A sense of civic duty

[F5 Dave]

So there I am in a café quaffing my lunch with an extravagant soft drink & treat slice of fudge that I don’t really need reading the local rag (Hutt News).

They are on about the foodbank on one page & the next about pokie machines. Lower hutt recording one of the worst amounts spent on pokies, ~ $77 for every man women & child over a 3 month period. Obviously over a far smaller number of people this is a large problem raking money from those least able to afford it.

This is a form of escapism, in a similar vein to drinking, drug abuse and smoking. I could get myself in a better place ‘if I could only win Lotto’ mentality.

Shopping for entertainment absorbs people’s money. Do they really need those ‘things’? A further article is on the loss of jobs at Dux plant. Manufacturing is getting uneconomic in New Zealand.

Do we really need the cheap goods we so crave when waved in our face? Was throwing off the tariffs and protectionism of the 70s the right thing to do?

That is a hard question. One it is hard to reverse now the tiger is out of the cage.


Further thinking is at least how can I help? How can We help?

So I walked back to work waiting for an Epiphany. It didn’t come.

Can I help people with poor budgeting skills? Do we really need another ‘Money Man’ except one with no financial qualifications or experience only armed with an opinionated view of what people spend too much money on? Probably not.

It does grate me that people are being harvested for their hard earned money without fully appreciating the implications of their actions.

Which brings me back to the gambling thing I guess. I am angry at the politicians who let this sort of thing be introduced despite the problem gambling assoc screaming the troubles it would cause.

Then there are the claims that it brings in money for sporting charities etc. Oh bollocks! Only a small percentage of the take & these gains are vastly outstripped by the money extracted from the same community. Well actually the sporting clubs are probably a lot better heeled than the victims caught up in the gambling spiral.

So how do I, or possibly we, attack the current situation? I don’t think letters to the editor or local politician are going to make sod all difference.

[Hitcher]

Defending pokie machines on the basis that they provide a valuable source of income for communities, is a bit like defending tobacco products on the basis of the bountiful taxation revenues these contribute. Both arguments are facile.

New Zealand has allowed itself to be badgered into accepting pokie machines and casinos on the basis that these are signs of some sort of grown-up society. Bollocks. Pokie machines and casinos are designed to take money off people. That is their sole basis for existance. Both perform this in a manner designed to provide some sort of "excitement" for those being fleeced, in a manner not dissimilar from betting on sporting events or racehorses and dogs.

Gambling takes money away from members of our society who are least able to afford it. For many a big win is their only way out of their current circumstances. Unfortunately the actuarial odds of such an eventuality are stacked heavily against them.

What do we do about it? Start a movement to get them banned. If a couple of whingeing tree-huggers can make enough noise to stop flouride being added to drinking water, surely getting rid of publicly endorsed and regulated gambling shouldn't be too hard (Insert Tui poster here).

[jimbo600]

This shit is far too heavy for a Fri afternoon.

A more fitting discussion would be what gets you pissed quicker? Beer or wine?

[Paul in NZ]

Hmmm... I got abused by a clever guy the other day for criticising the importation of used cars from japan (despite owning one) and the sleazy tactics used to sell the things to people who cannot afford them...

I was assured that his last conversation with an MP was that access to decent, reliable cars had improved the health of poor people because it's easier for them to get to the hospital now... 'Why you can purchase a good used car for $3,000' he assured me...

This is true - I just purchased a nice reliable used car for $1,350 off trademe....BUT - I had cash and thats not what poor people have is it? No - they get sold stuff like twin turbo subaru wagons for $6K on HP that will cost them $10K when its paid off... Or an SUV that has horrendous tyre costs and fuel bills... But it never will be paid off because it will break down and cost too much to fix... Hell - a tune up is more than they can afford so they end up with a flash looking but unreliable car and are worse off....

It seems people are being rewarded for preying on the underclass.... This is NOT the kiwi way!

[007XX]

Gambling is an addiction which derives from a lack of self control of the individual affected.

Whether removing pokies will fix it, I don't think so.

I abborh gambling...wasting even 20c in a machine makes my skin crawl...
But just like any addictions, you decide to start it by "having just a go" and if you don't keep it in check it'll get out of hand.

It comes down to the individual and him or her alone to control it, not the government.

[Paul in NZ]

This shit is far too heavy for a Fri afternoon.

A more fitting discussion would be what gets you pissed quicker? Beer or wine?

Spirits.... definately.... Years of research got into that!

But! What gives you the worst hangover?

[Paul in NZ]

I abborh gambling...wasting even 20c in a machine makes my skin crawl....

I bet I hate it more than you do....

[Big Dave]

"I went to gamblers anonymous - they gave me 5 to 1 on 'I wouldn't make it.'"

[ManDownUnder]

Do exactly as you have done.

To restrict the ability of people top gamble is simply going to make it more attractive to some (I can't HAAAVE IT... I WAAAAANT IT!!!!!!). And it's going to rile others who see their freedoms being revoked (and I in turn agree with them).

The education of people about the dangers of gambling (smoking, speeding, drinking, etc etc etc) needs to be a focus, along with the highlighting of failure stories. That's the bit where NZ is too nicey nice.

Get people that have lost their homes, families, saving etc and highlight their stories. Show people the bad side of gambling (smoking drinking speeding etc). Really drum it home.

People need to make an informed choice in order to maintain their freedom. In order to do that they need both sides of the argument, not just the allure of Sky City "The most fun place in New Zealand". It should be the most certain place to lose your money in New Zealand.

The fact they get big and rich by stacking the odds against the punters should kinds ring a few bells, but human nature is such that a small expected loss with the possibility of a big win is more attractive than a small expected win with the prospect of a big loss.

Think about it - if you bought a Lotto ticket with the expected profit of $0.90 per ticket (15%... that's a good investment!) but one in a million lost their house, car, savings etc. Would you buy it?

The expected return is exactly the same, but the mentality changes.

[Drum]

Did someone say wine?

Don't mind if I do.

[jimbo600]

Spirits.... definately.... Years of research got into that!

But! What gives you the worst hangover?

Again, I'd have to say spirits. Man I feel crap for days after a binge on the rumbos

[F5 Dave]

. . Both arguments are facile.
. . .

With my diminutive vocabulary I had to look this word up, but in reflection I still think it would have read better as "Both arguments are faecal"

[007XX]

I bet I hate it more than you do....

*are we comparing who's arse is the tightest here?*

Seriously though...I do not wish to come across as someone who would judge a person affected by a gambling problem.
But anyone suffering from an addiction needs to take responsabilty for their own act, and go towards rectifying their lives.

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink...

[RantyDave]

A fine sense of civic duty. I commend thee.

Do we really need the cheap goods we so crave when waved in our face? ... Can I help people with poor budgeting skills? ... It does grate me that people are being harvested for their hard earned money without fully appreciating the implications of their actions.

Two problems with this.

1, You quickly get into restricting people's freedoms. Bad.

2, At some point you need to delineate between rampant pointless consumerism created by the faux desire that's the stock in trade of the advertising industry; and sensible use of one's disposable disposable income to enhance lifestyle and the enjoyment thereof. Case in point: Which side of the line does a $2k Termignoni exhaust fall?

But I have to agree that we have created an underclass - and that the line between freedom and slavery is becoming blurred. I don't know what to do about it either.

Dave

[James Deuce]

Went to a conference at Sky City in Auckland last week.

The demographic in the Casino was depressing. Especially at 8am.

I'd like to see Horse Racing, Dog Racing, Lotto, and any other form of corporatised gambling dealt to as well as Pokies.