The 800s are faster!

[denill]

OK, couple of things, the weight limits have not changed from the 990cc 2006 bikes and the new 800cc 2007 limits. Contrary to popular opinion Honda do not write the rules for MotoGP, thay have a say as a major manufacturer but do not have an over riding vote etc.
Most paddock opinion suggests that the Ducati since its appereance in MotoGP has had the most powerful engine, again not Honda. Whats your info source, TonyB?
The main instigator for the change was a backlash after Dajiro Kato's death, suggesting the bikes were getting too powerful. Interestingly since then the electrical and engine management systems have managed to get the bikes way more easier to ride with the ability to limit power in cornesr and under hard acceleration as neccesary. When was the last time you saw a wicked high side? Most accidents now are a lose on the front end on corner entry.
I reckon though that if a 800 was racing against the 990, the 990 is more likely to win, even if the 800 has a quicker lap time. I'm picking the 990 would still be faster in a straight line and would hold the 800 up in the corners, any advantage that the 800 may hold in higher cornering speed would be negated by the 990 being in its way.

Oh, 800cc bikes rock.....

If a change of capacity had not occurred, the 990s would be posting faster times than are currently being notched in 2007 testing. Plus the way forward for the 990s would have been the same path taken by the 500 smokers - making them more tractable (ie rider friendly) and in so doing, making them safer - as Gav wrote.

But for whatever the reason the fact is: That 800 times are just as fast if not faster than the '06 990s. And the season hasn't even started. Future development is going to ensure that these little buggers are going to be quick!!
And I personally don't think that was the reason for the change of capacity - in fact quite the opposite.

[denill]

Day 3 at Qatar:


1. Dani Pedrosa, Repsol Honda - 1'55.471

2. John Hopkins, Rizla Suzuki - 1'55.825

3. Valentino Rossi, Yamaha Factory - 1'55.954

4. Alex Hofmann, Pramac d'Antin - 1'56.315

5. Colin Edwards, Yamaha Factory - 1'56.371

6. Randy de Puniet, Kawasaki Racing - 1'56.753

7. Loris Capirossi, Ducati Marlboro - 1'56.807

8. Casey Stoner, Ducati Marlboro - 1'56.834

9. Alex Barros, Pramac d'Antin - 1'56.950

10. Marco Melandri, Honda Gresini - 1'56.980

11. Shinya Nakano, Konica Minolta Honda - 1'56.980

12. Makoto Tamada, Dunlop Yamaha Tech3 - 1'57.232

13. Toni Elias, Honda Gresini - 1'57.246

14. Nicky Hayden, Repsol Honda - 1'57.269

15. Chris Vermeulen, Rizla Suzuki - 1'57.365

16. Kenny Roberts, Team Roberts - 1'57.408

17. Carlos Checa, Honda LCR - 1'57.497

18. Sylvain Guintoli, Dunlop Yamaha Tech3 - 1'58.379

19. Shinichi Ito, Ducati TTT - 1'58.974

20. Andrew Pitt, Ilmor GP - 2'00.455

21. Olivier Jacque, Kawasaki Racing - 2'02.081

22. Jeremy McWilliams, Ilmor GP - 2'02.612

[Crasherfromwayback]

And I see Hopkins has half fucked himself with a massive highside!
There's gonna be a whole lot more of that with the new bikes I'd say.
Faster cornering speed = greater flight trajectory!

[JayRacer37]

And I see Hopkins has half fucked himself with a massive highside!
There's gonna be a whole lot more of that with the new bikes I'd say.
Faster cornering speed = greater flight trajectory!

Yeah...when was the last time anyone managed to hi-side a MotoGP bike?? That Hopkins is quite a rider..who else could manage it??

[Cleve]

Day 3 at Qatar:

4. Alex Hofmann, Pramac d'Antin - 1'56.315

I find Hoffman in pre season to be the surprise package...

[Crasherfromwayback]

Yeah...when was the last time anyone managed to hi-side a MotoGP bike?? That Hopkins is quite a rider..who else could manage it??

Casey Stoner & Dani Pedrosa for starters....last year on the 990's that were less likely to do it....

[Crasherfromwayback]

I find Hoffman in pre season to be the surprise package...

Yeah old Barros has been going pretty well too....same team.
Did you see, or maybe I should say do you remember Barros vs Rossi at Assen when the 4 strokes first came along? Barros on his NSR 500 taking it to Rossi on his RCV? That was quite possibly the best I've ever seen anyone ride a 500 round there!

[JayRacer37]

Casey Stoner & Dani Pedrosa for starters....last year on the 990's that were less likely to do it....

Casey never managed a hi-side, he always fell off the inside by rolling the throttle closed at EXTREME lean angles. Did anyone else see the MotoGP.com morning practice session coverage from Sachenring? Stoner crashed at the 5th gear right over the hill cause he freaked out mid-corner, closed the gas, and loaded the front so hard it folded...same for Mugello race...Whoops..
And Dani's race crashes came from sticking his nose up the inside of people right at the apex...many times I thought he was going to take someone out by doing it, when he did it was freiky Nicky...Do'h! Someone give that man a slapping!! Pete Benson (Nicky hayden's crew cheif looked ready too...)
I, seriously, can't remember a time since 2003-ish that a MotoGP bike had a proper, power-on, exiting the corner hi-side. Can anyone enlighten me/provide an example???

[Crasherfromwayback]

Casey never managed a hi-side, he always fell off the inside by rolling the throttle closed at EXTREME lean angles.

I, seriously, can't remember a time since 2003-ish that a MotoGP bike had a proper, power-on, exiting the corner hi-side. Can anyone enlighten me/provide an example???

Yep....I did...you just can't have been watching the same action I saw.
I'm pretty sure it was Mugello that Stoner high sided out of......BIG FASHION, and Pedrosa lost the front, saved it, then high sided BIG TIME during practice at Sepang.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Oh yeah...and our man Hopkins at the 'Sack-Ring' was also pretty violent...AND off the top!

[JayRacer37]

Yep....I did...you just can't have been watching the same action I saw.
I'm pretty sure it was Mugello that Stoner high sided out of......BIG FASHION, and Pedrosa lost the front, saved it, then high sided BIG TIME during practice at Sepang.

The TV footage commentary at Mugello said Casey's crash was a hi-side, and the bike bouced pretty good when it hit the dirt, but Italian TV had a diffrent angle camera on the entry to riviata 2 (the place he crashed) and it was lossing the front rolling the gas as he ran wide-ish...as per normal.

Yea Pedrosa's hi-side at Sepang practice was pretty good..but that was an entry thing as he came into the mid corner...it came round on him off the gas, so the TC couldn't save him. Can you remember when, after the introduction of engine managements, that a MotoGP rider has been flicked ON THE GAS? Cause I just can't. And the way Hopper's crash was described that was what happend, on the exit, on the throttle. Did the computer's malfunction?? Will we ever know...????

[Crasherfromwayback]

The TV footage commentary at Mugello said Casey's crash was a hi-side, and the bike bouced pretty good when it hit the dirt, but Italian TV had a diffrent angle camera on the entry to riviata 2 (the place he crashed) and it was lossing the front rolling the gas as he ran wide-ish...as per normal.

Yea Pedrosa's hi-side at Sepang practice was pretty good..but that was an entry thing as he came into the mid corner...it came round on him off the gas, so the TC couldn't save him. Can you remember when, after the introduction of engine managements, that a MotoGP rider has been flicked ON THE GAS? Cause I just can't. And the way Hopper's crash was described that was what happend, on the exit, on the throttle. Did the computer's malfunction?? Will we ever know...????

I'll have to view it again Jay, but from what I saw....he was spat off the top.
Pedrosa's was a weird one....almost looked like he'd cased it out on the ripple strip....tucked the front...then tried to save it with gas......then got spat off the top side.

Either way, I still think we're gonna see plenty more 'take offs' this year.
They've still got all of the electronic help of course, but you of all people will know that when you're relying on pure corner speed to go fast...highsides are waiting for you.....

I gather the way to go fast on a 990 (unless it was the underpowered Suzuki) was 'point and squirt'......not really highside material. But when you're on the edge of the tyre and cornering at insane speeds....and trying to get the good 'drive' on.....a-la the 800's......well....lets see!

[JayRacer37]

I'll have to view it again Jay, but from what I saw....he was spat off the top.
Pedrosa's was a weird one....almost looked like he'd cased it out on the ripple strip....tucked the front...then tried to save it with gas......then got spat off the top side.

Either way, I still think we're gonna see plenty more 'take offs' this year.
They've still got all of the electronic help of course, but you of all people will know that when you're relying on pure corner speed to go fast...highsides are waiting for you.....

I gather the way to go fast on a 990 (unless it was the underpowered Suzuki) was 'point and squirt'......not really highside material. But when you're on the edge of the tyre and cornering at insane speeds....and trying to get the good 'drive' on.....a-la the 800's......well....lets see!

Yea here's hoping mate..bring back the riders riding 'em!! Stoner's Mugello biff was on the entry to the corner. riviata 2, up the hill. he did it when he got off the gas. it may have spun the back round, but it wan't a crash where he defeated the computers engine control to have it. Ohh....riding the 600's on knackered rear's (really knackered...those at SI nationals will know), i know all about edge grip at lotsa lean..or lack thereof...

[k14]

Pedrosa's high side at sepang was cause he cut the corner too much and his knee dug into the dirt off the side of the track which pitched the rear into the air and then threw him off.

[JayRacer37]

Pedrosa's high side at sepang was cause he cut the corner too much and his knee dug into the dirt off the side of the track which pitched the rear into the air and then threw him off.

yeap, so it wasn't somthing the Electronic's should/could have saved?