tookie williams

[John]

words words words

[Postie]

Tell you what, why don't you go away and read "Dead Man Walking" then come back and talk to me then? If you look at the death penalty stats in the US, there is a huge mismatch between the way whites and blacks are treated. If you're young, black and male, you're screwed....

I know that the USA was and probably still is a very racist country when it comes to black and white, but I disagree that his skin colour had anything to with the sentence he was given, in fact if anything, the fact that he was black probably saved his arse for all these years, he was given and all white jury so his defence lawyers and his supporters played on that for years, he gained international status as a reformed black murdering gangster who tried to sway young americans away from gangs and the lifestlye it involves, he was good for publicity, 24 years to carry out a death penalty, that was done for a reason.

[Eurodave]

words words words

how about.... NICE AFF?

[MisterD]

I know that the USA was and probably still is a very racist country when it comes to black and white, .

Definitely.

but I disagree that his skin colour had anything to with the sentence he was given

I'm glad you're so sure. Me? I'm a cynical b'stard with no faith in human nature especially when it comes to anything involving money, lawyers and American public opinion...

[WRT]

words words words

How about . . .


Rockape.

[Beemer]

Being on death row for 20-plus years is a bit tough, but I am sure if he'd killed any of my loved ones, I wouldn't have shed any tears at his execution.

It amazes me how many criminals "turn their lives around" in prison. Like they have much choice? I bet if he'd been paroled or put out on the streets 20 years ago, more people would have died and he wouldn't have become the big hero everyone's making him out to be.

I don't give a shit what colour his skin was, anyone who commits crimes like this doesn't deserve to live. He's had all those years spent in relative luxury (three meals a day, a bed, etc.), unlike his victims and their families.

And it also amazes me how many "find the lord" while they're on death row. If this was true, then they would want to meet their maker sooner rather than later! Finding religion shouldn't be a 'get out of jail free' card.

[ManDownUnder]

I'll happily go back to my "I don't like the death sentence" stance.

I think he did a lot of good in his latter years, writing anti gang and anti drug education books.

The press reported he is a changed man - they have an aim of selling advertising - so they're biased.

The governor of the prison etc commented he hasn't changed - but they have a aim of keeping their jobs, not rocking the boat combined with political aspirations or influences... so they're biased.

I don't know the guy - I know I don't like what he did and I think being locked up with a death sentence over your head for 20 years, before being put to death is cruel.

Beemer - I agree that if it was one of mine that had been murdered I'd feel different. I'd also add that in that situation I should be kept out of the trial and sentencing because of that bias - just as judge, lawyers and jury are.

My 22c worth (+GST)

[T.W.R]

So, mistreatment in the formative years can cause a distorted perception of right and wrong. it is a judgement call, but it is made on different ideas of right and wrong..... It might still stem from our core, but that core is moulded by society....

we're all individuals in life & beliefs, our moral & ethical beliefs are created by our judgement and perception of what society demonstrates to us as we develop, but our decision on what choices we make in life are ours & ours alone, the final decision in our every action is made by us the individual, it isn't made by others.
we adhere to what society expects of us for sure (but thats only due to human nature and belonginess needs).

[Hoon]

I'm all for the death penalty. Rules are rules which we all have to live by and those that chose not to have to pay the price. I read somewhere that it costs $87,000 a year to keep someone in prison. Now how do you all feel paying some murderers living expenses for the next 50 years? To me if someone commits a crime that earns a death sentence then they deserve everything they get.

Its just PC gone mad with all the tree hugging hippies out waving their ribbons so they can sleep better at night because they are soft and living in a fantasy world.

Sure its not the ideal solution but neither is imprisoning someone for life at the taxpayers expense. Hopefully one day science fiction will provide a more economic and ethical answer to dealing with crims i.e. Cryogenic freezing (ala Demolition Man), instant aging (Twilight Zone?), brain reprogramming or even global spy camera coverage, foresight (Minority Report) or time travel (TimeCop) to discourage crime?

[ManDownUnder]

I'm all for the death penalty. Rules are rules which we all have to live by and those that chose not to have to pay the price. I read somewhere that it costs $87,000 a year to keep someone in prison. Now how do you all feel paying some murderers living expenses for the next 50 years? To me if someone commits a crime that earns a death sentence then they deserve everything they get.

Its just PC gone mad with all the tree hugging hippies out waving their ribbons so they can sleep better at night because they are soft and living in a fantasy world.

Sure its not the ideal solution but neither is imprisoning someone for life at the taxpayers expense. Hopefully one day science fiction will provide a more economic and ethical answer to dealing with crims i.e. Cryogenic freezing (ala Demolition Man), instant aging (Twilight Zone?), brain reprogramming or even global spy camera coverage, foresight (Minority Report) or time travel (TimeCop) to discourage crime?

I prefer a punishment that fits the crime..

IF a guy is convicted of rape and it's a 100% certainty... castrate them. Simply remove their balls - it'll lower their libido and certainly provide a deterrant to the community at large...

[Colapop]

The only other time I've heard 'Tookie' was from "George of the Jungle" - watch out for that tree!

[scumdog]

[QUOTE=sels1]

No problem with that philosophy - as long as the "anti-death sentence' types are prepared to pay for the losers existence.
QUOTE]

Yep, dont mind, thats what we pay taxes for - its the cost of living in a civilised society. (And dont mind contributing to your pay either SD )

What I dont want is the Govt taking my money to use for killing people "on my behalf"

I don't mind MY taxes getting used on something I and/or the public could benefit from, keeping a low-life killer alive so certain people can feel good about having no death penalty is not a 'benefit' in my opinion.

Death penalty might not be a deterent but it sure as hell stops recidivent behaviour.

[Grahameeboy]

Always a difficult one....yep he did wrong, nah if he is sentenced to death it is wrong to make him wait 24 years. Okay the agument is that he has appeals but we all know that in the end the end is nigh............however, we are all entitled to a second chance (okay you may say to Kill again which I accept), however, if this guy was doing some good then it is better to just keep him alive...not all these guys turn to God or Good....if he was helping to stop other guys doing what he did then it could save lives and grieving and affect more people........as I said a difficult one...
To be honest if it was my kid he murdered, I would not want him excecuted......it would be the last thing on my mind......killing is still killing.

[Motu]

Hopefully one day science fiction will provide a more economic and ethical answer to dealing with crims i.e. time travel (TimeCop) to discourage crime?

I have some experiance in this field,because it's what happened to me - I was a high Priest in an Atlantis civilisation....for crimes I won't go into here,it's really of no concern to you - I was sent forward to ''The End of Time'' as my punishment.It's been a lot of fun really....

[kerryg]

I have some experiance in this field,because it's what happened to me - I was a high Priest in an Atlantis civilisation....for crimes I won't go into here, it's really of no concern to you - I was sent forward to ''The End of Time'' as my punishment.It's been a lot of fun really....

No Motu, you're confused. Judging from many of your posts and the plain affection you show for old mechanical things, old music etc I believe you were in fact sent BACK in time...to about 1950-something at a guess.......