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Thread: Lane splitting/filtering: the legal and commonsense answers

  1. #856
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    Quote Originally Posted by swbarnett View Post
    It is if you consider that first time a novice car driver overtakes on the open road. Learning to drive in traffic necessitates using other vehicles as guinee pigs. That's why we have L plates. So that those other drivers know not to expect that novice to drive "normally".
    That's all well and good for a learner who rides within their lane and overtakes using a passing lane or the other side of the centre line, no issue. Lane-splitting is not a pre-requisite activity in order to ride a bike on the road though and I certainly don't recall being tested on lane-splitting when I went through the graduated license system. The noob will of course have to have to have a "first time" should they choose to lane-split, all I ask is that they be sure they have the basic skills to do so without hitting my vehicle. It's not that much to ask, surely?

  2. #857
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    Quote Originally Posted by swbarnett View Post
    So noone's allowed to learn to drive then?
    Now now, I think you need to sloow doown a little. I'm not saying no-one is allowed to learn to drive (or ride), I'm saying that if a biker clipped my wing mirror whilst lane-splitting I would expect them to know that this is unacceptable behaviour and them being a learner does not preclude them from this expectation. It's the road, it's not a dodgem ride.

  3. #858
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madness View Post
    Oh, but it is that simple. Any simpler and it would be from Upper Hutt.
    So, you live in Kansas is it? Where people can acquire suficient skills to eliminate the risk from other road users?

    Quote Originally Posted by Madness View Post
    Keep it up but I still don't agree on your stance that riding between two occupied lanes is safer than sitting in a lane proper. To suggest so to noobs is rather irresponsible IMO. Would I rather get a (rather unlikely) tap from the vehicle behind me or get (highly likely) smeared all over the side of a bus? Hmmmmm, it aint rocket science is it?
    I'd rather get neither. Hence the qualification about keeping my space as free from risk as possible. If I consider it's safer to split past the guy in front in order to put space between me and the guy behind who's following too close then that's what happens. If that offends against some rule, personal, official or otherwise stiff shit, I find hard and fast rules nowhere near as effective in risk management as a healthy paranoia.

    Quote Originally Posted by Madness View Post
    I've had vehicles roll back towards me at traffic lights too whilst I've been in all manner of vehicles, it happens. Are you suggesting that I should run up on a road island beside a queue of traffic in my ute to avoid this happening in future?
    I'd suggest you do anything possible to avoid it. If I thought it worthwhile suggesting anything at all to someone who should be well old enough to have his own ideas about such shit.
    Go soothingly on the grease mud, as there lurks the skid demon

  4. #859
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ocean1 View Post
    So, you live in Kansas is it? Where people can acquire suficient skills to eliminate the risk from other road users?
    No, unfortunately I find myself living in Auckland, lane-splitting capital of New Zealand.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ocean1
    If I consider it's safer to split past the guy in front in order to put space between me and the guy behind who's following too close then that's what happens. If that offends against some rule, personal, official or otherwise stiff shit, I find hard and fast rules nowhere near as effective in risk management as a healthy paranoia.
    Certainly doesn't offend me, in fact I agree whole-heartedly. Your quoted post wasn't so clear (much like the bit below) so thanks for taking the time to clarify this point.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ocean1
    If I thought it worthwhile suggesting anything at all to someone who should be well old enough to have his own ideas about such shit.
    Huh? Did you get distracted at the end of typing that post by chance?

  5. #860
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madness View Post
    Huh?
    It's your life. Nobody on earth has the right to tell you how to spend it.

    Not me.

    Not Skatman.

    Nobody.
    Go soothingly on the grease mud, as there lurks the skid demon

  6. #861
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ocean1 View Post
    It's your life. Nobody on earth has the right to tell you how to spend it.

    Not me.

    Not Skatman.

    Nobody.
    No issues there. It's my fucking wing mirror, nobody on earth has the right to clip it whilst splitting past me in heavy traffic.

    Not you.

    Not Mr Branett.

    Not Skippythekangaroo.


  7. #862
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madness View Post
    No issues there. It's my fucking wing mirror, nobody on earth has the right to clip it whilst splitting past me in heavy traffic.

    Not you.

    Not Mr Branett.

    Not Skippythekangaroo.

    I agree.

    As a rule.
    Go soothingly on the grease mud, as there lurks the skid demon

  8. #863
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ocean1 View Post
    I agree.

    As a rule.
    I'm pleased by that.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Ocean1 View Post
    If that offends against some rule, personal, official or otherwise stiff shit, I find hard and fast rules nowhere near as effective in risk management as a healthy paranoia.
    Agree absolutely. The other day the car in front of me attracted my attention as being driven a bit strangely. Nothing in particular just a bit strange - then she stopped at a green light.

    I passed her up the inside using the gutter (I was on the moped) and was gone. Fuck hanging around someone who is apparently enjoying the full effects of their favourite recreational chemical.
    There is a grey blur, and a green blur. I try to stay on the grey one. - Joey Dunlop

  10. #865
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madness View Post
    I'm pleased by that.
    I was at Te Marua speedway last night for the first time in many years.

    It's an education, for sure.
    Go soothingly on the grease mud, as there lurks the skid demon

  11. #866
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    Quote Originally Posted by pritch View Post
    Agree absolutely. The other day the car in front of me attracted my attention as being driven a bit strangely. Nothing in particular just a bit strange - then she stopped at a green light.

    I passed her up the inside using the gutter (I was on the moped) and was gone. Fuck hanging around someone who is apparently enjoying the full effects of their favourite recreational chemical.
    What, and no sign of the constabulary? I'm astonished your not severly crippled, at least!
    Go soothingly on the grease mud, as there lurks the skid demon

  12. #867
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ocean1 View Post
    I was at Te Marua speedway last night for the first time in many years.

    It's an education, for sure.
    It that the one at the start (ish) of the Rimutakas?

  13. #868
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maha View Post
    It that the one at the start (ish) of the Rimutakas?
    It is indeed. Apart from the spectator gate location it hadn't change in 25 years.

    No bikes, though, and no sidecars.
    Go soothingly on the grease mud, as there lurks the skid demon

  14. #869
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madness View Post
    That's all well and good for a learner who rides within their lane and overtakes using a passing lane or the other side of the centre line, no issue.
    With overtaking the issue is not one of road or lane width. It's about the length of the gap the ovretaking driver decides is long enough.

    Quote Originally Posted by Madness View Post
    Lane-splitting is not a pre-requisite activity in order to ride a bike on the road though
    Technically, niether is overtaking. It is quite possible to ride or drive from Cape Rienga to Bluff without overtaking anyone.

    Quote Originally Posted by Madness View Post
    and I certainly don't recall being tested on lane-splitting when I went through the graduated license system.
    Things may have changed in the 30 years since I sat my license but I certainly wasn't tested on overtaking either.


    Quote Originally Posted by Madness View Post
    The noob will of course have to have to have a "first time" should they choose to lane-split, all I ask is that they be sure they have the basic skills to do so without hitting my vehicle. It's not that much to ask, surely?
    This is a bit of a catch 22. Being "sure they have the basic skills to do so without hitting my vehicle" can only be done with certainty in hindsight. You have to test the skills you think you have before you can be certain you have them. In academia, someone that knows a little about a subject will most likely think they know a lot. There comes a point when they know enough to realise exactly how little you actually know. The same holds true for any thing that must be learnt.

    Quote Originally Posted by Madness View Post
    Now now, I think you need to sloow doown a little. I'm not saying no-one is allowed to learn to drive (or ride), I'm saying that if a biker clipped my wing mirror whilst lane-splitting I would expect them to know that this is unacceptable behaviour and them being a learner does not preclude them from this expectation. It's the road, it's not a dodgem ride.
    No argument there.

    Quote Originally Posted by Madness View Post
    No issues there. It's my fucking wing mirror, nobody on earth has the right to clip it whilst splitting past me in heavy traffic.

    Not you.

    Not Mr Branett.

    Not Skippythekangaroo.

    Another thing we agree on. Nobody's claiming in this thread that they have a right to clip a wing mirror. Just that, as we are human, it does happen (especially to novices), it's not deliberate and doesn't always warrant anything more than a wave of apology.
    "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin (1706-90)

    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending to much liberty than those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson (1743-1826)

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    Right. To whomever can't take a joke and didn't realise my last post was in jest and is a mock of a Katy Perry song. Im sorry that you hope I get crippled by a car. But dare I say, with a sick attitude like that, I'm sure that fate will sooner be inflicted on you than I. Also, GO FUCK YOURSELF.
    Becoming fearless isn't the point. That's impossible. It's learning how to control your fear, and how to be free from it.

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