To Race Nationals or Not???

[FROSTY:Me]

Bruce--i agree with TS ---In a nutshell to do the nationals means you need to raise the bar on your riding at least one level above club raceing.

The racing is more intense-given that its one meeting a weekend for 6 weeks if you do whangas then one club meeting then the three south island national rounds.
the other thing to keep in mind is you get 3 days of riding per event at the nationals if yopu do the friday practice.

[Kyle]

Id say do the nz nationals, for the practice and the "under the belt" factor. As for sponserships id try to get very proactive, dont wait to be spotted by a selector who happens to be at a race, contact some of the big overseas companys that have outlets over here, especially ones with race teams overseas you might be surprized who will pay to have their name on your fast bike, and overseas contacts might be handy. But if you have a list of wins and good placings you can show them, that will help alot. Even with some smaller sponsers it might just help make those nz titles more affordable. For example, a tire wholesaler might offer you a very nice deal on tires if you put thier name on your bike, and it sounds like tires are the biggest cost. Just an idea, feel free to shoot me for rambling.

[Two Smoker]

Your still young,

He may be young... but fuck he is ugly!!! But agree with Sugilites Post, Well put

[slowpoke]

Yep, it's a classic chicken or ther egg situation: can't get sponsorship without results, can't get results without sponsorship.

Haven't been there and done it myself....but I HAVE seen the Aussie bike racinf scene up close and personal. Mate these guys are seriously quick. Just ask Stroudy, Tony Rees, Craig Shirriffs, sam smith and co about how hard they are tryin'.....just to come tenth. You have definitely got some talent, I can't believe what you and Darryl achieve on a shoe string budget but just stop and think about it objectively. You have raced against Craig Shirriffs who comprehensively beat EVERYONE at the Vic Club rounds in the Superbike class on a fuggin' 600. As quick as he is he didn't make it to the podium in the supersport ranks.

I've seen Stuart Adams murder the local Superbike guys in WA only to place in the mid teens on his HOME TRACK.

Bryan Staring is an up and comer from WA who had a very very well funded team and he managed to win the 125GP class at his second attempt as a 17 year old. The team put him on a 600 and he's done vey well, to point where he got a factory supported Jardine Honda ride but he's still battling to make it onto the podium.

Mate, as much as we'd all love to see you give it a crack I just don't think there is such a thing as a shortcut in this day and age. No one does a Mick Doohan or Mat Mladin and wins the Oz Superbike champs without putting in there time these days.

Having said that if you have got a burning desire to race the IOM, then start working towards it. Same goes for Aussie or AMA. But, I'd just be thinkin' REAL hard about chucking in a job to do it, 'cos the chances of ever making a living out of racing bikes are pretty slim. But it's an awesome dream and only you will know how far you are prepared to go to achieve it.

Bottom line: race the nat's, measure yourself, improve yourself. The 8k is nothing compared to what you are going to spend in Oz, US etc and the knowledge will be invaluable.

[loosebruce]

Cheers for all the replys, PMs, call's etc peeps.

I can see an extra benefit in doing nationals, Sugilite you're right in saying 3 top running aussie guys came over and still got given a run around by our guys. For me i feel my major goal would be to head to the UK and get into the road race scene (not cricut racing) which is why there is a big pull for me to enter the upcoming BOS rounds, but agree with you Chris, to do Wanganui and if i'm to have an off two weeks out from the Nationals but nothing apeals to me more personally than racing the streets.
But yes doing the nationals would have a good benefit to me if i was to head over having some national experiance and to be honest if i head to the UK i'm still looking long term as in it's not going to happen in 6 months, so might as well fill in that space with the nationals in the mean time.
I hope you're right Sugilite that i might be able to surprise a few with my pace down south, Poo's gave me an interesting offer that i may now consider, but again thats another cost i dont know if i can swing yet.
I have Round 6 at taupo this weekend, i'm really looking forward to this round, if i have any chance of kicking it at the front this will be it, so i am putting a good amount of pressure on myself even though it is a club race but there are going to be some very fast guys there so will be very interesting to see, hope my rearsets turn up in time so i'm not draging shit through most corners.
I'm thinking that i should look at flaging the PMCC rounds to save money and put it towards Nationals and heading down for a round of King of Ruapuna series with Poo's (if the offer still stands mate). Time to forget about doing trackdays as well, unless i have something i want to test out or try.
Time to sit down and have a real major think of just how i'm going to get everything sorted and how i can achieve my goals, find out how and where i'm going to find the nessary money to do so, 3rd job maybe? Time to start hitting trademe with selling random crap, time to get fit too no more pies for me!

All going to plan you'll see a black an silver GSXR1000K5 #66 on the nationals gird early next year (hopefully at least mid pack)......

[k14]

I'm thinking that i should look at flaging the PMCC rounds to save money and put it towards Nationals and heading down for a round of King of Ruapuna series with Poo's (if the offer still stands mate). Time to forget about doing trackdays as well, unless i have something i want to test out or try.

Ah yes, good idea there. Then you'd know what it feels like to be beaten by a bike with 1/8th the engine capacity

[Cleve]

Bruce, one of the good things about this Kiwibiker site, and many of the people on it, is when someone asks a good, honest question, you get well thought, intelligent advice from a bunch of people who actually care and have considered long and hard about their answers.
There is insightful and experienced advice for you to think about (apart from the pommy idiot who reckons NZ is like the deep south of the USA... I say to you...unless you are joking and in which case my apologies for the poor sense of humour, "Squeal like a pig mother f&$#@'r")
Good luck with your plans and your dreams.... and see ya at Taupo (am in Brazil on business right now but fly home on Friday in time to head straight down there...)

[The_Dover]

Hang on while I tune my banjo...........

From what I see Bruce has the raw talent and desire to go overseas, fuck it, do it now while you are young.

He can come back to Appalachia and race the nationals at any time.

Is his pace going to increase due to track knowledge or raw racing experience? Is he better off going where he has a real mountain to climb rather than a small hill? We can already see he's a pretty fast fucker but is he going to improve more by jumping out of his comfort zone and into the rest of the world or by staying in NZ?

[Cleve]

Hang on while I tune my banjo...........

Yeeeehaaww now youse talking Jed

[sugilite:Me]

Is his pace going to increase due to track knowledge or raw racing experience? Is he better off going where he has a real mountain to climb rather than a small hill? We can already see he's a pretty fast fucker but is he going to improve more by jumping out of his comfort zone and into the rest of the world or by staying in NZ?

His pace will definitely increase by taking on 3 tracks and a fair number of riders he has not faced yet.

With all respect to Bruce, his current Manfield times would not even see him get a look in on the top 15 yet alone the top 10 and that is a track he knows well.
He can stay in NZ and climb that mountain, however go overseas before that raw talent has been developed further and it will be very easy to be crushed by that mountain.

An Australian just took out the World superbike championship (yet another one) yet a 4 time Australian superbike champion could not climb what you Dover, call a small hill. I see others in this thread saying the nats pace is only one level above club racing, I can only presume they have never fronted a national level production superbike or supersport race.

So Dover, while you may feel in your comfort zone struggling to crack the top 20 or indeed stay in front of the pace car on the warm up lap, I'm sure Bruce will be stretching his big time to achieve getting in the top 10.

So as of right now that 8K will give him 15 days of experience against battle hardened riders, then he can take that overseas with him in the near future. Money well spent me thinks.

[The_Dover]

His pace will definitely increase by taking on 3 tracks and a fair number of riders he has not faced yet.

With all respect to Bruce, his current Manfield times would not even see him get a look in on the top 15 yet alone the top 10 and that is a track he knows well.
He can stay in NZ and climb that mountain, however go overseas before that raw talent has been developed further and it will be very easy to be crushed by that mountain.

An Australian just took out the World superbike championship (yet another one) yet a 4 time Australian superbike champion could not climb what you Dover, call a small hill. I see others in this thread saying the nats pace is only one level above club racing, I can only presume they have never fronted a national level production superbike or supersport race.

So Dover, while you may feel in your comfort zone struggling to crack the top 20 or indeed stay in front of the pace car on the warm up lap, I'm sure Bruce will be stretching his big time to achieve getting in the top 10.

So as of right now that 8K will give him 15 days of experience against battle hardened riders, then he can take that overseas with him in the near future. Money well spent me thinks.

Why have a fuckin dig at me dickhead?

I'm of the opinion that if he's good enough and backs himself he'd be better off going and spending his money somewhere with a bigger audience and better challenge. It's all the NZ racers saying that the Nats are a step above club racing, I wouldn't fuckin know, I'm not interested in racing.

My view comes from the scale of the task and whether it matches Bruce's ambition or not. He could take out the Nats and still struggle overseas, he could throw caution to the wind and bag himself to learn in a viciously competetive environment, it certainly wont be any easier whether he gets there tomorrow or in 5 years time.

If it's what I wanted to do and I backed myself I'd do it, Bruce is questioning whether he wants to spend 8k doing it in NZ and then go overseas?

[sugilite:Me]

Maybe some guys who have been there at Nationals before can shed some light as to why i should do the Nationals or if i am thinking along teh right lines of heading overseas with my money saved.

Why have a fuckin dig at me dickhead?

I'm of the opinion that...

Thats why I was having a dig at you, since you have trouble reading, I'll s p e l l it out for you, he was asking people of experience and not looking for answers born out of ignorance

[The_Dover]

My answer is not born out of ignorance, other than ignorance of your experiences.

If I want to be a rockstar I'm not going to sit around playing pub gigs in some backwater because I'm not going to get noticed.

Would the experience of entering competitive races in the rest of the world hinder Bruce's development as a racer? I doubt it.

So why should he sit here wasting money in a country with a small racing scene? If he's good enough he'll succeed.

Or he could be top dog here for a few years and then go struggle abroad.....

[Crasherfromwayback]

Would the experience of entering competitive races in the rest of the world hinder Bruce's development as a racer? I doubt it.

So why should he sit here wasting money in a country with a small racing scene? If he's good enough he'll succeed.

Or he could be top dog here for a few years and then go struggle abroad.....

This isn't a dig at you Dover, but yeah, I think it may well hinder his development.
He needs experience at the top level here before going anywhere else.
If he was to go overseas now, I feel he'd get such a hiding (no disrespect to you Bruce!) that it'd be real easy to blow a shitload more money than he will here, only to run out, and come home with his morale at an all time low.

Gotta walk before you can run!
I dragged my leathers outta 'retirement' while I was over there, and becuase the NZACU (at the time) wasn't affiliated with the AUST ACU, I had to ride in 'C' Grade to prove myself. JESUS, even at a club meet at Lakeside Brisbane where I was, there were 40 odd LOONIES on late model bikes going fucking ballistic! Not to be outdone.....I mashed my RS 250 and myself on the last lap on my first race there showing them....how to crash. Doh.

Confidence will help Bruce no end. He'll get that confidence racing against our best here first. One step at a time. Go BRUCE!!

[kickingzebra]

Talking to a mate today (with much nationals and a bit of overseas experience)
The nationals to the club scene, different kettle of fish.
I am planning on doing the nationals, and know damn well I won't be at the front, but tells ya, I won't be at the back either.
The experience of racing the big boys, hard fought races, more of a contact sport etc, we don't have that level of committment at the club races (not that I am bagging them, great fun, learning, and still way fast!)
Nationals here is going to be of some good, the competitive atmosphere, racing the strouds, shauns, and others of like talent, it will lift our game.
Besides that, I'll need a rent a mate down there for the SI rounds

Do it for love and experience, as has been said, we are talkign campaigns in the $25,000 range (including bike) My mate first time seriously contesting it, off his own back, $65,000
Chalk and cheese, but if you can cut it with those boys, there is grounds to carry on.

Not to mention fulfilling the dream!