Fuel injected 250/400s?

**Sutage** · 13th February 2006, 21:14

Hey
Are there are fuel injected 250 or 400 bikes out? Keen for turbo 250 but the conversion is too hard/costly

**cowpoos** · 13th February 2006, 21:25

why...u don't need FI...blow through or suck through carb will be fine....cheaper than anything to do with reprogramming a factory FI from a 250-400 that with out a doubt won't be easy to re-programme...

just don't waste your money and get a bigger bike....or if you can't coz your on your learners....get a two stroker...rgv250 or kr1s 250...F'ing quick bikes....quicker than their spec's would suggest....

**FlyingDutchMan** · 14th February 2006, 12:21

I'm going to FI my bike. Just a matter of getting the engine going first.

**imdying** · 14th February 2006, 14:33

One has to ask why you would bother? A challenge is one thing, but pouring money down a hole is another. I would investigate aftermarket efi computers some, I wonder what one that supports 17000rpm in multipoint would cost?? Maybe they all do? Seems unlikely when there target market is cars?

**marty** · 14th February 2006, 14:43

why turbo a 50hp 250 when you could just have this ??? >>>> http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Mo...n-47852221.htm

**kiwifruit** · 14th February 2006, 14:44

like cowpoos said, get a rgv or simalar if its power you want on a learner or resticted licence
they are very fast!!!

**onearmedbandit** · 14th February 2006, 15:54

I think what imdying says is a good point. One of the reasons efi took a while to get to bikes (note, I say only 1) was due to the higher revs acheived by bikes and getting the injectors to fire at the correct intervals. Or so I read in a technical article on efi and bikes.

**FlyingDutchMan** · 14th February 2006, 21:22

Originally Posted by imdying

One has to ask why you would bother? A challenge is one thing, but pouring money down a hole is another. I would investigate aftermarket efi computers some, I wonder what one that supports 17000rpm in multipoint would cost?? Maybe they all do? Seems unlikely when there target market is cars?

Well my guess is it will cost me between $200-$300 for everything. I'm planning (and have actually started) to design the thing from the ground up (including the actualy microprocessor core hardware design), and will build it my self. I'll be getting rid of the butter fly valves and use my own custom method of regulating the air intake volume. I'm doing it cause I can, not because I want to waste money. I'm going to redo the ignition (theres an easy 5hp right there!). It's going to have mapping for lots of variables, and will have 2GB of space to store code/ignition/FI maps. Closed loop etc etc

**FlyingDutchMan** · 14th February 2006, 21:28

Originally Posted by onearmedbandit

I think what imdying says is a good point. One of the reasons efi took a while to get to bikes (note, I say only 1) was due to the higher revs acheived by bikes and getting the injectors to fire at the correct intervals. Or so I read in a technical article on efi and bikes.

I'll be surprized if that is the real reason - the electronics have been there for 10 years at least. The electronics I'm planning on using will probably be excessively overkill - I could probably run FI for 10 different bikes at the same time on the same device. But since I can get the expensive parts at 1000 up prices through work, it'll be cheap enough and work exactly how I want it to. If it doesn't I'll tweak so it does. Simple as.

**cowpoos** · 14th February 2006, 21:34

Originally Posted by FlyingDutchMan

Well my guess is it will cost me between $200-$300 for everything. I'm planning (and have actually started) to design the thing from the ground up (including the actualy microprocessor core hardware design), and will build it my self. I'll be getting rid of the butter fly valves and use my own custom method of regulating the air intake volume. I'm doing it cause I can, not because I want to waste money. I'm going to redo the ignition (theres an easy 5hp right there!). It's going to have mapping for lots of variables, and will have 2GB of space to store code/ignition/FI maps. Closed loop etc etc

well I think your full of shit....but prove me wrong....

**Sutage** · 14th February 2006, 22:05

shrug why do i wanna turbo it? because then its turbo charged
i thank you all for your opinions but, are there any fuel injected 250/400s?
i can beat most cars that will race me, cant beat anything faster than a 250 bike tho, turbo would help plus keeping it 250
plus it goes pSHHH not RING DING DIN DING
two strokes sound fucking rude

**FlyingDutchMan** · 14th February 2006, 22:19

Originally Posted by cowpoos

well I think your full of shit....but prove me wrong....

**onearmedbandit** · 14th February 2006, 22:53

Originally Posted by FlyingDutchMan

I'll be surprized if that is the real reason - the electronics have been there for 10 years at least. The electronics I'm planning on using will probably be excessively overkill - I could probably run FI for 10 different bikes at the same time on the same device. But since I can get the expensive parts at 1000 up prices through work, it'll be cheap enough and work exactly how I want it to. If it doesn't I'll tweak so it does. Simple as.

I didn't say it was the real reason, re-read my post and you'll see I say it was only 1 of the reasons development on motorcycle engines was slower. Sure the electronics for it probably did exist 10yrs ago, but that is only 2yrs before we started seeing mass production injected bikes on the market. (I'm thinking 98 GSXR750, correct me if I'm wrong - with the exception of the Kawasaki GPX1100 injected version etc). Injection in cars however was in common usage at the time, by the likes of Honda and Suzuki. Just because the electronics were around doesn't mean they were reliable in the harsh conditions that motorcycles encounter or that they were cheap enough to fit to bikes (a decent price rise for an injected bike that didn't produce much more power than a carb'ed model would be a marketing failure).

**imdying** · 15th February 2006, 08:15

Sounds like you're going to have fun

The sort of memory that you want isn't particularly cheap, I'm not sure why you want to use 2GB of it. I would've thought 128k of storage for maps would've been sufficient? What rev/vac/tps/granularity of values are you planning on sampling at?

There's a small number of cheap readily available microprocessors you could use, might just be easier to buy one (you can generally get a developers kit from their websites for working with the instruction sets) than to make one yourself.

I think if might've been the speed of the older microprocessors (as often used in cheaper car diy efi systems) that was insufficient for high revving bikes. Also worth considering which injectors... you'll want a smallish unit to keep the duty cycle up, otherwise you'll have bugger all granularity there too. Can't suggest good units to use sorry.

I'd be suprised if as turbo 250 would be faster than a late RGV/RS anywhere but in straight line, maybe not even then considering the extra weight of a four stroke motor with a lump of cast iron bolted to it.

Not so sure on the $250-$300... inlet manifold, custom air metering thingy, injectors, ecu, wiring, fuel pump. A decent enviro resistant 20pin connector isn't cheap by itself.

Sounds like you're going to have fun

**cowpoos** · 15th February 2006, 09:05

Originally Posted by onearmedbandit

I didn't say it was the real reason, re-read my post and you'll see I say it was only 1 of the reasons development on motorcycle engines was slower. Sure the electronics for it probably did exist 10yrs ago, but that is only 2yrs before we started seeing mass production injected bikes on the market. (I'm thinking 98 GSXR750, correct me if I'm wrong - with the exception of the Kawasaki GPX1100 injected version etc). Injection in cars however was in common usage at the time, by the likes of Honda and Suzuki. Just because the electronics were around doesn't mean they were reliable in the harsh conditions that motorcycles encounter or that they were cheap enough to fit to bikes (a decent price rise for an injected bike that didn't produce much more power than a carb'ed model would be a marketing failure).

I think guzzi's hav had a few injected models in the earliy nineties as well...