The firearm thread

[frogfeaturesFZR]

Sorry, don't know.
BTW My 243's got a 3-9 vari on it and 5oo yards is STILL a bloody long way away.
(Of course you can focus the scope to suit your vision. )
As the len's on a good scope can have up to 20 or so coatings on it, I imagine the cost of a specifically ground lens would be prohibitive. Cheaper to get new eyes !

[Wolf]

Cheaper to get new eyes !

When the technology gets to that point, I'll be clamouring to be a test subject...

[Mr Merde]

.....How did you work up the BP loads for the lever? ......., but I can't find any info about loading .44 magnum or other 'standard' guns for BP.

Remember I told that BP was an explosive. You need to have the case filled to the base of the bullet. No air gaps allowed in a BP round.

So for the .44, I basically measured the depth the bullet would seat inside the case and filled the powder to there.

Worked out to about 30 grains by volume of FFG. about 35 grains by volume of FFFg.

When you seat the bullet you need to have it compress the powder about 1/16th to 1/8th of an inch.

This will give you a good load for .44

Now for the strange stuff.

If you remember I mentioned that when you fire a BP round that approx 1/2 of the powder is not burnt but expelled out the barrel in a white cloud.

I thought this a waste so what I have done is drop the amount of BP in my case to 25 gns by volume. I cant leaver an air space so I needed to fill the gap. I used semolina powder. So the powder goes in, on top of that a little semolina powder, then the bullet is seated in the case, compressing the semolina by the required depth whith in turn puts compression on the powder.

Instead of chucking 15gn of powder out the barrel I am now only wasting about 10-12 gns.

All with very little loss of bullet speed.

In my pistol rounds I have dropped the BP even further and only load 19gns by volume of BP, so I am putting 10+ gns of semolina powder on top of that.

When I fire these rounds you can catch the smell of burnt flour sometimes.

BP is very forgiving as long as you realise the nature of the beast. The important thing is that you have no air space and that small amount of compression when seating the bullet.

Hope I have explained things a little.

Chris

[jono035]

Hope I have explained things a little.

Sure have. The full case or partially full case with filler material question was pretty much exactly what I was curious about.

How do the loads compare with the standard smokeless loads? Most of the resources I have found mention that you get much less bullet velocity out of the BP loaded cases but that some of the energy can be regained by raising the bullet weight, but I'm not sure how far you could take that while staying within the maximum pressure specs.

[sAsLEX]

The famous SOG knives are one of the sponsors of the event and donate a stack of their throwing-knives for this stage. The blades are knocked into a block of wood with the blade-edge facing towards the shooter and a piece of white paper is stapled to a board behind the knife. At a distance of 80m and within 30 seconds, the shooter must fire one round at the blade-edge and strike it perfectly so as to split the bullet into two haves and show separate impacts on the paper behind.

Sweeeeeeeet! (said as Jeremy Clarkson! )

The rest below

2008 WORLD SNIPER CHAMPIONSHIPS - HUNGARY

Our sniper in residence Rob, has just returned from the World Sniper Championship in Hungary where he finished up on the podium. He wasn’t intending to do a write-up but I know a lot of you are interested in tactical rifles and enjoy reading Rob’s stuff on Precision Rifle so, I managed to persuade him. Read on…………..I'll get some photos up soon - Vince



7th WORLD SNIPER CHAMPIONSHIPS IN BUDAPEST – HUNGARY

'The Best Of The Best'



I wasn’t going to do a write up on this comp. as looking back through the articles I’ve written this year, it seemed very similar to most of the others but, after speaking to several friends I was convinced that, as it was the official ‘World Sniper Championship’, this was a fitting and worthy subject for the final foreign competition of the year and of course they were right. As usual, names and faces have to be protected so I won’t go into personal details of my fellow competitors but I will try and give you a honest account of the comp.



This past couple of years I’ve shot a fair bit in Europe with both the police and military but without doubt, this comp is the pinnacle of its type within the sniping community. I have known of its existence for some time and long wanted to attend but with over 20 countries invited, places are limited and are strictly by invite and of course only open to military and police/security services.



Fortunately, one week before the competition was due to start, I had a piece of good fortune - an Israeli sniper was short of a partner, my security services clearance had just come through and a friend who was already down to compete put my name forward as a possible stand in. The ‘powers that be’ said ‘yes’ and I was on my way. A short Easyjet flight to Vienna and then a two-hour drive gets you to Budapest, where everyone was billeted in the local police training academy, which was a 30 minute drive to the range.



The range itself is 450m long and 200m wide and is divided down the middle by a concrete wall and surrounded on three sides by 40ft earth berms. All this meant that we were protected from the worst of the wind but when gusts did make it down to us, they were very tricky to read.



The first day started with the usual opening ceremony, flag raising and photo sessions with police and military top brass, then the safety briefing, which with over 20 countries participating was a translator’s nightmare but with English being the designated language for the competition and a very good multi-lingual translator, all went quickly and smoothly.



Day 1: Engage brain & go to your guns!



The first course of fire (COF) was a cold clean-bore shot at two very small air rifle targets (approx 1 ½ inches across) at 100metres. Given that the temperature was 95 degrees Fahrenheit with a humidity close to 50%, I was interested to see what effect it would have on my Diggle range-card settings. Surprisingly, although there was over a 1000ft difference in elevation and a huge difference in temperature, old ‘mean & green’ held true to her original zero - although I did make a balls-up of the first two targets the following four small bullet-patches allowed unlimited sighters and confirmed the error was mine not the rifle’s. With my zero confirmed, the next COF moved us closer.

At 25metres we were presented with a cocktail stick with a flag on it. One round in three seconds with the instruction to break the flag pole! Any hit on the flag would mean minus points! A cock-up on this stage meant that you could be into minus points before you even got on the score board! This ‘minus score’ trend continued throughout the competition.



After a short lunch we moved down to 155 metres and the target was a 50 BMG cartridge-case. Again, one round in 20 seconds - again a very tough call with tons of mirage and 30 other guys to the left and right of you blazing away with everything from 223 up to 300 Win Mag. the necessity to be able to ‘get into your bubble’ was a must. Personally, I had a couple of very unfriendly muzzle-brakes close by but during the COF owing to the high level of concentration required, I was oblivious to them - thank God.



A good solid multi-positional shooting technique is of course a must. Two rounds kneeling and then dropping to prone for the final two shots all in 45 seconds was a good test of speed and pin-point accuracy and that was the name of the game here. Any dropped points and you plummeted faster than a tarts knickers on pay day. Another important aspect of this level of shooting is your own confidence and mental strength, so when you're confronted with four targets at 150 metres, the largest being 1 ½ inch across with a decreasing scoring zone and any bullet hole that is touching the line means you loose all your previous scores is a good test of your faith in your own ability. I screwed this one up too by the way!



A good evening meal on range followed the end of the first day’s shooting and then it was preparation for the night shoot. There were two COF’s at 155m and 203m under the illumination of a hand spotting-lamp and car headlamps. This is type of shooting really tests your scope and an illuminated reticle is a must. The 58mm object lens and 35mm body-tube on my US Optics scope grabs as much light as possible and transmits it to the shooter’s eye. I’ve got to say this scope has served me brilliantly throughout all the comps this year - by that I mean its reliable, the clicks are solid ¼ MOA, no more no less and the zero stays put regardless of abuse or travel. Build-quality is fantastic and the thick body-tube wall doubles-up as a carry-handle when in a rush. The crisp clean reticle is fine enough to pick out the finest detail on a target and includes a great Mil scale to range a target accurately. I use a simple rule when it comes to my scopes – if you can’t see it, you certainly can’t shoot it! When it comes to scopes, get the best you can afford. Never skimp on your glass.



Day 2: Must Try Harder



After the night shoot it was back to base to clean your rifle and sort out your kit for the following day. We had four hours sleep and then we were back out again. With sleep deprivation and jet-lag starting to bite, the day started with long cold-bore shots at 450m. Again, having trust in your equipment and charts meant the difference between hits and misses. The best COF of the day for me was the ‘Karma Sutra’ - well named if you look at the picture! You had to use your partners body to support your rifle for five shots at 180m at a very small inward-scoring target. Just like the Karma Sutra, there were lots of variants in the positions used to do this but I was really happy with ours - my partner had a broad back and by using two of my back-bags I had a kind of shooting bench. He was so still I think he went to sleep at one point - just don’t ask where his head was!



As the morning wore on, the temperature shot back up to 95 degrees but thankfully slightly less humidity, so when will were told that as part of a team-shoot, one guy would run and the other would shoot, my partner who was used to the Israeli desert heat took pity on me and offered to run whilst I did the shooting. I didn’t argue with him.



Both team members start prone and on the word ‘go’, the shooter engages a one-inch clay disc with as many rounds as necessary to break it. When the disc was hit a cover fell away to reveal 20 smiley faces. Meanwhile, the runner runs back 20m to get a picture of the target then runs back to the shooter and tries to describe the correct face! The shooter must then find and identify the face and engage with one round…tough? By the way all that had to be done in 60 seconds. I was very pleased with our efforts on this one - even with an accent and grammar differences, we did complete it successfully. Following this stage, we had an impromptu down-pour of hail, lightning and monsoon type rain which put a brief stop to shooting but not for long.



At the end of the second day, evening meal was again on the range as was weapons cleaning and kit drying then back to our accommodation. By this time, a wash and brush up and a few medicinal beers were in order before catching up on some much needed sleep. By the way, if a group of Russian shooters ever invite for a quick drink don’t go!

[sAsLEX]

The rest......

Day 3: Nearly over!



The final day is only a half-day of shooting but the pressure does not ease off. There were three different COF’s - first a one round, 168m shot at a hens egg - not too hard but then factor in a 10 second time-frame and a 15 degree downhill angle, plus a gusting 5 – 10 mph quarter value wind and it makes the whole thing considerably more difficult.



The second COF was my favourite out of the whole event. The famous SOG knives are one of the sponsors of the event and donate a stack of their throwing-knives for this stage. The blades are knocked into a block of wood with the blade-edge facing towards the shooter and a piece of white paper is stapled to a board behind the knife. At a distance of 80m and within 30 seconds, the shooter must fire one round at the blade-edge and strike it perfectly so as to split the bullet into two haves and show separate impacts on the paper behind. Who the hell thought up this one up? Until I saw it done, I would of said this was nearly impossible but the skill level of the shooters attending meant that around 30% of the field made the shot – outstanding! Don’t try this at home guys as a bad ricochet could end up anywhere.



The final COF was another good one. The targets were a small, medium and full-size clay-pigeons at distances of 136m, 246m and 364m. With the rifle placed down on the firing line and the shooter 10m further behind, on the command run forward and with one round engage one target, run back for the next round and engage the second target and so on, all to be completed within 50 seconds. Once again, speed with pin-point accuracy was the only way to gather points.



The end of shooting meant a big sigh of relief. This was without doubt the toughest competition I’ve ever shot in with some of the smallest targets I’ve ever seen but as the organisers said, it was designed to decide who was ‘The Best of the Best’

The evening was a very grand affair held in the centre of the beautiful city of Budapest on the banks of the Danube with some excellent catering and of course the hard-won trophies were presented. The competition is split into two halves - police and military. The result of the police individual event was 1st Russia 2nd Ukraine and 3rd Macedonia and the team scores were same. The military individual results were 1st Russia, 2nd Russia and 3rd United Kingdom and the teams were 1st Russia, 2nd Hungary and 3rd Czech. rep.



As I mentioned previously in other articles, I’ve shot against the Russian and Ukraine guys before and the standard of all aspects of their shooting is amazing. They don’t have the best kit in the world but the key to their success is a simple one - practice, practice and then more practice! There is a lesson there that we all would do well to heed. For every round I’ve shot this year either in practice or in competition, I’ve also shot ten dry-fires and it's paid off.



Kit Review



Before I close I would like to say a big thanks to all involved in getting the rifle together this year without which none of the comps would have been possible and for all those who have asked about my ‘Green & Mean’ rifle, here is the spec.



Action - Surgeon (probably the best tactical action on the market) with built-in Picatinny scope-rail and recoil lug. It also represent great value for money.



Barrel - Kreiger (no explanation necessary!)



Moderator - Stealth sound moderators from ‘ The Whole Shooting Match Ltd’ this is the best mod. I’ve had so far. It’s designed to be stripped and cleaned, no difference on shift in impact and lighter than most other over-barrel designs.



Stock - McMillan A5 Tactical (again no explanation necessary - the best)



Scope -US Optics SN3 5x25 Tpal - as I said above, just a rock solid scope, dependable and no dramas. Thanks to John Williams and all the guys at USO for making the ret. I designed for the scope and getting it put Together and out to me in time for the deadline.



And finally, a big thanks to Vince for putting it all together for me with a weeks notice!!



Enjoy and be safe

Rob



PS - Don’t try to reproduce any of courses of fire detailed here as they may result in injury or death

[sAsLEX]

Smoe neat discussion here on some different cartridges following on from our loading demo the other day

http://www.freewebs.com/precisionrif...cartridges.htm

[jono035]

Interesting stuff Alex...

Chris: Fired the first of those 9mm rounds tonight and they're a bit hotter than the factory American Eagle stuff I usually shoot, that's for sure! Fired the first string of 5 and got a few comments about the fiery muzzle blast. Had another guy there recognise it as ammo from Serious Shooters? Either way, good stuff, fun to shoot and I put about half in the black at 25m so all good. Still have most of the bag, will keep whittling through it alternately with my normal ammo.

Thanks again!

Also got to have a play with a guys Uberti Cattleman in .357... Beautiful pistol to fire and feels great in the hand, nice tight action and the rear sight is just a small groove cut into the top strap, very understated. Talked to a guy who had recently sold his S&W 629 (bugger...) and is currently trying to replace it with a Taurus Raging Bull in .44 magnum, so may have to have a try with both now to see which I prefer!

[sAsLEX]

Perfect for those pesky spiders!

[Indiana_Jones]

lol wicked.

-Indy

[jono035]

Perfect for those pesky spiders!

There was a guy playing with a box of those at the range a few months back, pretty random looking. Apparently those in a .22 pistol are good as snake-protection...

[KREWZR]

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/sh...d.php?t=105316

[Indiana_Jones]

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/sh...d.php?t=105316

Done

-Indy

[The Pastor]

Reloaders are the nicest people on the face of the earth. They share many common quality traits. They hate waste and cannot bear to throw away a perfectly good cartridge case simply because it's empty. Besides, it's impolite to leave a mess for someone else to pick up. They enjoy working with their hands, like to shoot, love the great outdoors and expect that what they buy will work as advertised. An unusual amount of reloaders are doctors, lawyers and business people. Persons reload because they like it, not because they can't afford to buy factory ammunition. I am proud to be a member of the fraternity

[Indiana_Jones]

"13/08/09
MSSA Changes - Advertising Complaint
In response to Police spending public money on misleading advertising in regard to their unqualified opinion concerning their preferred interpretation of a military pattern free standing pistol grip, The National Shooters Association has lodged a formal complaint with the Independent Police Conduct Authority (IPCA). The NSA believes that spending public money on advertising an interpretation that Police have been told, by the High Court, has no legal standing, demonstrates arrogant contempt for the judicial process, the authority of the High Court and the obligation for Police to exercise a duty of care with entrusted public money.

At this stage the complaint has been filed (12th August 2009). We anticipate a response from the IPCA soon."

-Indy