This could've been anyone one here...

[scumdog]

It's not so much about vengeful instincts Jim2, it's more "there's a consequence, you knew it - now you face it" there was no ambush or surprises for this guy (barring being caught) and it is not that he can claim he didn't know what he was doing.

You jump out of a plane without a parachute you know there is a consequence, right or wrong, 'fairness' does not come into it. :spudwave:

[riffer]

Okay, I've sat on my hands all day reading this thread.

Yes, to kill another person is wrong. We all agree.

The drugs smuggled were not intended to be used to make anyone's lives better.

At the end of the day, it's like Russian Roulette. Plenty of people think this kind of thing only happens to other people. But it doesn't. It could happen to any of us.

I am trying to reconcile this whole situation by thinking of another ethically difficult situation which was used by the Nazis, Chechens, Coats, Serbs and plenty of others.

You have a choice. Here is a gun. Kill this man, or we kill you. This guy's choice was not that different.

I have family members currently struggling with addictions. But I would never transport drugs to solve their problems.

Heroin is a weapon of mass descruction.

He made a bad choice.

And paid with his life.

I hope his brother enjoys his next fix.

Arsehole junkie.

[bugjuice]

What's this 'it could happen to any of us' crap?
who is going to do that shit? not me. if that's this 'us', then count me out. It'll only happen to the dicks that think they can smuggle drugs and get away with it. Now, quick show of hands...



thought as much.


http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4487366.stm

[manuboy]

I have absolutely NO simpathy what so ever for the idiot. I work with people most days that drugs have at least partially ruined their lives. One more down, pleanty to go...

Then don't feel sympathy for him, how bout feeling it for the people left behind who now have to cope with the loss eminating from this guys fuck up.

It's like i could feel sympathy for the people you mention if they were affected indirectly, like family - but i'd feel no sympathy for the user cos they were dumb enough to let their lives be ruined from their own actions.

[James Deuce]

It's not so much about vengeful instincts Jim2, it's more "there's a consequence, you knew it - now you face it" there was no ambush or surprises for this guy (barring being caught) and it is not that he can claim he didn't know what he was doing.

You jump out of a plane without a parachute you know there is a consequence, right or wrong, 'fairness' does not come into it. :spudwave:

Yes, but that isn't the point I'm trying to make at all. I'm not sympathising with his plight, I'm saying that there but for the grace of God go I.

[scumdog]

Yes, but that isn't the point I'm trying to make at all. I'm not sympathising with his plight, I'm saying that there but for the grace of God go I.

You smuggled drugs into Singapore??

[James Deuce]

What's this 'it could happen to any of us' crap?
who is going to do that shit? not me. if that's this 'us', then count me out. It'll only happen to the dicks that think they can smuggle drugs and get away with it. Now, quick show of hands...



thought as much.


http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4487366.stm

Right now in your rational mind, sitting at your computer, with less in the way of Hobson's choice in front of you that that kid was facing, then I agree with the sentiment.

Please don't forget that I asked, and have continued to ask that this thread isn't about discussing the relative merits of the Death penalty, sympathising with the chap executed today, or discussing the merits of hardcore anti-drug legislation and sentencing.

I'm pleased to see that some people understand what I was on about. I was hoping for a commentary on human nature, but got that and more, so it has been fascinating to say the least.

[bugjuice]

I understand what you're saying Jim, and the reason why you posted this up, and I respect your views on the this guy and his predicament. But, saying nothing about the drugs or the penalty or the country etc, yes he might have had the best intentions at heart, but he is so stupid to have done it, that I'm sure this probably wasn't the first time in trouble, drug related or not. If he wanted to help his brother, then there's a thousand other ways that would have been so much better. I'm in debt, I ain't bringin in no damn drugs.. see, ain't hard, ay?
Sorry, no sympathy from me. If it was planted, then fine. But he knew full well.

[Lou Girardin]

In effect he gave his life for his brother. He probably wasn't paid anything by the loan sharks who were into his brother for dope money.
I wonder if other drug pushers should face the death penalty for the misery they bring.
You know who, Doug Myers and the other liquor and tobacco barons. Michael Erceg was probably the worst of them, he deliberately targeted young people with his low alcohol spirits and alcopops.

[scumdog]

In effect he gave his life for his brother. He probably wasn't paid anything by the loan sharks who were into his brother for dope money.
I wonder if other drug pushers should face the death penalty for the misery they bring.
You know who, Doug Myers and the other liquor and tobacco barons. Michael Erceg was probably the worst of them, he deliberately targeted young people with his low alcohol spirits and alcopops.

Gotta agree with you Lou re Erceg, when you see the number of (mainly younger females) teenagers who get drunk and out of control and into so much shit after drinking these alco-pop lolly-water drinks you feel that he met his Kharma.
He didn't do it for the pleasure of seeing happy young faces, he did it for the MONEY!!!!

Make everybody start their drinking on straight rough whiskey until the age of 25 - THEN we'll see a lot less drunk youths!!

[2much]

Fuck his luck. He ran the risk, he got caught, he pays the price... sux to be dumb.

As for those he left behind, well if his mother's got one druggie son and the other's smuggling drugs then she's obviously a fucken useless mother and has noone else to blame but herself.... perhaps it'll serve as a wake up call for her.

Bottom line: There's a hell of alot of of people out there more worthy of your pity than this piece of shit and his family. Let him rot in hell for all I care.

Fuck 'em.

[badlieutenant]

can anyone here actually say for sure that the various illegal drugs cost, in terms of damage to society (Im not thinking just economically either), more than alcohol and tobacco. Or even just alcohol on its own.
My guess is the little kids and wives who are beaten by thier drunk and abusive husbands and fathers would argue not. Or the people who clean up accidents involving drunk drivers (scumdog ? )the list goes on.
It seems to me that very few arguments are ever so cut and dried as we would like them to be.
In fact the thing that pisses me most off these days are the people who will loudly proclaim rights and wrongs about all and sundry (not just this topic) without ever really knowing all the facts, or worse, assigning a stereotype quickly based on one incident.
for example : "all drug dealers are bad" bollicks to that. context is everything.
I have met a few dealers before. They were nice people.
I can hear the arguments brewing already so before they start ill give thier situation some context.
They grew pot and sold it to adults who they knew personally.They didn't deal any other drugs. They can still be classified as dealers. They had jobs and paid taxes.
oops I got a bit off topic in very short time considering I don't post so much these days.
I'm anticipating someone like scumdog or speedmedic would have a good feel or at least make a good guess at the answer regarding the cost of legal drugs to society vs illicit.

[Krayy]

He was only ~21 when he was caught. Mst of us at 21 weren't the sharpest pencil in the box (hell, I'm still nowhere near it), and did the most stupid and irrational things at that time. The fact that he believed his brother was in mortal danger and that this was his only recourse is sad in that he couldn't approach the rest of his family or external agencies to fix the problem.

That being said, it's pretty much common knowledge that any kind of drug smuggling into Asia carries the harshest penalties and has been widely publicised for years (particularly in Australia) from the media, film (Bangkok Hilton) and other case studies. The fact that he made the choice, even under duress, and has now paid the ultimate price is, to me, a damn stupid way waste of life both on his, and the Singaporean governments part.

And no hugs with his mother, gimmee a damn break.

[Pillick]

I think its a shame that he died for stupidity and good intentions. The only way I think the death penalty can be justified is if someone is unrepentant and will be a danger to society for the rest of their lives (hmm and that can never be proved, people can change and deserve the chance to if that chance can be given without endangering others).

I mean, do you honestly think this guy was worthless? A lost cause? Why throw him away? He could have done something with his life still, hanging him was such a waste. Someone said he had 200,000 odd doses of heroin - why not put him in a rehabilitation center to work until he's treated 200,000 odd addicts, starting with his brother?

[FROSTY:Me]

This one has me in a total moral dilema.
On one hand -Killing a human being-- I can't think of any reason at any time killing is an option.
On the other hand a clear message has been sent out -take drugs into singapore and YOU will die.Really cut and dried .
I also think of the lives saved by the simple fact this particular chain of misery has been stopped.Yea its only a drop in the bucket but it could be you,your sister,your brother who's life was just saved cos theres one less druggie out there on the streets.