Global warming?

**Beemer** · 11th October 2009, 10:00

This shot of the Tararuas was taken on Wednesday - so much for spring! The air temperature is pretty cold but it's lovely in the sun.

**Jantar** · 11th October 2009, 10:18

Originally Posted by Skyryder

For those that have read Wisharts AIRCON the following link might be of interest.

http://hot-topic.co.nz/somethin%E2%80%99-stupid/

I have not read his book so can not give an opinion on the credibility of the critique of the link or not.

Crazy Ol' Ian Wishart

There's a very amusing blog-exchange going on between Gareth Renowden of climate blog Hot Topic and Ian Wishart of independent current affairs mag Investigate. It's on the subject of Wishart's new book "Con Air", about how global warming is an unscientific fraud. Renowden tore it to shreds in a review, and predictably Wishart responded; Renowden decided it was simpler not to engage with his nonsense, which got another Wishart response. So Renowden proceeded to dismantle Wishart's claims, picked up another Wishart response, and then shot that one by showing the research Wishart was talking about actually meant the opposite of what he thought it did.

from

http://www.additiverich.com/morgue/archives/002894.html

There's a fair bit of stuff with all this.

Skyryder

I have browsed both of those links, and neither of them successfully debate the science they quote from AirCon. Like you I haven't yet read AirCon as I have just been reviewing a book on the other side of the fence, Melting Point.

However the Blog and Hot Topic both appear to say "AirCon claims xxxxxx. but we know yyyyyyy, so AirCon must be wrong"

As an example:

In his discussion of solar effects and why he thinks they dominate, for example, he latches onto the fact that as the planet warms out of an ice age CO2 rises lag behind the initial temperature increase. This leads him to the following amazing paragraph (p86):

So much for the popular theory that CO2 levels increase first, then warming. All of this is vital in identifying the culprit behind the current warm period. If these two studies are to be believed, then it’s conceivable that the Earth is currently heating as direct result of the sun’s warmth during the Medieval Warm Period in AD1000. Jump ahead 800 years, and the planet starts to warm up around 1850, a warming trend that continues into the present.
This statement betrays such supreme ignorance of climate basics ..... etc

Unfortuantely for Hot Topic the science has shown that CO2 changes do lag major temperature changes by around 800 years.

Then there is:

He denigrates Michael Mann and James Hansen, but accepts the “work” of Monckton

Even the IPCC no longer accept Mann's work as genuine, and they have dropped all references to the Mann hockey stick studies.

I shall read AirCon next month, but shall be suprised if I find anything new in there.

**vtec** · 11th October 2009, 11:15

Originally Posted by Winston001

Enron. That's the evidence for a global conspiracy? Enron? The same company which crashed in spectacular fashion in 2001 - 8 years ago - losing billions? This is the success story for "follow the money"???

He's actually got a point, Enron operated on trading bubbles fraudulently inflated and deflated when suitable, making a lot of money. A carbon credit scheme is being pushed by some for similar purposes. I had a dvd that I bought in melbourne about the whole Enron debacle. And I see similar behaviour in a lot of the banking institutions mostly in the US.

From buying political power, to inflating and deflating financial instrument bubbles. The carbon credit scheme was designed to replace the credit derivative bubble when it burst, but they didn't get it pushed through in time. And hence the failure of the US banking system and economy.

The thing that will cause far more widespread extinctions and drop the energy flux density, (not even taking into account how we are going to replace the oil factor when it runs low) and thus population capacity, of the earth is the coming Ice Age due to Solar energy reduction on earth. Do some research about that, before you start worrying about Anthropological Global Warming.

If it's not Global Warming that you are worried about but rather Climate change, then that makes solving the human causes very difficult, as Climate Change is pretty ambiguous.

**Skyryder** · 11th October 2009, 11:23

Originally Posted by Jantar

As an example:

Unfortuantely for Hot Topic the science has shown that CO2 changes do lag major temperature changes by around 800 years.

In the grand scheme of things 800 years is next to zero.

15 million that now that's in another ball park

It has been known that modern-day levels of carbon dioxide are unprecedented over the last 800,000 years, but the finding that modern levels have not been reached in the last 15 million years is new.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...1008152242.htm

Skyryder

**Winston001** · 11th October 2009, 15:15

Originally Posted by scumdog

Damn tootin' right - I bet China, India etc who don't give a fat-rats-arse about 'carbon credits', the Kyoto Protocol and pollution in general don't have any penalties inflicted on THEM!

:

Mmmm but why should they? The average Indian/Chinese has every right to want a 4wd, plasma TV, more food than they can poke a stick at, and Western levels of healthcare. They aren't going to get it living in slums so they are industrialising as fast as they can. We have done it already so we can't deny the rights of the third world to aim for our standard of living.

**scumdog** · 11th October 2009, 15:20

Originally Posted by Winston001

Mmmm but why should they? The average Indian/Chinese has every right to want a 4wd, plasma TV, more food than they can poke a stick at, and Western levels of healthcare. They aren't going to get it living in slums so they are industrialising as fast as they can. We have done it already so we can't deny the rights of the third world to aim for our standard of living.

Eventually they'll be just like us.

"Dose plurry Kiwis are taking a' da work off us"

**Manxman** · 13th October 2009, 21:57

Originally Posted by Quasievil

Simple there is no money in being skeptical

Scientists that have signed up to the B.S "global warming is caused by man so we must pay cash swindle"lol.......most of them arent even scientists.

There are higher qualified sceintists that are on the skeptic side in actual fact.

Want truth follow the money.......Al gore is laughing his $$$$ rich arse of

Frickin here, here.

GW = Bollox = Biggest con ever imposed on a gullible populace desperate to see something meaningful happen in their lifetime.

Ref below...