Thank you GPS

**spudchucka** · 4th October 2004, 21:02

Originally Posted by Yamahamaman

Hmm, I would have thought that the GPS would report an average speed as it it only accesses the transponders on a fixed time rate. Dunno - could be wrong, probably am.

It would be interesting to know what "expert" evidence was called to prove the infalability of the device or whether the judge just took the technology on face value. Perhaps he owns the same model and just had a really good read of the owners manual?

**scumdog** · 4th October 2004, 21:12

Originally Posted by spudchucka

It would be interesting to know what "expert" evidence was called to prove the infalability of the device or whether the judge just took the technology on face value. Perhaps he owns the same model and just had a really good read of the owners manual?

Them old fart types are easily impressed by "technology", hope they are equally embarrassed when it is all refuted :confused2

**spudchucka** · 4th October 2004, 21:21

Originally Posted by scumdog

Them old fart types are easily impressed by "technology", hope they are equally embarrassed when it is all refuted :confused2

We've had one of those types make a few horrendously embarressing boo boo's, he's working another town now.

A couple of years ago when things were really beserk we got a couple of your Sth Island types up for a while. They were like a pair of hanging judges, the sentences were actually realistic, didn't last long though.

**scumdog** · 4th October 2004, 21:30

Originally Posted by spudchucka

We've had one of those types make a few horrendously embarressing boo boo's, he's working another town now.

A couple of years ago when things were really beserk we got a couple of your Sth Island types up for a while. They were like a pair of hanging judges, the sentences were actually realistic, didn't last long though.

Yeah SC, the guys that come down from up north tell me the the judges here are more realistic - up north a (serious) 'ASSAULTS POLICE" gets you a "convicted and discharged" - W.T.F!! - here we shoot them (I wish).

**spudchucka** · 5th October 2004, 07:37

Originally Posted by scumdog

Yeah SC, the guys that come down from up north tell me the the judges here are more realistic - up north a (serious) 'ASSAULTS POLICE" gets you a "convicted and discharged" - W.T.F!! - here we shoot them (I wish).

A mate of mine had a guy "Plead Guilty" to a charge of attempted burglary, the judge discharged him without conviction. WTF is up with that?

**marty** · 5th October 2004, 07:47

average speed is something that i have had used on me in court - the old 'it took me 1 hour to drive 100kms your honour - i didn't break the speed limit'. fortunately the judge saw right thru that one. (although maybe in the south island where there's no corners......)
the number of instances where the *accuracy* of gps could be used as a defence is so small and wanky, it's not worth getting all excited about. it's like someone saying 'but i had my cruise set at 109.' TFB mate - the ticket is for 'exceeding 100km/h - it's only the amount over that we're arguing about. the 10km/h discretion is just that - discretion. i doubt if you'll find it written anywhere. in aussie it's 5k over. it'll be that here soon too i reckon

**vifferman** · 5th October 2004, 07:50

Wish I had a reason to get off my ticket from Saturday. The cop's writing was so scribbly I hoped something would prove to be illegible and allow me an 'out'. But, in the final analysis:

I've been a persistent law-breaker for years, so I can't complain.
The $300 fine averages out at less than $10/year, so I can't complain.
Earlier in the day, I'd been going faster, so I can't complain.
It was a wake-up call to be more careful, and less cavalier about the way I ride/drive, so I can't complain.

So, I'm not going to bleat about it. The speed limits here and there are a bit silly, as is the focus on speed (perhaps to the detriment of other driving offences), but as I've said before, the problem with NZ drivers is attitude, and I've demonstrated that my attitude is not a sensible or pragmatic one in this instance (and in others), so I'm determined to be more sensible in future.

**Blakamin** · 5th October 2004, 07:53

Originally Posted by marty

in aussie it's 5k over. it'll be that here soon too i reckon

In Victoria its 2k.

and SD, they DO shoot them there

**jrandom** · 5th October 2004, 08:24

I can't speak for every model of GPS, but those based on the SiRF (www.sirf.com) chipset report speed and position every second. 'Speed' is a naïve calculation based on the distance from the last position reported. So, if you were 30 meters away a second ago, it will report your speed as 108kph.

This calculation is made in two dimensions only, so as soon as a gradient is introduced, your actual velocity starts to differ from the GPS-reported speed. The reason for this is that GPS altitude is less accurate than horizontal position, so if you factored the third dimension into speed calculations you would end up on the whole with a general degradation in the accuracy of reported speed, rather than an improvement.

And re. faking GPS logs, the whole point would be that a faked log wouldn't be distinguishable from the real thing. Proving the possibility of that in Court, as Spud said, would eliminate the usefulness of GPS data as evidence. The actual question of whether a defendant modified the logs would become moot, since you could never prove that they *didn't*.

**Pwalo** · 5th October 2004, 09:56

Originally Posted by firestormer

Wish I had a reason to get off my ticket from Saturday. The cop's writing was so scribbly I hoped something would prove to be illegible and allow me an 'out'. But, in the final analysis:

I've been a persistent law-breaker for years, so I can't complain.
The $300 fine averages out at less than $10/year, so I can't complain.
Earlier in the day, I'd been going faster, so I can't complain.
It was a wake-up call to be more careful, and less cavalier about the way I ride/drive, so I can't complain.

So, I'm not going to bleat about it. The speed limits here and there are a bit silly, as is the focus on speed (perhaps to the detriment of other driving offences), but as I've said before, the problem with NZ drivers is attitude, and I've demonstrated that my attitude is not a sensible or pragmatic one in this instance (and in others), so I'm determined to be more sensible in future.

Yeah I feel the same. I've only been pinged once on the bike for doing 122 last year. (I'm still not sure if it's that easy to pick a bike as a target against background traffic?)

It was probably a timely reminder. Still amazes me how fast the commuter traffic travels in Wgtn though. 110-115 on the m/ways and 35-45 on the Petone foreshore. Another crackdown coming up soon?

**rodgerd** · 5th October 2004, 10:45

Originally Posted by firestormer

I've been a persistent law-breaker for years, so I can't complain.
The $300 fine averages out at less than $10/year, so I can't complain.
Earlier in the day, I'd been going faster, so I can't complain.
It was a wake-up call to be more careful, and less cavalier about the way I ride/drive, so I can't complain.

So, I'm not going to bleat about it.

Oh, come now. What's with this "accepting responsibility for your actions" and "accepting the law is what it is". You should be out there like Lou and co, flinging shit at other people!

**Lou Girardin** · 6th October 2004, 05:50

Originally Posted by spudchucka

The same guidlines for radar use are used here. Its very easy to pick the fast vehicle when one is clearly travelling quicker than the others but when there is only a slight difference, say 100 - 115 it is a lot more difficult to ID the fast driver. Thats where laser is more effective. The guidlines also state that when there is doubt as to which was the fast vehicle then discretion should be used.

Discretion!
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah.

**marty** · 6th October 2004, 06:35

discretion has worked both ways for me lou - obviously cops can pick the wankers, and ticket them for all they can

**scumdog** · 6th October 2004, 07:02

Originally Posted by marty

discretion has worked both ways for me lou - obviously cops can pick the wankers, and ticket them for all they can

Good point Marty, plus if the cop used discretion and decided not to stop you Lou, how would you know he HAS used discretion??????

BTW, I am expecting a flood of 'thank-you' letters from all the greatful motorists I 'flashed' yesterday to let them know they were going a bit faster than the speed limit. - yeah right, like that's going to happen!!!!
Never met anybody yet that says 'I was flashed by a neat sort cop coming the other way when I was speeding', more like 'I was doing X speed and the bastard gave me a ticket' (qu'ell surprise!)