650 pro twins...

[k14]

Now i was planning on racing in Pro Twins this year on an Aprilia SXV5.5 now as far as i am aware and have been told there is nothing stopping me from doing so. This is a quote taken from the other thread;

Yes the bike complies but motards are not allowed in f3, pro twins etc. No matter whether or not they comply with the engine regs. They banned motards from all road racing classes bar the purpose made motard class because they are too dangerous to race with normal race bikes.

If you look hard enough you will find the rule. I can't be bothered looking though, sorry I think it reads something along the lines of "any bike with a handlebar height greater than XXX is not eligible for f3, f2, f1 etc"

Edit: Just re-read your post (had a mans read) and you prob do have a point but I very much doubt that you would be allowed to race it seeing as pro twins always is raced with F3, off the same start etc. This is at club level and national level. You should clarify your interpretation first.

[Sketchy_Racer]

The bikes are already cheap....

Yes Cheap in the grand scheme or racing you deal with, But still very expensive to someone like myself (18yo apprentice on less than minimum wage)

[Robert Taylor]

You see more of them than Honda to be honest.

Fitzgerald the only 1000 that I remember seeing, and a couple of 600s maybe?

But no support like the Bernard boys Yamahas and the many Suzukis out there

Actually Hayden gets the same level of contracted support we give the contracted Suzuki and Yamaha guys. If he had some horsepower it would get interesting. We help the Kwaka riders as much as we can with the time we have left over, but the support they get from the distributor is abysmal.

[jahrasti]

As Robert Taylor said, I think you will find numbers will go up this year as more are built. I have finishd building one and was planning to be at Mafield to judge myself against the experienced riders. Unfortunately shit happened and I couldn't make it. Also there is at the moment no incentive for the F3 650's to change back.

[Robert Taylor]

Yes Cheap in the grand scheme or racing you deal with, But still very expensive to someone like myself (18yo apprentice on less than minimum wage)

Granted, but margins are already trimmed to the bone. I was an apprentice too once and I am saddened that 30 years later the real cost of living has accelerated enormously due to a myriad of imported and local factors, among them mindless and costly government legislation. The root causes of our decline in living standards have to be addressed, not expecting onsellers to trim their margins ever further. Have you ever wondered why there is a constant ''turnover'' of motorcycle dealers? 2 main causes, 1) poor nett profit once the operating costs, taxes and mindless levies are deducted and 2 ) stress.

[k14]

As Robert Taylor said, I think you will find numbers will go up this year as more are built. I have finishd building one and was planning to be at Mafield to judge myself against the experienced riders. Unfortunately shit happened and I couldn't make it. Also there is at the moment no incentive for the F3 650's to change back.

Yes I think it has the potential to make F3 totally obsolete. There are more and more bikes turning up all the time. If you look at the times Karl Morgan was running at Manfeild they were pretty creditable, iirc 1.5s off the lead. Maybe a distributor, tyre brand should get behind it with some prize money. That would get the punters in.

[Sketchy_Racer]

Granted, but margins are already trimmed to the bone. I was an apprentice too once and I am saddened that 30 years later the real cost of living has accelerated enormously due to a myriad of imported and local factors, among them mindless and costly government legislation. The root causes of our decline in living standards have to be addressed, not expecting onsellers to trim their margins ever further. Have you ever wondered why there is a constant ''turnover'' of motorcycle dealers? 2 main causes, 1) poor nett profit once the operating costs, taxes and mindless levies are deducted and 2 ) stress.

Couldn't agree with you more!

although not the right place here to get into that convo!

[sparky10]

Or maybe "punters" would sooner go n watch V8 (tanks) "saloon cars", racing (crawling, so they "punters" can keep up) around the same tracks, as bikes r too fast for them.

[Clivoris]

Or maybe "punters" would sooner go n watch V8 (tanks) "saloon cars", racing (crawling, so they "punters" can keep up) around the same tracks, as bikes r too fast for them.

I suspect that there is some truth in that. Bikes don't have the same popularity. But like others have pointed out, certain race meetings pull the punters and riders. There might be a bit of a catch 22 occuring. People don't go until there is enough buzz generated, and enough buzz isn't being generated until enough people go. Instead of providing prizemoney at the Nationals MNZ spends the money on promotion and tv coverage. Did anyone see or hear any advertising for the Manfield round? There are other issues at Manfield as well, eg no outside food or beverage providers are permitted. Maybe with time and perseverance the nats will grow again?

[sparky10]

Maybe its lack of big sponsors,TV,big name riders etc etc, but crowds were not as big as i was expecting, comming from the road racing scene in Northern Ireland, With the similar population size.
A localy run (not international like NW200/Ulster GP) would easly get 5000+, crawling over hedges, standing in fields, just seeing bikes for a few hundred meters. Not being able to watch all the race and the whole circuit (except levels) with ease.

[FROSTY:Me]

My point from day one-whats the diff between a pro twins and F3?
(Yes I DO know the tech differences-sod all)
Yep theres more pro twins bikes --but then look at the F3 feilds and ya go HMM aint it stealing from peter to feed paul?

[Sketchy_Racer]

Simple Frosty, the idea is that protwins is easier and cheaper to have a bike capable of winning a class.

How much would a TOP spec F3 650 cost over a TOP spec pro twin? After having a look at Terry Fitzgeralds bike on the weekend, quite a sizeable sum.

F3 is an old class, Look at the average age in that class versus 125s, 600's protwins etc....

[slowpoke]

I think Pro twins is about emphasising and developing riders whereas F3 is more about the combination and development of riders and bikes. Close racing between equally matched bikes is good (Pro Twins) but I'm also very interested in the different machinery and different approaches to the same problem of finding more speed within the F3 class.
The idea of building and developing an F3 project is extremely attractive but the Pro Twins don't capture my imagination in the same way simply because the rules are so restrictive.

[JJ58]

Hey Guys,

Refering to some of your earlier comments I would like to draw attenton to an enormously talented rider who is absolutly riding the bolts out of the under powered Kawa in 650 Pro Twins. Tom Bos has done exceptionally well, considering that he is 7-10hp down on the SV. I hope that his efforts this year don't go un-noticed by distributors..... It would be good to see more Kawa's out there to indicate the talent of Tom......I'd hate to see PT become a one bike race. If so then we're no better off than when proddie 250 was running..... My 2cents :-)

[GSVR]

Hey Guys,

Refering to some of your earlier comments I would like to draw attenton to an enormously talented rider who is absolutly riding the bolts out of the under powered Kawa in 650 Pro Twins. Tom Bos has done exceptionally well, considering that he is 7-10hp down on the SV. I hope that his efforts this year don't go un-noticed by distributors..... It would be good to see more Kawa's out there to indicate the talent of Tom......I'd hate to see PT become a one bike race. If so then we're no better off than when proddie 250 was running..... My 2cents :-)

7-10 HP down on an SV? I'm definately not getting an ER6 now....

Maybe Tom should get Ray Clee to look at it!