81 Springbok Tour..Where were you..?

[Lou Girardin]

To digress, he transformed Germany by creating/playing up both internal and external threats, and 'countering' these by creating a hugely powerful military machine/state juggernaut. So if he had wanted to stop, he woudn't have been able to.
.

Hmmmm. What other country and politician does this remind me of?

[Skyryder]

I agree with that conclusion but there are those who think it was the major contribution to the downfall of apartheid!
What arrogant bullshit!
It was only big in New Zealand and then only among a vocal minority. (The bulk of the antiaparthied feelings in NZ were very genuine on both sides)
Most of the destructive insane behaviour was carried out by criminally minded anarchists who grabbed the opportunity to jump on the band waggon and hide amongst those with genuine feelings about the issue.
Muldoon was worse than the anarchists because he used the issue to try and bolster up his failing political support to further portray his image as a tough guy and a firm leader!
Muldoon used the welfare of our country to create a scenario of discontent and used the police force as a political tool for his own personal advantage.
He was the worst offender, the anarchistic rabble took the bait and the gentle genuine caring people were too stupid to know that they were just being used for political expediency.
It was a black time for New Zealand because it exposed just how illiterate and undereducated the bulk of the populace really is here.
Politicians have always used their ability to create a diversionary circus to distract the voters from the real issues of the day, it's happening today right under our noses.
Watch closely and ask, "who really benefits" :spudwhat:
A and B at loggerheads publicly for the benefit of C!
Who are the losers? Usually, you and me!
Even more intriguing is the question,"who are the winners"?

There was a small and vocal minority of anti arpartheid activists long before Hart or the media became involved. It was the New Zealand Rugby Boards refusal to halt rugby sporting contact with SA (as was their right) that bought apartheid out into the mainstream public forum. Hart played a major role in bringing to the media attention the racist attitude of South African sport. For those that believed, and many genuinanly did, that politics had no place in sport, convenantly overlooked the fact that South Afican 'political' policies were well entrenched in the sporting activities of not only local sport but national teams as well. HART to their credit did raise awareness of the divisions between our New Zealsnd sporting bodies and South African. That maoris were excluded from New Zealand All Black teams that toured SA and when they did were accorded as 'honorary ' whites is a shame that nobody now talks about.

I will agree that there is room for debate as to the contribution that Hart made with the dismantling of arparthied. I am however of the opinion that it would have happened sooner or later with or without Harts support. The fact that Hart bought aparthied onto the world stage makes me think that their support was 'sooner' rather than later.


Ther rest of your post on Muldoon etc I concur.

Skyryder

[Oscar]

I agree with that conclusion but there are those who think it was the major contribution to the downfall of apartheid!
What arrogant bullshit!
It was only big in New Zealand and then only among a vocal minority. (The bulk of the antiaparthied feelings in NZ were very genuine on both sides)
Most of the destructive insane behaviour was carried out by criminally minded anarchists who grabbed the opportunity to jump on the band waggon and hide amongst those with genuine feelings about the issue.
Muldoon was worse than the anarchists because he used the issue to try and bolster up his failing political support to further portray his image as a tough guy and a firm leader!
Muldoon used the welfare of our country to create a scenario of discontent and used the police force as a political tool for his own personal advantage.
He was the worst offender, the anarchistic rabble took the bait and the gentle genuine caring people were too stupid to know that they were just being used for political expediency.
It was a black time for New Zealand because it exposed just how illiterate and undereducated the bulk of the populace really is here.
Politicians have always used their ability to create a diversionary circus to distract the voters from the real issues of the day, it's happening today right under our noses.
Watch closely and ask, "who really benefits" :spudwhat:
A and B at loggerheads publicly for the benefit of C!
Who are the losers? Usually, you and me!
Even more intriguing is the question,"who are the winners"?

Exactly.

Muldoon - Springbok Tour
Thatcher - Falklands

Both won the next election on the suffering of others...