It already has one, you just aren't special enough to know about it.Originally Posted by Zukin
For whom the bell tolls
It already has one, you just aren't special enough to know about it.
KiwiBitcher
where opinion holds more weight than fact.
It's better to not pass and know that you could have than to pass and find out that you can't. Wait for the straight.
For whom the bell tolls
Why? They already know that we have a problem with them... BRONZ is pretty much our official way to rally them, and they will continue to do so. If you want to ensure something gets done, then get behind BRONZ and help them. Aggrevating people at LTNZ isn't going to help, if you 'keep in their face' you'll just end up pissing them off.
Jake the Muss ends up with nothing because he was a cunt, dont be the person who does that for all motorcyclists.
Billboards etc as mentioned may be a good idea but it needs to be professionally done, not half assed, otherwise we will be just like every other picket sign weilding group of nay sayers....And we dont want to be annoying the public - we want them on OUR side.
KiwiBitcher
where opinion holds more weight than fact.
It's better to not pass and know that you could have than to pass and find out that you can't. Wait for the straight.
Rest In Peace
Mate, you only read what you want to readWhy? They already know that we have a problem with them... BRONZ is pretty much our official way to rally them, and they will continue to do so. If you want to ensure something gets done, then get behind BRONZ and help them. Aggrevating people at LTNZ isn't going to help, if you 'keep in their face' you'll just end up pissing them off.
Jake the Muss ends up with nothing because he was a cunt, dont be the person who does that for all motorcyclists.
Billboards etc as mentioned may be a good idea but it needs to be professionally done, not half assed, otherwise we will be just like every other picket sign weilding group of nay sayers....
Where the hell did I say I was going to get all agro like Jake the Muss
As for pissing them off, that would work for me if I knew I had the potential to save a life.
Maybe I need to rephrase what I said
What I mean is that if we don't do anything, March will roll around and Bronz will met with LTSA, and then best case scenario will be that the LTSA decides that it is too dangerous to continue and they will stop erecting these things by 2011.
By then there could be hundreds of kms of these things go up
If we can stay in the picture by whatever means possible (and I refer to the public, the LTSA etc), preferably more rides, but we currently lack the awareness of the local and National Media, so we need to think about how we can best manage that
Dusty Butt 1000km - We knocked the bugger off what next?
Hardcore Biker
Personally, I couldn't disagree more...IMHO this statement beggars belief, If you think for one moment that there's a cost effective fix for these hideous devices when compared with the cost of installing the Smooth Walled Concrete Barriers....I think your sadly mistaken....unless of course you were thinking of completely covering them with concrete, Now there's a novel ideaShit you could even taper them...you know, with a base about 60cm wide and smooth walls finishing approx 1 metre from the ground with a capping... say about 30cm wide......I'm sure I've seen something similar somewhere.
And as for your next point....what engineering example could possibly make these look good?????.....I personally can't think of any...then again what would I know about engineering.....
I've learned... that to ignore the facts does not change the facts
Do you seriously expect me to believe that these politicians would implement policy based on nothing more than bullshit......
Bitch from Hell
The special case is Centenial Highway. The reason that they used wire barriers is that they take up less room and it "was" a narrow road.
1. The installation of these barriers recommends at least 3 meters either side for the fact that a car hits and does move things, without that room it is in the traffic on the other side.
2. The width of the road was a huge facter, in parts it was had passing lanes and others barely two way. To address this they have widened the road significantly so they could install the barriers - but not to the recommendation as mentioned above.
3. They are stating that the barriers there have already saved lives - before there was nothing there but a line that people crossed - I am under no illusion that any barrier system on that road would have been better than what they had.
4. I have both ridden and driven down the road since. It is terrible - when in the car you feel so closed in by the barrier that I think that will cause issues for some drivers - on the bike you seem to have more room and not feel so closed in cause you are so narrow compared to a car.
Oh well my ten cents for the morning ... stay rubber side down!
Hardcore Biker
Imagine if you will.....a machine built especially to straddle these barriers and completely cover the barriers with concrete as the self powered machine moves along.... exactly the same as the Curb and Channeling machines do now, only on a slightly bigger scale. These machines would be relatively cheap to produce......I would imagine a production run of twenty machines to start with. With these machines strategically placed around the areas where these barriers are installed... would be a simple operation to go out and repair any accident damaged sections. The biggest hassle I can see with this proposal would be the momentary disruption to the traffic flow whilst the Concrete trucks were alongside the machine filling the hopper with more concrete....I'm sure given more than the 5 minutes it took to think of this idea...we could design a loading system which would follow the Straddled Concrete Layer and provide next to no obstruction....just my 0.02cPersonally, I couldn't disagree more...IMHO this statement beggars belief, If you think for one moment that there's a cost effective fix for these hideous devices when compared with the cost of installing the Smooth Walled Concrete Barriers....I think your sadly mistaken....unless of course you were thinking of completely covering them with concrete, Now there's a novel idea
worth
Edit;I see I 'm a little cheaper than you Kari (0.02c)
I've learned... that to ignore the facts does not change the facts
Do you seriously expect me to believe that these politicians would implement policy based on nothing more than bullshit......
Bitch from Hell
Yeah but you are an engineer type dudeEdit;I see I 'm a little cheaper than you Kari (0.02c)
Mad nagging bitch!
One of the things that the Transit guy said, which I found really interesting was that in the middle of Auckland's motorway system (I'm sure he meant in town-spaghetti junction area) they had had to install concrete barriers because it was not feasible to close the motorway or block off affected areas to repair WRB....intimating the concrete ones don't need to be repaired....
Diarrhoea is hereditary - it runs in your jeans
If my nose was running money, I'd blow it all on you...
Bitch from Hell
Yeah that is the stuff of looking at the "lifetime cost" of the product. The fact that if there is an accident you need to close out an area for a period of time is just terrible .. when with other systems you don't.
Hardcore Biker
The good thing about the present Concrete Barriers are they are built in approx 6 metre sections and pinned to the road with spikes. Its a simple matter to come along with a Hiab Crane truck and quickly replace any damaged barriers. I remember being stuck in a 5.00pm traffic jam on the Southern M/way because a Truck had mounted a concrete barrier and overturned...the impact with the concrete was severe enough to rip out the entire front axle assembly and from what I could see as we passed the site was hardly any damage done to the barrier at all. That was the result of an impact at almost right angles. Thinking about that as an example...I seriously doubt that WRBs would have stopped that vehicle.
I've learned... that to ignore the facts does not change the facts
Do you seriously expect me to believe that these politicians would implement policy based on nothing more than bullshit......
Forum whore
as kari said, that bit of road is the WORST place for them! stretch a rubber band between your fingers. press the band with a finger from the other hand. it bends when pressed, doesnt it? what happens when a car going maybe 110k hits a wire barrier? that wire [and posts!] also bend, which means at least one half of the car at fault will still end up in the opposing lane. and then, chances are, that same car will be flicked backwards into the traffic behind it.
and then, when things finally settle down, traffic grinds to a stand still because there is no alternative route around that busted and broken car.
i know the current speed limit along there is between 70 and 80k, but i imagine when the wires have been finished, it will go back up.
a concrete barrier would be a much better option for that bit of road, specially now they have extended the wire north of the water and it has no reflectors.
wasp... your hopper idea could work. the concreting could be done at night, when there is minimal traffic to disturb.
my blog: http://sunsthomasandfriends.weebly.com/index.html
the really happy person is one who can enjoy the scenery when on a detour.
L-Plate Rider
Hi
Here is a link to what was put in the local Taupo newspaper today.
http://www.arl.net.nz/cheesecutters/paperLarge.jpg
Regards
Bitch from Hell
YAY .. great article
Well I like the picture
Rest In Peace
No, he is right in what he was saying. In France they clip on a semi-rigid plastic envelope called Moto-Tub. That stops legs and arms getting all caught up in the posts.
This Barrier Post Report (c) 2004 Monash University Accident Research Centre is a great read, you'll find the details and pictures about Moto-Tub here ...
4.2.1.3 Moto.Tub
Moto.Tub consists of plastic (polyethylene) materials that are made largely from recycled products (see Figure 4.4). It is designed to connect to the post of either guardrail or wire rope to protect motorcyclists from injury following impacts with safety barriers. Moto.Tub was developed in France by a company called Sodirel (Pieribattesti & Lescure, 1999).
Moto.Tub comprises two end support units (with four sleeves), a rear-clamping device, and two tubular rails that are sleeved into the support piece. The device can be adapted to the lower part of all types of barriers mounted on visible metal supports (Pieribattesti & Lescure, 1999). Based on discussions with Sodirel, Paul Hansen, Managing Director of LB International Pty Ltd (Hansen, 2004) states that installation and maintenance of Moto.Tub is fast and efficient. It requires a one-man operation to install the tubing and takes only minutes to assemble each end support. There is no need to remove the barrier or use specialised tools ......
Section 4 of the report looks not only at Moto-Tub but other WRB covering systems
Forum whore
There are some very good solutions in this. I hope BRONZ have taken this Doc to the LTSA. I want to see the rolls put under our rural steel rails. They are as dangerous as the wire ropes. If you bin in to a steel barrier you are going to hit the post under the steel rail. I hope the LTSA stops putting the wire in till they read this. the answers are in here. Well done Grub.
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