Bowling for Columbine

[Mongoose]

We dont understand them at all,we`ve had shit-loads more terrorist attacks than the U.S. probably ever will have,mainly sponsored by Noraid fuckwits as well.When there was a supposed threat to the underground system being attacked with poison gas there was a comedy sketch about it on t.v. the next night,that`s the way we are,the Yanks are full of bravado then shit themselves over nothing.
We`ve got a guy called Mark Thomas that does a similar thing to Moore but without so much of the stupid stunts,he once filmed a young girl giving blair a valentines card"I love you nearly as much as you do",prat read it and the cheesy grin never budged.

Ahh yes, but the Poms are more used to it. I remember being in the UK in the 70's and all the signage that was out then for left luggage/suitcases etc due to the IRA threats and sometime attacks.

[scumdog]

I thought Heston turning his back on the photo of the little girl that was shot said it all.
Complete indifference.

Skyryder

I would too if I had that fat twat ragging my arse incessantly.

[scumdog]

and americas motorcycle death rate could probably be majorly reduced if the stupid bastards would wear helmets!

she's a scary country that one.

Sometimes it's not as bad as you think, there's a lot of open four-lane freeways with a large gap between the opposite directions of travel and no "handily' placed object to run into, no intersections etc. :cool2:

[Velox]

There was definitely some good stuff in that movie, but there was also a fair amount of emotive, subjective rubbish that took away from what he was on about. Statistics that you couldn't compare, interviews styles that changed depending on the person being interviewed. And what was the solo black mom saga about? That seemed to really be clutching at straws. And poor old Charlton Heston - fair enough for him to walk away when some guy's carefully twisted an argument so that suddenly you're the reason why a 6 year old girl was shot by her classmate? The whole thing made me very cynical about a documentary that I'd heard so much about.
Some stuff was real good though - he made some decent points and put foward the questions that are important. I'm not bashing the whole thing - it's just not what I expected.

[Lou Girardin]

Moore manipulates his audience in exactly the same way that Bush's cabal manipulated the American people. The difference being that Moore only made a movie.
And isn't it strange how, in the land of the free, Moore is having problems getting mainstream distribution of Farenheit 911.
Let's not forget that it was the NRA that campaigned against the banning of teflon coated rounds (so-called 'cop killer' bullets years ago).
As for Charlton Heston's comment; "they'll prise my gun from my cold dead hand"
An article in the Herald about a woman whose NRA member, gun fanatic son killed himself after becoming disillusioned with his Army superiors in Iraq; qoted her as saying "they prised his gun from his cold, dead hand".
How apt!

[James Deuce]

Thanks Lou. I was getting worried that no one spotted that. Moore also stated that he was going to head down this path ofter his "Fair Go" American-style show "The Awful Truth" got canned. Moore was as surprised as anyone when "Bowling for Columbine" got nominated for a Best Documentary Oscar, when it could only fairly be called a mockumentary.

He raises some very pointed questions about how easy it is for the media to push people's "attitude" button to get the correct response. It's just that no one seems to expect propaganda from the "left" any more. I see that someone in France is indicting Dick Cheney for $US7 Billion in fraud. That will be interesting. Hmmm George Bush and Dick Cheney. Everybody knows that when you put a Dick and a Bush together you get screwed!

[Ghost Lemur]

Thanks Jim2, I've been waiting to see a well placed Carlin quote.

[MikeL]

There was definitely some good stuff in that movie, but there was also a fair amount of emotive, subjective rubbish that took away from what he was on about.

The "emotive, subjective rubbish" is presumably the parts you disagreed with.
Moore's film is not a "documentary". The fact that the audience is manipulated doesn't invalidate his arguments. There is no objective truth.
To attempt to counter propaganda with anything other than cleverer propaganda is likely to end in failure.

While we have Moore and The Simpsons there is hope for America.

[scumdog]

Quote:"Let's not forget that it was the NRA that campaigned against the banning of teflon coated rounds (so-called 'cop killer' bullets years ago)."

Lou, I think that is one of those myths like "if an M16 bullet hits a fingertip it will shatter the whole arm" and "the 357 magnum will shatter an engine block" (maybe if it's a Honda 50 block!)

I'am prepared to stand corrected re the "teflon coated bullet" thing but I think it was one of those stories started by the media who claimed the bullets were teflon coated to make it easier to penetrate bullet-proof jackets.

[Hitcher]

America is a land of odd a perverse contradictions -- pro-death penalty, anti-abortion being just one.

But the whole "gun" thing over there is a classic example of the folly of trying to solve a "problem" when there isn't general acceptance that there is a problem to be solved. People throw up their hands in horror when they have a Columbine but that only makes some Americans even more determined to fight fire with fire and arm themselves against whatever threats they perceive against their lives. liberty and pursuit of happiness...

[Coldkiwi]

Wierd...

Mr Moore is anti gun, anti bush anti anything except making a shit load of cash for mr Moore... I wonder when he will do an expo on the fast food industry??

well, luckily for your generalism Paul, someones already done one! I think there's a link on here somewhere about it but basically a director forced himself to eat Maccas for breakfast, lunch and dinner for a month while doctors monitored his progress. apparently he got sick as a dog, lost his libido, got massive headaches, tempers, put on nearly 10kg and had to take up smoking again to calm himself. I think the movies called 'supersize me' but they're having trouble finding a film studio to back it because they're all afraid of how much clout macdonalds have! shocker

as for Moore being anti-bush and anti-gun.... well... isn't Bush i kinda PRO-gun and weapons? ...Espcially of the mass destruction kind... even if hes not sure who else might have 'em.... so I guess the two really go hand in hand!!


On the surface anyway, it seems the americans are still more afraid of changing their constitution than they are of letting it become an excuse for their nation to turn itself into desensitised trigger happy paranoids.

I wonder how the suggestion to alter the constitution to 'all citizens shall have a right to apply for a tightly controlled gun licence' would go down over there? I mean Canada seems to be proof that its not the number of guns but who has access to them (and possibly having high powered assault rifles is a little OTT as well... but don't tell them i said so )

[James Deuce]

Thanks Jim2, I've been waiting to see a well placed Carlin quote.

You're welcome.

I was wondering where I could use it.

I love the way Carlin narrates Thomas The Tank Engine. I can hear all sorts of subtext.

[scumdog]

Canada gets mentioned a bit on this thread but it has its having its own gun problems, their laws have toughened up but gun deaths rise and they have started gun registration which has a piss-poor compliance rate plus spiralling costs for a scheme that is floundering at best

[Drunken Monkey]

I'am prepared to stand corrected re the "teflon coated bullet" thing but I think it was one of those stories started by the media who claimed the bullets were teflon coated to make it easier to penetrate bullet-proof jackets.

Quick research indicates there is some legislature in the US specifically banning teflon- or other synthetic- coated ammunition. For example: http://www.davekopel.org/2A/IB/Preem...ckgrounder.htm

I couldn't find anything categorically listing a box of ammo as 'teflon coated'. I can't say I ever noticed such ammo in a gun store either, but I don't look for those kinds of things, and to tell the truth it probably wouldn't be an ideal game hunting round anyway, so stocks would be limited if any.
I have often heard people say that assault rifle ammo is teflon coated. From my personal experience I understand that is complete balls - at least as far as armed forces are concerned: 5.56nato/.223, 7.62nato/.308, 5.54pact and 7.62pact are standard FMJ's = full metal jackets (steel jacketed lead, to be specific). Those four rounds encompass a large number of standard military small arms.
Granted, the cop-killers are probably specifically a handgun load - not too experienced with these. If that was the case, I would wonder why a full metal jacket round would be unavailable for handguns. Might try looking up something for 9mm Parabellum/Luger, 10mm or .45ACP = they're pretty popular handgun calibres.

Further reading: http://matrix.dumpshock.com/raygun/basics/copkill.html

A site search of a fairly popular ammunition manufacturer, 'Federal Cartridges', for the text field 'teflon' returned 0 results.
(http://www.federalcartridge.com/search.asp)

You may be correct there, scumdog.

[scumdog]

Did a bit more research and as usual the media got it wrong, the teflon coated bullets WERE made to penetrate hard surfaces, armour included, however they were made of such an extremely hard alloy that they could not "imbed" in the rifling in gun barrels so a thin metal jacket with a film of teflon was applied to them to enable the rifling to "grip" them and stabilise them for accuracy, amazing how the media can put a different "spin" on things!!!