Criticisms of CYPS?

[NotaGoth]

Woah! That sounds like a nightmare!!

I sincerely hope that doesn't go on anymore, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was still the way they operate.

Maybe in a few years time there'll be a huge public scandal, like the abuse in the religious orphanages and homes in the 1950s that is only coming to light now.

I suppose part of the difficulty is that children are involved, and most kids are not really able to stand up and say "this isn't right".

Think like a child... Approach a child in that way and they'll start thinking that if they just say it (even if its untrue) that they'll just leave you alone and let you go home to mummy and daddy.. I know thats what I started to think when they still wouldn't leave me alone, even after I told them no that it wasn't true

I agree with your last comment also.. Its a tough one.. I admit that

I still stand by my thoughts though.. Even though I was young I still remember it like it was yesterday.. I hope I never ever have to deal with them again

[u4ea]

Had experience with them as a child also.There were alligations of an extended family member who was molesting us.Then SWD didnt pursue it.I had allegations put against me a few yrs back as I was recovering from operation and some family members saw me as unfit and instead of offering support rang CYFS.I neally died through it all and no one listned.Ended up going into hiding for 2 weeks with my son untill they did a proper investigation.Of late the sex abuse claims are being investigated by CYFS (after 20 yrs) and the family members are going to be accountable.I never rang CYFS but certain behaviours are proving to be their own demise.

Some things are just not black and white

[mangell6]

CYF/P are not responsible for Societies ills, they are the ones who have to clean up the mess. The individuals within the organisations will get it wrong and they will also get it write (sick).

Politics and Media advertising play a large part in the way the organisation is run. Add the "blame" culture to the mix and the organisation can never do anything right.

[MSTRS:Me]

CYF/P are not responsible for Societies ills, they are the ones who have to clean up the mess. ...

That is how it should be.
Unfortunately, this is not how it is with CYPS all the time. There are just too many examples of zealotry from them to think that they are the ambulance at the bottom, when too often they are the top doing some pushing (over) of their own. Ten small successes of theirs do not balance out one screwup by one or more of their staff.
Remember, the screwups leave people who will carry the mental/emotional scars for life, to say nothing of the paper record that may come back to bite in later years.

[Sanx]

Yeah but they are still getting medical clinics and clean water.. a fair trade off I would have thought to have a church erected too? Unless the medical clinic is situated inside the church and the water fountain in the inner sanctum, I'm sure they still have the decision making powers to not chose to go to the church should they not want too.... not so with clean water.
If you have any better ideas to get them the aid that these people are providing, then I'm sure they would welcome it.

(Sorry for the off-topic reply)

Well, how's about the manner in which Oxfam, the Red Cross, Save The Children, Tear Fund, UNICEF or any of the other secular aid agencies do it? They don't tie aid to religious adherence.

People like Medecin Sans Frontieres (Doctors Without Borders) go into any country in the world that needs them and set up emergency medical clinics, again without expecting the people benefiting to abandon their beliefs to get help. MSF especially have a reputation for providing excellent medical care regardless of the race, colour or religion of the people concerned.

[jazbug5]

What I also love is people who have NEVER lived in welfare home commenting on what they think goes on....

(not directing this at you oldrider)

Hmm. Well, it could just as well be directed at me, and I suppose it's a fair criticism as I managed, personally, to stay out of one. But only just, and only by hiding in another country until I turned 16.
I may not know about care homes in NZ, but I know enough about the ones where I'm from in Scotland to know that I'm grateful to have escaped those- and having heard some things about NZ homes, I am guilty of assuming they must be pretty similar. Making that assumption was out of line, and I apologise.
I have strong opinions on the Scottish version because I have several close friends who were not so lucky, and all of them got into drugs and other forms of trouble while in the system. My best mate's daughter got into drugs, stealing and prostitution as a direct result of going through it. Seven years on (she started this life when only 14) she still isn't clean, and last year nearly had to have her arm cut off at the shoulder. Knowing my mate as I do, I cannot believe that if they hadn't first taken the daughter from her when she was small as a first resort and as a consequence of listening to malicious gossip, she would not be far better off.

Anyway, I apologise to anyone I may have offended.

[Hitcher]

At the risk of offending lots of people, it appears that there is a mood growing whereby people are not allowed to post their opinions about anything they have no direct or personal knowledge or experience of. Except, of course, the use of written English.

[Str8 Jacket]

Hmm. Well, it could just as well be directed at me, and I suppose it's a fair criticism as I managed, personally, to stay out of one....

No, not directed at you. I was directing this at the general population of NZ.
Let me tell ya'll a bit about me..... I was removed from my parents at a young age. I was taken from my school one morning and taken to my parents house where I was given 15 mins or so to get my stuff. I was soo very young and scared that I think all I took was a teddy bear a pic of my family. Only a handful of clothing. I was then delivered to my new home by my so called social worker. She unloaded the car and then left me. I only really saw her each time I was taken to a new home. I went through many homes, ive lost count of how many.... Most of the foster parents were never that interested. Hell, usually you were one of up to 10 kids living in the house! I was a pretty lonely messed up kid who was badly teased at school because I was covered in eczma. None of my foster parents ever got me any medical help for this and quite often it would get so bad that I would stink. I only have very bad memories ofliving in foster care so I wont bore you with the details....
At the age of 15 I was put on the independant youth benefit and I decided to stay at school. I thought that I could make something of myself. Unfortunately with no support I failed School Cert and then had to drop out of school in 6th form as I couldnt afford to pay my school fees. So I became a bum. I slept on the streets, sniffed solvents, drank meths and basically spent a year getting as far from reality as I could. A nice man came and saved me one day. He gave me an apprenticeship and basically helped me get clean. He taught me how to read and write again and most importantly he taught me how to get on with people. I was really lucky cause I could be dead today.
This is why I get upset when others judge people. You never know where people have been in life and just what they have overcome. As for CYFS I was let down by them. But I was lucky, unlike alot of others....

I really think/ know that something needs to be done. I just wish I knew what!

[Ocean1]

At the risk of offending lots of people, it appears that there is a mood growing whereby people are not allowed to post their opinions about anything they have no direct or personal knowledge or experience of. Except, of course, the use of written English.

What, complaints about public opinion trends from a spin doctor?

At the risk of overstepping the boundaries of my own field of expertise can I tentatively suggest that the reaction may have been more to do with a want of sensitivity?

I have a great deal of respect for advanced practitioners of any form of communication, particularly the written word. This topic however is the source of a great deal of pain for some. There are endless alternative opportunities to comment on the communication skills of others which may elicit a more reasonable response, may even perhaps produce an improvement in those skills you seek to promote.

A nice man came and saved me one day. He gave me an apprenticeship and basically helped me get clean. He taught me how to read and write again and most importantly he taught me how to get on with people. I was really lucky cause I could be dead today.
This is why I get upset when others judge people. You never know where people have been in life and just what they have overcome. As for CYFS I was let down by them. But I was lucky, unlike alot of others....

I really think/ know that something needs to be done. I just wish I knew what!

Well done that man.

Perhaps in an ideal world it would be less difficult for such men to do what he did.

[Str8 Jacket]

Well done that man.

Perhaps in an ideal world it would be less difficult for such men to do what he did.

Yep, he was an angel!

Sometimes a little compassion can go a long way. Often its not what people say, its what they do for others. Its easy to tell someone that they need to change but what seems easy to others, some people genuinely dont or cant understand. Does this make them less of a person?

[Dilligaf]

. You only have to look at 'aid' agencies like WorldVision and Christian Aid who tie in provision of medical services to village kids getting baptised for a very real demonstration. One other aid agency, the name of which I've forgotten, boasts about how they build schools and medical clinics and install clean water supply equipment, but completely fail to mention that the very first thing they do is build a church in each town.

Sorry I couldn't let this one go past.... care to give me any ideas where I can find out the facts behind what you say. Spent a long time this morning looking for evidence of this... Have friends who work overseas for one of these companies.... funnily enough they speak of building wells, not baptising unsuspecting children. I could ask them for you though.... Although I do remember that they don't always employ Christians... somehow doesn't seem to tie in with what you say... of course they could have again conveniently forgotten to mention that on orientation day, it's baptism day too.

(Sorry for the off-topic reply)

Well, how's about the manner in which Oxfam, the Red Cross, Save The Children, Tear Fund, UNICEF or any of the other secular aid agencies do it? They don't tie aid to religious adherence.
.

Well I'd be checking my sources... or perhaps not linking all Christians together. Tear Fund would be very interested to find out it was considered "secular".

[SARGE]

BOUNCE to get more input on this and less on the cut-out thread

[ManDownUnder]

I needed to understand CYFS recently - got put in touch with a friend of a friend in Welliwood (Jo - for them that know) and she was brilliant.

I've had reason to cross their path a couple of times but in every case I have come to the conclusion they are overworked and do a bitch of a job that no-one really seems to be capable of for sustained periods (hence the lack of really senior and experienced people).

I also expect the perception is that they're only ever going to get it wrong because what they do is inherantly "interfering" with a family, either in structure or dynamic... and let's face it - who wants a State Agency in the middle of their affairs?

I can't think of an instance where I've heard "YAY CYFS" or "I can't wait till CYFS get here!". It's like waiting for an ambulance. The reason for calling is never a good one.

Govt needs to put more funding in, lighten the workload on the individuals, give them better pay and demand they are better qualified. Same for teachers, nurses, and Police. More people, better pay, and higher standards expected.

Take money out of the pockets of the bludgers, and make prison less "comfy". Save that cash and pour it back into society through those vehicles.

[SARGE]

I needed to understand CYFS recently - got put in touch with a friend of a friend in Welliwood (Jo - for them that know) and she was brilliant.

I've had reason to cross their path a couple of times but in every case I have come to the conclusion they are overworked and do a bitch of a job that no-one really seems to be capable of for sustained periods (hence the lack of really senior and experienced people).

I also expect the perception is that they're only ever going to get it wrong because what they do is inherantly "interfering" with a family, either in structure or dynamic... and let's face it - who wants a State Agency in the middle of their affairs?

I can't think of an instance where I've heard "YAY CYFS" or "I can't wait till CYFS get here!". It's like waiting for an ambulance. The reason for calling is never a good one.

Govt needs to put more funding in, lighten the workload on the individuals, give them better pay and demand they are better qualified. Same for teachers, nurses, and Police. More people, better pay, and higher standards expected.

Take money out of the pockets of the bludgers, and make prison less "comfy". Save that cash and pour it back into society through those vehicles.

dead on again Nigel

would you prefer to coddle a prisoner or intervene before he becomes one?


how much to house an inmate per year?

how much does dole cost per year?

how much to have a trained, qualified social worker per year ?


pick one

[avgas]

I'd have to say the problem doesnt exist with CYPS, sadly it the whole system.
I once had a protection order between myself and my father, even though i was living in his house, organised by my mother (who wasn't living in the house).....and i was never consulted.
No one dots the 'i's or crosses the 't's in this place. Its bullshit.
Don't even get me started on the dole bludgers i've met that live in million dollar houses....that they own.