Feeling a little over-taxed this morning?

**Sanx** · 11th October 2007, 17:04

Originally Posted by Finn

Money can't buy you love Paul. They even made a song about it.

Nope, but it can buy you the nearest possible substitute.

**Macktheknife** · 11th October 2007, 17:17

Money also can't buy happiness... but it does buy you a much better class of unhappy.

Seriously though, I believe the Swedish model is still regarded as very efficient. From memory, personal tax is about 65%, but all medical and dental visits are free, including surgery costs to a limited amount. Public transport is free and frequent in most city areas and people are well informed of the services their taxes go on.
Doesn't sound bad to me, I don't mind paying so much as long as I can see where it is going and see some value in it.

**Wolf** · 11th October 2007, 17:31

Originally Posted by Macktheknife

Seriously though, I believe the Swedish model is still regarded as very efficient. From memory, personal tax is about 65%, but all medical and dental visits are free, including surgery costs to a limited amount. Public transport is free and frequent in most city areas and people are well informed of the services their taxes go on.
Doesn't sound bad to me, I don't mind paying so much as long as I can see where it is going and see some value in it.

65% taxation to not have to pay $2.40 to save a half-hour walk (or a 15-minute walk, all costs the same) EVER and not pay 40+ dollars to visit a GP for 15 minutes (even more for the same amount of time at a dentist) EVER?

And free surgery and reliable public transport...

SHIT YEAH!

Seriously, I know people who'd make heaps out of that deal, they're spending so much on medical or dental

**Grahameeboy** · 11th October 2007, 17:34

Well it was a surplus so a positive.

I wonder how much it would cost the Govt to reduce Gst on essential items, like food, power........oh and motorbikes of course, or even scrap it altogether.

Anyone got any figures?

I don't mind paying income tax but then having to pay purchase tax as well is a bit much..mind you in the UK VAT is 17.5%.

As mentioned before, more money to spend benefits business and benefits the Govt's piggy bank with the extra Income Tax earned from the extra spending and tax payers feel they have a choice with their money.....like buying a house.

Keanes Theory.

**cowpoos** · 11th October 2007, 17:46

Originally Posted by Finn

An argument one often hears to try and convince people, that we shouldn’t get some of our taxes back, is that yes we had a big surplus this year, but hey look at the projections for future years - that surplus won’t be so large.

So let us review the history of Treasury projections of the Operating Balance or surplus.

The 2003/04 surplus was $7.4 billion. It was originally forecast to be $3.2 billion.

The 2004/05 surplus was $5.8 billion. It was originally forecast to be $2.7 billion.

The 2005/06 surplus was $11.5 billion. It was originally forecast to be $4.2 billion.

The 2006/07 surplus was $8.7 billion. It was originally forecast to be $6.2 billion.

Now to be fair to Treasury, forecasting the income and expenditure for an entire country is difficult. Hell it can be hard to forecast earnings for a single company, let alone all of them. Nevertheless their conservatism is starting to affect the credibility of the forecasts.

I’m more forgiving of a $6 billion change from an initial forecast four years out, to an actual than a smaller change over a smaller time period. But let’s look at how the forecasts for 06/07 have changes over the years:

May 2003 = $6.2 billion
May 2004 = $5.1 billion
May 2005 = $5.3 billion
May 2006 = $5.8 billion
Dec 2006 = $6.3 billion
May 2007 = $6.6 billion
June 2007 = $8.7 billion (actual)

Yes the surplus to 30 June was $2.1 billion higher than when the Budget came out in May.

Now this year’s surplus was forecast in the BEFU to be $6.4 billion. That means it could well be over $9 billion, which would make the surplus over five years exceed $40 billion... of your money.

From the Dom Post...

What it is proof of is that his Government is over-taxing New Zealanders, a bad practice that insulates ministers and officials from spending mistakes - because they can be written off without consequence - and makes individuals more dependent upon the state.

Treasury’s view that the state is on a “structurally higher” revenue track than previously believed makes some sort of announcement about tax cuts almost inevitable in next year’s Budget, which conveniently falls just a few months before the election. But, if past experience is anything to go by, the amounts involved will be small and the wait to receive them long. This is not a government that relishes relinquishing its grip on individuals’ wallets. Previously it has argued that returning surplus revenue to those who earned it would fuel inflation, a self-serving argument that has encouraged ministers and officials to bid opportunistically for the surplus cash.

Dr Cullen has previously argued that he does not need a tax cut. Given his $255,000 salary as deputy prime minister and the generous superannuation fund waiting for him in retirement it is difficult to disagree with him.

But there is a world of difference between earning $4900 a week and $1150 - the amount earned by someone on a $60,000 salary.

I would also observe that Dr Cullen doesn’t need taxpayer funded superannuation, yet he is happy enough to take that, yet not happy to give tax cuts, on the basis he personally doesn’t need them. Somewhat inconsistent.

Nice going Labour.

fuck the tax cut...how about a rebate every bloody year?? what the government don't spend we get back???

**NighthawkNZ:Me** · 11th October 2007, 17:48

Originally Posted by deanohit

Well hell, my vote is for sale for $10000 if they want it. Maybe should start an auction on Trademe fto make it easy for them to buy it.

don't sell yourself too short... ask for $100,000

8 billion divided by 4.5 million = $1777.77 each

i never was good at math

**Grahameeboy** · 11th October 2007, 17:51

Originally Posted by cowpoos

fuck the tax cut...how about a rebate every bloody year?? what the government don't spend we get back???

Yeah but they would tax it............

I reckon this works out around $20,000 per income earning person.....roughly in my head....

**Grahameeboy** · 11th October 2007, 17:54

Originally Posted by cowpoos

fuck the tax cut...how about a rebate every bloody year?? what the government don't spend we get back???

can you say that again cause I did not catch it the first time

**SlashWylde** · 11th October 2007, 17:57

Originally Posted by Macktheknife

I believe the Swedish model is still regarded as very efficient. From memory, personal tax is about 65%, but all medical and dental visits are free, including surgery costs to a limited amount. Public transport is free and frequent in most city areas and people are well informed of the services their taxes go on.

Cool, but:

I look after myself and subsequently go to the doctors about only about two or three times a year when I've had something out of the ordinary which needs looking at.
Public transport is of no use to me.

Think I'd rather keep the taxes lower. Oh and get a rebate from those thieving F'ing bastards in parliament.

**doc** · 11th October 2007, 18:07

Originally Posted by Robert Taylor

Where tax isnt rightfully spent is on having a credible and modern Air Strike Force, to show that at least we have the intent to defend our assets inclusive of food production and fresh water.

I don't disagree with you , but we could never afford to defend NZ, we can't even, "Stand up to be counted" without the enemy within ..getting up on their soapbox. Get rid of MMP and find some real leadership first, then look at defence again.

**Grahameeboy** · 11th October 2007, 18:11

Originally Posted by doc

I don't disagree with you , but we could never afford to defend NZ, we can't even, "Stand up to be counted" without the enemy within ..getting up on their soapbox. Get rid of MMP and find some real leadership first, then look at defence again.

Who is gonna invade NZ??

**MisterD** · 11th October 2007, 18:12

Originally Posted by Macktheknife

Seriously though, I believe the Swedish model

Got any pictures of this Swedish model? I'm sick to death of Asian girlies on this site...

Oh, serious comment required? Well just think on...those billions of surplus dollars are after the creation of hundreds of extra jobs in public services for labour voters...

**u4ea** · 11th October 2007, 18:13

Originally Posted by Paul in NZ

I've changed my mind - spend the $$ on unifying the country and getting people to give a shit about others again...

They have..dont you remember the "bridging the gaps" slogan?? Its happening with the treaty settlements...Dont ya just love to share????

**Delerium** · 11th October 2007, 18:14

I see that the final solution I mean master plan is to encourage people to public transport and increase the green image of NZ. the problem is in places like Auckland you need a functioning public transport system for people to be encouraged to. Buses are not the answer. I half decent rail system goes a long way. There is some good documentaries on you tube regarding this and comparing us to OZ... I cant remember the link though.