to twist or gyrate around.

True - but try a 110grn bullet and then a 220grn bullet through the same barrel at the same velocity and you'll find one of the bullets will fly true whereas as the other will 'scatter' into a looser group, the rate of turns per metre. (or feet for oldies like me) really make a difference.

[spudchucka]

I don't know shit all about balistics but it seems to me that there would be an optimum rate of spin for each class of ammo and the weapons barrel should be rifled to generate that ideal rate of spin.

[scumdog]

I don't know shit all about balistics but it seems to me that there would be an optimum rate of spin for each class of ammo and the weapons barrel should be rifled to generate that ideal rate of spin.

Normally true, they ARE geared for the normal bullet weight - it's only those weights at both extremes of the range that cause problems - and at less than 100 metres on a human you would never know the difference, only when longer ranges/tighter groups are the order of the day is the difference obvious.

[jrandom]

True - but try a 110grn bullet and then a 220grn bullet through the same barrel at the same velocity...

110 vs. 220 grains at the same caliber? Which has the wider spread? The 110? Are you sure that it's not just the lighter bullet drifting around more?

Not that I'm trying to argue against the different-spin-rates thing.

But, jeez, ballistics is the ultimate bullshit subject, isn't it? I think the problem is all the numbnut yokels and spotty geeks; the same character attributes that make them want to play with guns also make them more likely to spout crap in an attempt to impress random people with their knowledge.

Goodness knows, *I* only know as much as can be observed experimentally or deduced from the obvious physics of firearms. And I ain't no handgun expert. Maybe one of these days I'll go to the effort of getting a 'B' licence; SWMBO has expressed some keenness on pistol shooting, recently. IPSC matches, eh: fun for the whole family.

[scumdog]

110 vs. 220 grains at the same caliber? Which has the wider spread? The 110? Are you sure that it's not just the lighter bullet drifting around more?

Not that I'm trying to argue against the different-spin-rates thing.

.

Yeah, if my memory serves me well a lighter bullet weight requires more twist (in the same calibre).

The rest of your post is true, many a discussion (fight?) I have had with uneducated drongos who believe that bullets 'fly' upwards, that velocity is everything etc - almost as bad as bike 'experts'!!

[Motu]

I've just heard through a Chinese whisper...from someone who knows someone who....etc - that the inocent bystander wasn't killed with a knife....but by a stray bullet.5 shots were fired,but not all found their intended target,one found an unintended target....

[spudchucka]

If that is true then todays news should be very interesting. The cops couldn't keep that quiet for terribly long.

[spudchucka]

The police web site has just a small piece on the mans death, which states that he died after being stabbed.

http://www.police.govt.nz/news/release/2198.php

A post mortem would have been done by now and if there were gun shot wounds then I'm pretty sure we would know about it.

[idb]

I've just heard through a Chinese whisper...from someone who knows someone who....etc - that the inocent bystander wasn't killed with a knife....but by a stray bullet.5 shots were fired,but not all found their intended target,one found an unintended target....

I heard it was a magic bullet from a grassy knoll.....

[scumdog]

I heard it was a magic bullet from a grassy knoll.....

And a second shooter was involved......

[Swoop]

I thought he was they guy on Kyhber pass who pointed a shotgun at the cops after they pulled him over?

Yes, yes, yes! That's the incident I was on about. Newmarket area.
Good on ya for that Indoo.

[Sniper]

I've just heard through a Chinese whisper...from someone who knows someone who....etc - that the inocent bystander wasn't killed with a knife....but by a stray bullet.5 shots were fired,but not all found their intended target,one found an unintended target....

I smell porky pies.....

[Virago]

I've just heard through a Chinese whisper...from someone who knows someone who....etc - that the inocent bystander wasn't killed with a knife....but by a stray bullet.5 shots were fired,but not all found their intended target,one found an unintended target....

The CIA have denied any involvement, so that proves that there is a conspiracy involved here......