white power

[JD Racing]

I hadn't considered for one second that Robert was accusing me of being a liar, he cares passionately about the product he imports and there's nothing wrong with that (perhaps verging a little on the paranoid though )

The one common thing I see with all Ohlins guys is that they have an unwavering belief that Ohlins make the finest components ever manufactured and that everybody elses products are inferior, they make the best springs, the best shims the best oil, their tolerances are finer than anyone elses, their technology more advanced....and so it goes on. However in the multi billion pound motorsport that is formula 1 where the best of everything is a necessity Ohlins are conspicuous by their abscence, Showa, Penske, Sachs are all represented.

[DEATH_INC.]

fYI: Hagon do a shock for the old GSXR too. My old one had one.

Cheers,

Sedge.

If ya want one of these (the hagon), I have a mate with a brand new one that he doesn't need anymore.....lemme know and I'll find out what he wants for it...
For the record, I have a WP emulsion in my old turbo, it's brilliant. No complaints at all, and I've never had the desire to change the compression damping, they got it pretty right out of the box

[sedge]

Ah, but the 64 thousand dollar question is, was it any good?

It didn't wallow and it absorbed the bumps OK, handled pretty well for an old bike. A lot better than one with an antique knackered shock that's for sure.

Sedge.

[Cruisin' Craig]

......A lot better than one with an antique knackered shock that's for sure.

Sedge.

You talkin' about my bike behind my back?? :-)

[Shaun]

I hadn't considered for one second that Robert was accusing me of being a liar, he cares passionately about the product he imports and there's nothing wrong with that (perhaps verging a little on the paranoid though )

The one common thing I see with all Ohlins guys is that they have an unwavering belief that Ohlins make the finest components ever manufactured and that everybody elses products are inferior, they make the best springs, the best shims the best oil, their tolerances are finer than anyone elses, their technology more advanced....and so it goes on. However in the multi billion pound motorsport that is formula 1 where the best of everything is a necessity Ohlins are conspicuous by their abscence, Showa, Penske, Sachs are all represented.

Fair enough and well said

My Apologies to Robert For what I said in my earlier posting, I guess His reply was what we should expect from some one as passionate about his buisness/product as Robert is

[Robert Taylor]

There is absolutely no fabrication here whatsoever, I'm just saying what I see, I have no axe to grind at all, I'm quite happy to state that Ohlins aluminium bodied shocks are a very good shock, as are WP and Penske. Unfortunately many riders consider shocks to be a sealed for life component, if you service a 3 year old shock with a hard anodised aluminium body the oil comes out fairly clean, do the same with a steel bodied Ohlins and the oil will be black, this is not my imagination or a wild accusation to discredit Ohlins it's an absolute fact based upon nearly 2 decades of shock servicing, the older steel bodied WP shocks do the same thing as do Wilbers/Hyperpro/Technoflex that have steel bodies, the worst shocks ever are Works which have a bare aluminium body.

Thankyou for putting it totally into perspective. The truth of the matter as you well realise is that shock oil doesnt get changed anywhere near as much as it should be. For example 17000 compression cycles EVERY lap on a typical MX track and lots of heat cycles. By the time it has been ''pulled, prodded, squeezed and poked'' it is well beyond its best. Even prior to discolouration from whatever cause.

[Robert Taylor]

All the pro twins (650 twins) guys in the states rave on about the penske rear shocks in SV650's
Then again I rode Codgies SV650 and was blown away by how well an Ohlins works.
_proof positive I aint a suspension guru I guess

The proof is in the pudding, he is the runaway points leader in F3, as are Bugden and Charlett in their classes respectively, all using Ohlins TTX36. TTX36 we custom build for the SV ( and Codgy has started a craze here ) Otherwise the more standard Ohlins shocks for these work very well with tuning and backup totally attuned to the market and well proven.

[Robert Taylor]

Well if an Ohlins steel bodied shock is plated and honed as RT says, and doesn't cause the oil to go black really fast as JD says, then what did you expect him to say?

We've (the KB community) been watching the underlying angst that appears to be in the local suspension market at the moment, with some interest... I'm guessing that most people are like me, and are only interested in the facts about each brands units, and not whatever market politics are currently going on.

I think its often about what people want others to beleive and what they are comfortable with. As for me, well Ill stand on my record of decades of solid after sales service in backing up a premium product. Ive had other products and phased them out, for good reason. But still provide just as solid backup for same.

[Robert Taylor]

If he bought that shock it would triple the bikes value , surely he would want something second hand or just rebuild the old shock, the other alternative is to get a second hand OE shock from a later model bike

Agreed. On a purely technical level you will get just as much improvement in fitting top shelf suspension, be it a $3000 or a $30000 bike. It depends in the end event whether you shell out for a moderate or a huge improvement. Ohlins shocks are always highly sought after second hand so its not once only dead money

[Pussy]

Agreed. On a purely technical level you will get just as much improvement in fitting top shelf suspension, be it a $3000 or a $30000 bike. It depends in the end event whether you shell out for a moderate or a huge improvement. Ohlins shocks are always highly sought after second hand so its not once only dead money

As I can attest to. I have only shelled out full price for two shocks in this household. Whenever a new bike has been purchased, there is normally a quick call to RT, and a trade-in organised for the Ohlins shock for the new bike. A not unreasonable few bucks later, RT takes the Ohlins shock from the old bike off my hands, to be replaced with a new one. Works for me

[Robert Taylor]

I hadn't considered for one second that Robert was accusing me of being a liar, he cares passionately about the product he imports and there's nothing wrong with that (perhaps verging a little on the paranoid though )

The one common thing I see with all Ohlins guys is that they have an unwavering belief that Ohlins make the finest components ever manufactured and that everybody elses products are inferior, they make the best springs, the best shims the best oil, their tolerances are finer than anyone elses, their technology more advanced....and so it goes on. However in the multi billion pound motorsport that is formula 1 where the best of everything is a necessity Ohlins are conspicuous by their abscence, Showa, Penske, Sachs are all represented.

Thankyou for interpreting correctly what I was driving at! If I can be accused of paranoia its just that anyone in this country can at anytime in any trade set themselves up as an ''expert'', whilst I have some sympathy for the reforms of the free market we have in many ways gone too far. With respect to the field of suspension I think it is now well and truly justified as a trade in itself and there absolutely should be controls so that no 5 minute experts can get their hands on something with the potential to kill. Perhaps in my haste I have said that badly, but the fact is there is some appallingly bad work being done. FACT, FACT, FACT.
I dont think I can be accused of being one eyed with respect to the level you have suggested. I have evidenced some WP design that is very clever. And looking at the works level Showa stuff it is very impressive ( unavailable to the buying public ) There is no Ohlins company that I sing every morning.

Im glad youve mentioned Formula 1 as Ive often thought their chassis dynamics are not too far removed from go - karts, especially when you view the slomo images of them bouncing over kerbs. That they have any bump compliance at all is probably for the most part due to the tyres having big sidewalls. As with any aero function car the primary objective is to keep the chassis attitude as ''flat'' as possible to the ground to achieve maximum downforce at all times ( oversimplistically ) So arguably they are in certain aspects less challenging than optimising dampers for vehicles with either no or much less aero effect.

Ohlins were in Formula 1 several years back with Arrows before that team went belly up, and at the time Jos Verstappen was achieving results in that car beyond expectations. Yes, they are conspicuous by their absence but no less so than WP and Penske are conspicuously absent from MotoGP, and Penske absent from any meaningful European competition.

Its a question of available manpower but also one of the Ohlins engineers told me a few years back that because Ohlins have a very open policy with their technology it doesnt fit well with the secrecy within Formula 1. In any event Ohlins are probably making more revenue more easily by being the exclusive supplier to one of the Indycar racing series and to A1GP etc etc. As I can also recall Ohlins have won Le Mans for about the last 6 or 7 years continuously, and that is probably more challenging than F1. In the States their natural competitor is Penske in the Formula and Nascar series but Roger Penske has been known to run Ohlins in his cars.

On balance I do see that Ohlins is getting stronger all the time and this technology flows through.

[Robert Taylor]

All very nice, but doesn't help the punters

- Is there such a thing as an Ohlins steel bodied shock?
- If so, are they honed and plated?
- What sort of wear rate do they have?
- Under typical NZ road riding conditions, how long between rebuilds?
- How does one visually tell the difference between an alloy bodied and steel bodied one?
- Does it actually matter if the oil is sent black really fast? The discolouration is an indication of contamination I guess, but is that really important? Or does the oil just discolour quickly without performance loss?

Ohlins aren't in F1 coz cars are ghey

Yes, plated and honed. Many many more of the current shocks are now being replaced with hard coated aluminium body tubes. That may have as much to do with worldwide steel shortages.

I have seen these body tubes at 80,000 miles or more and have been able to reuse them. The soft alloy oem shock bodies used in the early 90s YZF750 Yamahas were trash at less than 10000 ks, typically.

40000 Ks approx is a good interval. Someone said something like ''bumps are bumps, anywhere in the world'' True enough but being displaced half a world away that guy doesnt realise that we have a much much higher percentage of roads ( and racetracks ) with nasty bumps. These in turn cause a much higher percentage of longer stroke movements. That is going to junk the oil and wear components sooner.

I think the discolouration factor has been overstated and the oil is still performing well with moderate discolouration. Oil technology is also like shock technology, it doesnt stand still.

Personally I have been a fan of race cars much longer than race bikes and in many ways continue to do so. The work that I have done for years with Carl Hansens TTX40 suspended Super GT series TVR Tuscan is invaluable. The mega dollar datalogging he has on this vehicle has given me a heightened understanding that I have in turn been able to apply within the bike world. So in my book cars are not gay!

[Robert Taylor]

If ya want one of these (the hagon), I have a mate with a brand new one that he doesn't need anymore.....lemme know and I'll find out what he wants for it...
For the record, I have a WP emulsion in my old turbo, it's brilliant. No complaints at all, and I've never had the desire to change the compression damping, they got it pretty right out of the box

Paul Thede from Race Tech said ''the best youve ridden is the best you know'' Interpretation, the compression damping could conceivably be a lot better, but you beleive its near perfect.There is no perfect setting!

The issue I have with emulsion shocks for our high percentage of bumpy roads is that prolonged high speed riding on such roads ( especially with g out depressions ) turns them into a milkshake and fade occurs. Especially so where the overall length is short with a relatively long stroke. Be it WP, Penske, Ohlins or the nasty cheap shocks on the market.

[Robert Taylor]

That's a good point

That's the Yamaha OEM Ohlins units right?

Thank you for taking all that time to explain those details

No, they were either a KYB or a Soqi unit, very much built to a price.

No problem

[FROSTY:Me]

Something our local staunch LABOUR supporter wont mention is that although he is strongly pushing the Ohlins barrow he is also able to improve even the most primitive of front susspenders --even Shineray