Here we go again

**MisterD** · 25th January 2006, 14:05

Originally Posted by ManDownUnder

I firmly believe the answer is in education. Educate parents. Despite popular belief it's NOT something natural to everyone, and it's real easy (and fun) to become one...

Putting my sensible hat on, I have to agree, but yet again it's going to be the conscientious few who will end up feeling harrassed and inadequate rather than those who just don't give a flying f-.

My better half and I are expecting a fairly imminent arrival ourselves, and I have to say it was noticeable that it was the two youngest couples who came to the first ante-natal class and were never seen again.

**Winston001** · 26th January 2006, 12:06

Originally Posted by Skyryder

Not too sure if falling through cracks is the right word. Bad parenting seems to be the problem this country. New Zealand has one of the highest infant abuse rates in the western world. Just look at the number of toddlers who get killed..........and the manner in which they are killed.
CYPS don't have a very good public image in this country and the abuse rate may hve something to do with that. Just remember folks we are talking children here and if it is going to be of benifit to just one then may be it's might just be worth it. I hope someone does there sums because I for one would like to see a reduction in associated costs for bad parenting.

Skyryder

Agreed. Child abuse by parents in a wealthy Western country such as NZ is shameful. We need to do something but exactly what is a real connundrum. CYPS social workers are damned when they don't remove children and damned when they do. They can't win.

Originally Posted by ManDownUnder

I firmly believe the answer is in education. Educate parents. Despite popular belief it's NOT something natural to everyone, and it's real easy (and fun) to become one...

Hear hear. Parenting is the most important activity that a human undertakes, yet we get absolutely no training in it at all. These days virtually every parent starts from scratch with only dimly remembered child-hood memories as a guide. And if your parents were abusive then that will be your model.

Families used to contain 3 generations with grandparents guiding new parents and taking up the slack at times of bewilderment. They also contributed wisdom to the household. We really lost something when we started putting old folk out of sight in rest homes.

There are excellent parenting courses available and I know I'm a much better parent for having gone to them. But these courses are attended by middle class people who have the advantages of education and resources. It is the parents in poverty who would really benefit.

**Hitcher** · 26th January 2006, 12:38

Maybe it's too easy for people to have kids? Tried owning a dog or a gun and seen the paperwork and reference checks involved in these endeavours?

Kids? Pah! Just leave the hapless and hopeless to their own initiative and they'll be getting themselves knocked up in record time by virile 13-year-olds who they've plied with drugs or alcohol. And the middle classes fret about in-vitro fertilisation and how many "swimmers" their beau can offload.

**madboy** · 26th January 2006, 12:57

Part of the problem (I'm not saying all) is that the middle classes are working so damn hard to be in the middle classes that they're putting off child rearing later and later. From a biological perspective, it's all downhill from 30 for a woman. So the further past 30 they start at, the harder it gets.

Whereas the dumbass classes get knocked up at 18 when they're in their prime biological state, and start popping out little ones with ease. And they sit on government benefits paid for by... wait for it... the middle classes who can least afford it.

How about they cut a few benefits to lower the need for the tax take, and lower the taxes, encouraging the middle classes to start breeding earlier and with more frequency and actually produce a generation dominated by productive members of society.

**Krayy** · 26th January 2006, 13:50

As long as they don't fill the classrooms with Kiddie-Fiddlers like this bloke:

**MisterD** · 26th January 2006, 14:07

Originally Posted by madboy

How about they cut a few benefits to lower the need for the tax take, and lower the taxes, encouraging the middle classes to start breeding earlier and with more frequency and actually produce a generation dominated by productive members of society.

Something sure needs to be done along these lines, tax payers breed tax payers and beneficiaries breed beneficiaries. It's just maths, actually it's simpler than that, it's just sums.