Uni of Life v Uni Degree?

**boomer** · 16th October 2007, 22:03

Originally Posted by Robert Taylor

I think also its down to how much capacity of your brain you are prepared to unleash.

all 8 inches(cubed)... and you??

**caesius** · 16th October 2007, 22:36

Originally Posted by renegade master

did you get your degree in 1999?

What? No way I was doing real stuff in 1999.

**Shadows** · 16th October 2007, 23:24

Of course it makes a person more educated. However, and depending on the area of study, unless one has some experience in the real world one may not know how to apply the knowledge obtained from that education.
I reckon there's no harm in trying to better one's self given the opportunity to do so.

**Wiki Drifter** · 16th October 2007, 23:47

From my personal experience, coming off the University production line a few years ago with a pale-yellowish piece of paper laminated in shiny plastic did not help me prepare for the Real World™ at all. The hardest part was trying to get your foot into the door of a good job. I'll skip the tales of failures and disappointments encountered, but after I have settled in, it has been stressed upon me privately by management again and again that the company value people with degrees more than those without. I have not been in the workforce long enough to gather my experiences and reflect on the validity of those comments, but in my opinion, having a degree is a definite bonus for a person's career path.
Ceteris paribus does doing a degree make a person smarter and more productive? Probably not, but it does send a signal to potential employers that you probably possess a higher set of skills, whether thats actually the case or not is another issue.

PS To any recent graduates out there feeling apprehensive, disillusioned, or bitter at the experiences of trying to find employment, I want to give you all a big

. Things will get better if you keep trying

**jimevo** · 17th October 2007, 00:45

Obtaining a University Degree is a major accomplishment in life, any graduates will feel this way...

BUT this does not mean that these graduates are smarter or more wise in life, even in their own chosen field. Why, because a lot of these learned theories are useless unless practised frequently.

For people who will be using (daily) the knowledge learned from University, that degree is so vital for further career development, advancement, & potentially more rewards (financial or other)...

**RDJ** · 17th October 2007, 01:19

Went to Uni, did degrees, believe that they were extremely useful, actually essential to achieve professional competencies.

BUT life at Uni was UnReal and the saving grace of my years at Uni was that working part-time educated me in the RealWorld (earning your pay packet, pleasing your boss, working with teammates etc.) whereas Uni was about competing against your teammates, pleasing your professors, and getting no feedback on what the RealWorld expected and would pay you for.

IMO - just as all cage drivers should be required to ride a motorcycle daily for 6 months to give them A Clue, so should all Uni students be required to work for wages for 6 months (at least). Neither will happen for quite similar reasons methinks...

**Usarka** · 17th October 2007, 07:21

How many people at uni today are there because they want to learn, and how many are there who want a job or because its expected of them.

Universities have/are becoming a pre-req for almost any jobs. Airline pilots, army officers, customer services reps you name it.

imho people who finish a degree and never do any more study are less "educated" than people without degrees who continue to actively study and learn throughout life in whatever form. conversely, those who did not obtain a degree and also do not actively learn must be near the bottom of the pile......

**MSTRS:Me** · 17th October 2007, 07:52

My personal take on things is that Learning is a lifetime excercise. With or without a piece of paper that states a particular level of achievement, makes no difference. Success in life has nothing to do with a bit of paper. Too much emphasis is put on 'that' bit of paper, of which the lack of denies many fine people the key to the executive washroom.
"You want to be a member of our exclusive club? Then get yourself that bit of paper."
Fuck off.

**vifferman** · 17th October 2007, 08:18

Originally Posted by Mom

Does a University Degree make you more educated/more respected/more employable, in todays world?

Educated? Not necessarily.
Respected? Maybe. But respect comes from what sort of person you are, and how you live your life / conduct yorself.
Employable? Definitely. Despite the low unemployment rate, there is still a lot of competition for jobs, and employers will do their initial screening for skills-based positions by chucking out those with the lowest level of qualification and experience.

Originally Posted by Mom

If you dont hold a degree, does that make you dumb, and stupid and your opinions count for nothing.

No. Having a degree is not necessarily any indication of what sort of person you are, or your worth as a person/employee.

My #2 son left school at 16, with no qualifications at all. Is he stupid?
No.
The 'education system' largely failed him, as he was somewhat of a "square peg in a round hole". He is also amongst the smartest 1% of the population.
He now works as Systems Manager at an electronics company.

OTOH, I spent nearly 6 years at university. I have never used my 'qualifications', although they did help me to get jobs, as they indicated I wasn't dumb, so I didn't have to prove it. In hindsight, my degree was a waste of time and money.

In my last job, we used to get over 400 applications for programming jobs. It was too many to vet, so they were ranked by qualification/experience, and most applications went straight in the "Reject" pile. The company ended up with employees that were often 'overqualified' for the positions, so there was a high turnover. They accepted that, as long as they kept their core of experienced people.

The biggest problem with the education system is that it fails in some very basic areas: it doesn't teach students how to think, and it doesn't teach them how to find relevant information and critically analyse it. So you end up with people who have degrees yet can't think for themselves or train themselves or find out what they need to know. My two oldest boys are autodidactic: they teach themselves, and are constantly finding things out and learning stuff. This is partly because they had a few years of home-schooling, and partly just their personalities. #2 taught himself programming (he is proficient in several programming languages), electronics (he has assembled a 300W amp, designed and made himself a pre-amp and several other things, learned to play piano and guitar (and then took some lessons), and is now teaching himself guitar. He is also learning (off his own bat, using downloaded materials from the interdweeb) Japanese, Mandarin, German and Spanish.
#1 son is studying pharmacy at university, but has such a natural curiosity that he reads up to 12 books a week (he speed-reads in chunks) including non-fiction ones on archaeology, ship-building, map-making, firearms, etc etc. He has appalling handwriting and co-ordination (brain goes way too fast for his hand) yet taught himself calligraphy and can do beautiful copperplate writing. He also paints, builds models (and paints them), creates maps, and the little free time he has is always very busy.
#3 son went right through the school system, and is currently in year 13. He is a blob. He's not dumb, but he's very one-dimensional. He'll eventually either be perpetually unemployed, or do tertiary studies and be a drone in an office somewhere.

**Macktheknife** · 17th October 2007, 08:23

Originally Posted by boomer

no it doesn't.. it means you can read, digest and regurgitate.. nothing more nothing less.

here.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Education for example. no one will win this debate.. it's all based on your own beliefs and experiences.

and as far as im concerned.. i'm gonna LEARN you ALL!

Sorry Boomer, this is only the beginning, yes you must prove that you can do this but real education is where you can read, digest, and critically analyse the information to arrive at a new place. That is what I learned at Uni, how to see past the BS and get to the real stuff, the lecturers loved it, someone to argue with.
A degree (or 2) helps to open doors, it provides skills and knowledge to promote further learning, and greater understanding of self and others. Many people have observed that it is not the information learned in books, classes or lectures that makes the difference, but the way that it structures the mind and teaches critical thinking skills that is the real value.
It is important though to remember that nothing replaces experience, and after University you need to get out and get some.

**Joni** · 17th October 2007, 08:23

I have always thought life expereince is so much more important... it brings wisdom and "street smarts" that you can't learn in a book - however here I am at the age of 35 planning to study next year... so I think my stance has changed... I feel a good combination of both will set me on strong road towards my goals.

Now all I have to do is hope I can still study as I have not done anything close to it since I was 17.

Up, up and away....

PS - Im gonna vote for you to go back knitting as you did not give us the option for a combination of life and study

**Dilligaf** · 17th October 2007, 08:31

At the end of the day - a degree counts as much as you need it.
I have a nice certificate in Bed.... heheheh. (oh alright BEd). None of my brothers studied further than high school (and it could well be argued that they did precious little of that when there too) however all are earning far more than me. The one who skipped school the most is outperforming the rest of us by an astonishing amount when it comes to income. He however has also had stomach ulcers and a divorce.
On the other side of the coin, some jobs will simply earn you more if you have that piece of paper. And in the case of teaching, pay scales are heavily tied in with years of service and your level of qualification.
Cynically, the only thing I really learned at Uni was how to write a paper in line with what my lecturers wanted to read. Which leads me to believe that University is great preparation for work in the public sector.

**MSTRS:Me** · 17th October 2007, 08:46

Originally Posted by Dilligaf

....pay scales are heavily tied in with years of service and your level of qualification.
Cynically, the only thing I really learned at Uni was how to write a paper in line with what my lecturers wanted to read. Which leads me to believe that University is great preparation for work in the public sector.

Conform. Or else.

**Toaster** · 17th October 2007, 08:50

Originally Posted by Curious_AJ

you do forget, that dependign on the store, the person only gets paid minimum wage, the job ends up being a chore to scrape meagre wages... it's not a very engaging or interesting job... When I worked at the baby factory, I always made the effort to help people, or ask an older sales rep if I didnt know. But I got paid puddle stix and eventually resigned because the amount of pay I was getting was just rediculous for the amount of work i was putting in.

No I don't forget. So what AJ that it is "minimum wage". People should be thankful they have work and need to remember they are there to achieve their employers goals and not make excuses for slacking off. No-one is owed a living, you earn it.

Many employees grizzle about their pay and I admit I have done that too. We all feel we are worth more than our employers think we are worth. It is our approach that makes a difference. I suggest head down and get stuck in with enthusiasm. A positive hard working committed attitude will always serve you better in the long run than an "oh well, they pay me bugger all so I will slack off or walk off" attitude.

The question I have for employees is - are you a providing a worthy return on the investment your employer makes in you? or are you a cost to the business?