Police are planning...

[madandy]

to issue 75,000 more speeding tickets in the next 12 months compared to the last 12!
"...there is no quota... and there is a clear link between enforcing speed limits and reducing road deaths...reduce annual deaths from 400 to 300 by 2010..."
Even though there'll be approximately another half million cars on the road by 2010

[Lou Girardin]

If Police policies are working and average speeds are being forced down. Where are all those tickets going to come from?
Then there's the projection of another million or so dollars income for the Government just as they're setting the Police budget.
A truly fine performance, Goebbels would be proud.

[bgd]

But does rtargeting speed reduce the road toll. Doesn't seem to be working over here and it hasn't worked in NZ, last year at least.

The latest talk here (apart from the camera with a 2km range) is a camera that detects tailgating. Don't know how it works but to me that is something sensible. It seems to me if you target the bad / dangerous drivers then you might have some impact on the road toll.

But what do I know.

[spudchucka]

But does rtargeting speed reduce the road toll. Doesn't seem to be working over here and it hasn't worked in NZ, last year at least.

The latest talk here (apart from the camera with a 2km range) is a camera that detects tailgating. Don't know how it works but to me that is something sensible. It seems to me if you target the bad / dangerous drivers then you might have some impact on the road toll.

But what do I know.

Of course targeting speed has an impact on the road toll. Speed has everything to do with the damage caused as a result of a crash. Whether or not it caused the crash in the first place is debatable. However it is an undeniable fact that speed is directly linked to net damage done, its just basic physics FFS. Any one that flatly denies this has got his / her head up their own arse.

I totally agree that the "manner" of driving should be policed as hard or harder than speed. However the Courts have to back the police up and hand down some stiff sentences. Often people walk away from Court with a lesser penalty than what they get if an instant fine were to be issued.

If police all of a sudden decided not to target speed anymore you would see a dramatic jump in the road toll. I'm not a supporter of rigid, zero tollerance to speed offending and think that it should be more subject to the discretion of the officer but I would rather have zero tolerance than no speed enforcement at all.

Sadly there is an abundance of drivers that are prepared to drive like maniacs and endanger other road users. As long as there are people willing to drive like this there will be rigid enforcement. Hopefully in turn that has an impact on the road toll. I have no doubt the toll would be through the roof if there wasn't police out there stopping people and issuing tickets.

The road toll would be 0 if people would just drive with their eyes open, obey the road rules, keep their vehicles in good order and stay on their own bloody side of the road.

[spudchucka]

If Police policies are working and average speeds are being forced down. Where are all those tickets going to come from?

I fair question. I'd like to know the answer to that one as well.

A truly fine performance, Goebbels would be proud.

Lou is this just your attempt at humor or do you really believe NZ resembles Nazi Germany?

[MikeL]

Of course targeting speed has an impact on the road toll. Speed has everything to do with the damage caused as a result of a crash. Whether or not it caused the crash in the first place is debatable. However it is an undeniable fact that speed is directly linked to net damage done, its just basic physics FFS. Any one that flatly denies this has got his / her head up their own arse.

I totally agree that the "manner" of driving should be policed as hard or harder than speed. However the Courts have to back the police up and hand down some stiff sentences. Often people walk away from Court with a lesser penalty than what they get if an instant fine were to be issued.

If police all of a sudden decided not to target speed anymore you would see a dramatic jump in the road toll. I'm not a supporter of rigid, zero tollerance to speed offending and think that it should be more subject to the discretion of the officer but I would rather have zero tolerance than no speed enforcement at all.

Sadly there is an abundance of drivers that are prepared to drive like maniacs and endanger other road users. As long as there are people willing to drive like this there will be rigid enforcement. Hopefully in turn that has an impact on the road toll. I have no doubt the toll would be through the roof if there wasn't police out there stopping people and issuing tickets.

The road toll would be 0 if people would just drive with their eyes open, obey the road rules, keep their vehicles in good order and stay on their own bloody side of the road.

I agree with everything you have written here, Spud. Where I have questioned enforcement policies in the past, it has been on the basis of what is a fair, reasonable and appropriate use of resources, and what priorities should be, and what the public perception of police is and should be. No-one disputes the need for enforcement of speed limits, but questions about discretion and tolerance, and the on-going debate about the part revenue-gathering plays in the whole equation, are still both contentious and relevant.
At least we have some common ground, unlike certain other arguments...

[spudchucka]

I agree with everything you have written here, Spud. Where I have questioned enforcement policies in the past, it has been on the basis of what is a fair, reasonable and appropriate use of resources, and what priorities should be, and what the public perception of police is and should be. No-one disputes the need for enforcement of speed limits, but questions about discretion and tolerance, and the on-going debate about the part revenue-gathering plays in the whole equation, are still both contentious and relevant.
At least we have some common ground, unlike certain other arguments...

The revenue gathering stigma will always be attached to police as long as they conduct traffic enforcement. As one who is passionate about the police and what they do I get pretty fecked off at times with this shit, (traffic fines etc) because it does have an impact on public immpressions. I hate hearing stories about unreasonable cops hammering Joe public but at the same time I have to accept that enforcing traffic regulations is part of the job. I always try to be fair & reasonable but I've got no problem with hammering dangerous idiots and people who just blatantly break the rules, however there is no way I'll ever write up somebody just because I can.

[riffer]

The revenue gathering stigma will always be attached to police as long as they conduct traffic enforcement. As one who is passionate about the police and what they do I get pretty fecked off at times with this shit, (traffic fines etc) because it does have an impact on public immpressions. I hate hearing stories about unreasonable cops hammering Joe public but at the same time I have to accept that enforcing traffic regulations is part of the job. I always try to be fair & reasonable but I've got no problem with hammering dangerous idiots and people who just blatantly break the rules, however there is no way I'll ever write up somebody just because I can.

Have to agree with you Spud, even though I've grumbled about my tickets. At the end of the day I went too fast and copped the fine and the demerits.

Ultimately the best revenge for those of us who complain is to not give the police the opportunity to get their extra tickets. Find a better place to speed or find a way to get your jollies without exceeding the speed limit. I'm finding I can have more fun finding windy roads than seeing what my bikes top speed is.

The sooner the politicians believe they've solved the road toll problem the sooner the police can move on to solving the more important problems in our society.

[Quasievil]

The revenue gathering stigma will always be attached to police as long as they conduct traffic enforcement. As one who is passionate about the police and what they do I get pretty fecked off at times with this shit, (traffic fines etc) because it does have an impact on public immpressions. I hate hearing stories about unreasonable cops hammering Joe public but at the same time I have to accept that enforcing traffic regulations is part of the job. I always try to be fair & reasonable but I've got no problem with hammering dangerous idiots and people who just blatantly break the rules, however there is no way I'll ever write up somebody just because I can.

Of course its revenue gathering, if not why do they ping you for cash when doing a little over the speed limit, I got done for 114kp/h going down a hill a good conditions, they made me pay $80.00 and took 20 points, DID THEY HAVE TO TAKE CASH?? 20 points is plenty punishment enough for a slight road rule breach.its ALL about the money, If they were serious about speed being a MAJOR problem as they would have you believe they could do all soughts of things ie speed restrict cars that come into the country.
As long as there is money in it they will milk it for everything.
The highway patrol are scum they chose thier job cause they enjoy writing tickets like the power hungry control freaks they are, all reason is gone and its MONEY MONEY MONEY.I haven met a HP that hasnt got some mental issues going on yet
Having spent alot of time in highway patrol cars myself I think im fairly qualified to say.

[spudchucka]

Of course its revenue gathering, if not why do they ping you for cash when doing a little over the speed limit, I got done for 114kp/h going down a hill a good conditions, they made me pay $80.00 and took 20 points, DID THEY HAVE TO TAKE CASH?? 20 points is plenty punishment enough for a slight road rule breach.its ALL about the money, If they were serious about speed being a MAJOR problem as they would have you believe they could do all soughts of things ie speed restrict cars that come into the country.
As long as there is money in it they will milk it for everything.
The highway patrol are scum they chose thier job cause they enjoy writing tickets like the power hungry control freaks they are, all reason is gone and its MONEY MONEY MONEY.I haven met a HP that hasnt got some mental issues going on yet
Having spent alot of time in highway patrol cars myself I think im fairly qualified to say.

Please explain why you have endangered your well being by spending so much time in a Highway Patrol vehicle which is being piloted by a mentally deranged traffic cop out to take all your money?? Your logic does not compute and I am wondering what mental issues you are harbouring.

Are you suggesting that you would be happy for the Govt to place speed restrictors on all vehicles in this country.

[MikeL]

Having spent alot of time in highway patrol cars myself I think im fairly qualified to say.

It depends what you were doing in those HP cars. If you mean that you were a HP cop yourself once then I suppose you have a point, although it's strange that you don't make an exception for yourself.
On the other hand if you were sitting in the car waiting for the cop to write out a ticket your jaundiced view would be understandable, even though your statement is wildly exaggerated.
The only other reason for having spent some time in patrol cars that I can think of would be as an observer for some project or research and I find it hard to believe that you spent so much time with so many different cops as to be able to justify your sweeping generalisation.
FWIW the worst behaviour I have met with from a traffic cop was a slightly impatient and somewhat arrogant retort to the effect that I shouldn't try to tell him how to do his job, when I was (politely) trying to explain something to him. Scarcely enough to justify the description "scum".

[DEATH_INC.]

yep,if it aint revenue collecting why fines and not just points?and what's with those stupid speed cameras?and why aren't they placed in those signposted 'black spots' where they might do some good?
We all know this is a load of rubbish,but we have to put up with it,right?
I'm in the 'high risk' group,I tend to ride/drive fast,but other than a couple of bike crashes where people have pulled in front of me,my accident rate is not too bad,and zero in a cage.I should be dead.....
There are much bigger issues with our drivers/roading network but the two things they pick on are speeding and d.i.c.,as both are easy to prove (black and white,you're over or under...)as they don't rely on the officers judgment,so no arguments.Easy money.....

[spudchucka]

yep,if it aint revenue collecting why fines and not just points?and what's with those stupid speed cameras?and why aren't they placed in those signposted 'black spots' where they might do some good?
We all know this is a load of rubbish,but we have to put up with it,right?
I'm in the 'high risk' group,I tend to ride/drive fast,but other than a couple of bike crashes where people have pulled in front of me,my accident rate is not too bad,and zero in a cage.I should be dead.....
There are much bigger issues with our drivers/roading network but the two things they pick on are speeding and d.i.c.,as both are easy to prove (black and white,you're over or under...)as they don't rely on the officers judgment,so no arguments.Easy money.....

Drunk Driving has to be proven in court and relies on properly calibrated testing equipment and or laboratory analysis of the drivers blood. There are strict procedures that must be followed or the case will be thrown out. Its not just up to the officers judgement, (gee you look a bit pissed, think I'll charge you with drink driving). Speeding is targeted because it is an injury promoting factor in traffic crashes. The equipment has to be calibrated and the operators certified to use the equipment.

You say why not just points? Ok then lets make the points system much harsher so that drivers lose their licences much easier and for longer periods. Would that make you happy?

The camera black spots are a joke because people just slow down for a short period of time and then continue to break the speed limit.

Perhaps the people that pulled out in front of you weren't able to judge the distance between themselves and you because you were travelling well above the speed limit.

[Quasievil]

Please explain why you have endangered your well being by spending so much time in a Highway Patrol vehicle which is being piloted by a mentally deranged traffic cop out to take all your money?? Your logic does not compute and I am wondering what mental issues you are harbouring.

Are you suggesting that you would be happy for the Govt to place speed restrictors on all vehicles in this country.

No Problem, A old freind of mine got me into helping the police out on night shift at the Ngruawhahia station, at the time they patroled State 1 , I would go out as a volunteer two or three nights a week ,as the cops had to have two cars but only one cop in each, they liked having volunteers to help out.
I relaised after a high speed chase from Huntly to Meremere were a VTR1000 was trying to get away at around 200kp/h (a speed we matched after the chase was called of ,that this is ridiculous and is not a safe thing to do, so I stopped helping out. This event also strengthed my opinion about the mental state of those cops involved. The VTR was doing 94 km/h in a 70km/h sure he made a run for it, but the cops were intent on getting him desipte the risk to themselves the public and the biker. The chase was called off but they turned the lights of and continued. have you been in a cop car doing 200km/h they dont corner to well.
so after this and other events I hold my qualified opinion

No Imnot advocating the use of speed restrictors at all, but the point was that if the government and its police cronies were serious they would advocate and instigate legislation to make them mandatory

[scroter]

Of course its revenue gathering, if not why do they ping you for cash when doing a little over the speed limit, I got done for 114kp/h going down a hill a good conditions, they made me pay $80.00 and took 20 points, DID THEY HAVE TO TAKE CASH?? 20 points is plenty punishment enough for a slight road rule breach.its ALL about the money, If they were serious about speed being a MAJOR problem as they would have you believe they could do all soughts of things ie speed restrict cars that come into the country.
As long as there is money in it they will milk it for everything.
The highway patrol are scum they chose thier job cause they enjoy writing tickets like the power hungry control freaks they are, all reason is gone and its MONEY MONEY MONEY.I haven met a HP that hasnt got some mental issues going on yet
Having spent alot of time in highway patrol cars myself I think im fairly qualified to say.

This I agree with. If its not revenue gathering then why do we get a fine.

also the police dont have to issue 75000 more speeding tickets this year thats what they expect to do. also its for everything not just speeding.