Police shoot and kill another person

[I Smell Bacon]

Nothing beats a good ol police shootout.

***WARNING - VERY GRAPHIC***

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hztH-...elated&search=

They should have sent this joker along.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ryOM...elated&search=

[davereid]

Quote Dynamytus50 "A lot of that has to do with the gunshop case. The media deliberately misrepresented the case in the papers with headlines like "Police charge gunshop owner over shooting" This would lead most people to think that he was charged because he shot the man who pulled a machete on him. Police never charged him with that, they accepted that he acted within the law to protect himself. He was charged with having a loaded .45 cal colt firearm behind his desk."

I agree with virtually all your post.

But, I can't agree with the section above.

Factually you have it perfect. But this is just more evidence of the obsession of the Police heirachy to absolutely prosecute anyone who uses force (but particularly firearms) in their own defence.

Remember that by this time police had already lost virtually every firearm-self defence case they had taken.

I can't remember them all, but others on site will.

In fact I can't actually remember an anti self defence case the police won.

The McIntye case had just been sorted - thats where the police charged farmer Paul McIntye for shooting (armed) Sam Hati, and while much poorer, McIntyre won.

So, police didn't change the policy - they just realised that they would not win.

So they changed tactic - now they charge people with unlawful possession of a weapon, etc etc.

So just in the last couple of days, we see a morrinsville farmer (Bonner) lose his firearms licence and waiting to see if police are going to charge him, for his firearm usage in the arrest of two burglars. That must be in the public interest.

We see a chef defend himself, get charged with attempted murder, and get offered a 2yr sentance for GBH if he just pleads guilty.

I can't be bothered going back in time, but the pattern repeats over and over.

And then the police shake their heads with disbelief when Joe Public expects the same level of restraint from them as they require of Joe Public !

Police HQ need to take a serious look at themselves, prosecuting normal people for defending themselves from criminals (Particularly when police won't do the job) is not the way to get community support.

By no way does this mean I don't support the individual policeman involved in these kind of events.

But I'm sorry to say It's hard to be completely sympathetic when I know that if I wake up at 2am to a noise on the farm, and make exactly the same kind of split second decisions that the cop has to make, that I'll find the police do everything they can to send me to jail.

Unless I'm dead.

[Grahameeboy]

They can't carry the taser anymore as the trial period has finished and the weapon has been withdrawn for service for the government to evaluate if it's needed.

Hammers are bad; if you are hit with it the force often chips a small round piece of your skull out and sends it into your brain.

If an armed Police Officer points a glock at you and tells you to put it down and you charge him with it raised over your head then you are inviting the inevitable. Police are not punching bags or nails to hammer into the ground.

I know but they could teach the Police some simple self defence to handle hammer hardnuts.

Trouble was this guy probably had no idea what he was doing cause he was off his head so the threat of being shot was not in his consciousness.

Okay we can argue that the pills were his choice but would this happen if the guy was drunk??

I just feel that this should have been apparent to the Police, given his prior behaviour, ie he was not just a violent offender and that shooting was not appropriate.

At same time I understand that the cop was in danger. I guess they don't have baton's anymore?

I don't blame the cop. He reacted in the agony of the moment and I am sure he is not too happy either..just think that this incident could be used to look ar alternative measures.

[candor]

I wonder if the dead guy was pro or anti taser?

And I seriously doubt this was just party pills. Why are the media interviewing potential homicide witnesses? Isn't that a bit naughty, given it could prejudice any trial? Should they be charged with something - is there any particular offence that covers this?

It seems to me the NZ media has been getting far too opinionated about certain goings ons and tried far too much to influence outcomes eg Rickards / Nicholls. Arrest one.

[Grahameeboy]

No i completley disagree. Unarmed tactics like Akido may work wonderfully in the realitive calm of a dojo but on the street i can tell you that kinda stuff often doesnt work. More traditional fighting styles like Boxing and even that Todd Group stuff are probably the best styles that actually work, sometimes they do, sometimes they don't. Often it comes down to the individual than the technique. But i can tell you know no Police Officer should have to forcibly go toe to toe with a crazy man running on drugs and adrenaline holding a hammer with only his flimsy extendable baton to protect himself. As far as im concerned he representated an immediate threat to the Officers life and he was left with no alternative other that what happened.

I have no doubt i would of done the same thing in his shoes. As far as i can see the only alternative would of been a taser which is no longer currently in use.

I understand but many years ago I put a guy who attacked me in Hospital with little effort using Aikido which is effective regardless of opponents weight etc..............as you know you use the other guys harmony and it is very effective...............as you say it is a different story to the Dojo which is why I gave it up knowing what I could do, albeit I had was cornered and had no choice...preference being to run.

Look I do not condone the cop or you for using the gun..........just a shame to me.

[Hitcher]

The media just wants to get the "news" first. One thing the "news" coverage has shown is just how terribly reliable eye-witnesses are. People see what they want to see.

[jrandom]

The Officer waited until he was in striking distance before firing...

I would have thought, in fact, that this would have been a breach of accepted tactics. Although I suppose that the officer having his weapon drawn and ready to fire gave him the ability to choose the moment. Still, he did go further than he absolutely had to in terms of endangering himself. I applaud his bravery.

A sad business, but I question the sanity of anyone who does not, given the information currently at hand, support the officer's actions.

[scumdog]

Pepperspray squirts in a stream and is quite directional.
Who knows?

Truth is the first victim.
As I said previously, "15 all" to the media.

Sure, from how far away?

And does it work EVERYTIME on EVERYBODY??

Used pepperspray a bit have you??

[Edbear]

There are people who will not reason, listen or even engage in conversation. They are violent dangerous people whether through drug or their nature. Sometimes Police are left with no choice other than force to be used against the person to subdue to prevent the public, the Police or the offender himself being harmed. In situations like this one the Police Officer appealed to the person and it was not until the offender refused to put down his hammer and charged the officer that he opened fire. Your comments are ignorant and ridiculous..

I think his comments were a p/t, mate...

[98tls]

damn i just knew this shit would still be going,the guys dead because he tried to hit someone on the head with a hammer,personally i am glad he chose a cop with a gun to do it to instead of some innocent joe public,at least in this case we can be sure its the last time he tries that shit on anyone.

[Swoop]

Used pepperspray a bit have you??

I prefer Lynx or Gillette myself.

[scumdog]

I would have thought that it would be much easier to defend in front of a judge/jury though, even if both were being dispensed at the same time.
"I tried the spray but he didn't stop, so BANG"
In fact, bang x4.
This officer does appear to know how to draw his firearm.

Listen sunshine, try this:

stand back to back with somebody wearing a gun in a holster (OK, maybe you can't actually do that)

On the word 'go' from a third person the guy without gun runs directly away from guy with gun while guy with gun starts drawing said gun.

When guy with gun has it fully drawn and into aim posititon the third guy shouts 'stop'.

At this point guy without gun will have run anything up to 12 metres before the word 'stop' is said.

So having somebody closer then 10 metres means you would be unlikely to be able to draw and fire and aimed shot in time to save yourself.

And if you had a can of pepperspray in one hand (which is limited to 3 or 4 metres outside) your draw-aim-fire time would be even longer.

If I went to a job where I may have to use my Glock without delay I would have it in my hand already to go, not in the holster.

[scumdog]

So thats another moment the cop has to spend taking that off.

No safety on the pistol I am used to, except the one residing between the ears.

No safety to operate.
Load mag into gun, rack one up the spout and she's 'hot' - ready to go just like a gun should be.

[oldrider]

I remember the Police officer first on the scene at (Dunedin) Aramoana/David Gray massacre, did everything by the book and paid for it with his life!

All you PC bastards that want every other Police Officer to do the same, can go and get stuffed as far as I am concerned.

The guy with the problem is the offender not the officer, if he doesn't want to get hurt or have his rights violated, then he shouldn't have offended.

Shoot first and argue later, at least the cop will still be alive and back with his family!

PC bastards give me the shits, get real for f**ks sake, you are shagging this country up! John.

[98tls]

Bling deserved and given..........something to offset what you will get from the tree huggers.....