Work Vs Dole

[rachprice]

Good on you Scummie.

Students could well learn some goal setting skills relating to saving for some of their course fee's rather than moaning about paying interest on student loans. All the pricks I see using gubbmint loan cash to buy cars and bikes and crap gives me the shits 'cause that's our fucking tax money their borrowing. Pay some interest on it like the rest of us fuck ya.
I'll earn my tertiary education & not cry because the poliaticians all got free uni back in the day.

Well that happens to be me, I work every summer to support myself, still need my living costs and the like during my studies. My fees are 12g a year for 6 years. How about interest on that. My degree doens't really allow me time to work, in fact in the acceptance package it tells you not to get a job but i still work a couple of shifts at the uni library.
For sure some people are out there fucking the system with any sort of allowance. Although its quite hard to fuck the student loan system. you get $150 for living costs. Screwed if you live in wellington or auckland, $1000 for course related costs. and the fees are paid directly to the tertiary provider.
I also have to pay back money just to live. To pay the bills, its bullshit, I am doing something to better myself and to contribute to society. The people on the dole don't do shit.
I am quite sick of everyone assuming that all young students take advantage of their student loans and moan about nothing!

Mind you I've been an advocate for the old "you have to earn it" school of thought for many years.
A person on the dole should be either proveing they are actively seeking paid employment -Ie prove they are attending say 3 job interviews a week for the first three months OR they should have to WORK for their dole money sorta like the PD crews. Out in woodhill marking out cycle track or painting schools or clearing drains.

I was just thinking this myself, get them to do shit that no one else wants to do. If they cant work they are on the disability benefit which is totally different. That might stop some of the bludging.

[Shadows]

Work vs The Dole.


Now first off, dont get me wrong I am not trying to make a decision here!

Scenarios:

Person XY earns $700 per week then quits and goes on benefit. This person then gets (because of a child) about the same amount per week from the government.

Person YX earns enough to cover expenses with only a couple of hundred to spare each week. This person goes on the social and then gets rent paid by government and pretty much sits on a about $100 per week.

Where is the incentive to work?

Unless your in a high paying job, there is not a lot holding low income people into employment is there!



Now my job is not exactly 'high paid' but it is adequate for my basic requirements for living, although prospects for future growth and 'moving up the ladder' is about nil. Unless of course I go back to University, which costs money.. which I could not afford. I could actually get more money per week as a student on the benefit than working part time while studying... now that is wrong.

now some of you may say $700 scenario is bollocks, but I know that person and she is able to maintain a $300p/w rental in a very good suburb of the shore while living a very nice lifestyle. All taxpayer funded.

That kind of thinking pisses me off.

Instead of half of the population considering leeching off everybody else who work for a living because they feel they aren't earning enough money in their employment, why don't they consider looking for a better paying job while they are still employed? Hasn't everybody heard there's a tight labour market out there?

So many losers who can't/won't help themselves, not enough goddam bullets.

[kevfromcoro]

I have just been layed off at Carter Holt..
went down to WINZ to check out the options....dont want to go on a beny.....so i got CV made up and e-mailed it all over the place..well when have to fill out an application form...all the stupid questions i have to answer..how much schooling have i had...shit havent been to school for 40 yrs.what ever happened to the days when you turned up for a job ,,and the company said..ok..give you a shot at it..nah not like that these days...

[Disco Dan]

That kind of thinking pisses me off.

Instead of half of the population considering leeching off everybody else who work for a living because they feel they aren't earning enough money in their employment, why don't they consider looking for a better paying job while they are still employed? Hasn't everybody heard there's a tight labour market out there?

So many losers who can't/won't help themselves, not enough goddam bullets.

Yes it is a bad way of thinking is'nt it!

The only thing between low payed employment and the social is how a person feels about 'leeching' and self respect.

Not something I could live with for any length of time!

But that is my point - the system is set up that way!

[FROSTY:Me]

Yes it is a bad way of thinking is'nt it!

The only thing between low payed employment and the social is how a person feels about 'leeching' and self respect.

Not something I could live with for any length of time!

But that is my point - the system is set up that way!

Not only the system isw set up to ENCOURAGE people to sit on their asses doing nothing. The system makes it more financialy viable for a couple that is perhaps struggling to seperate than to stay together--how does that make sense?
Mind you I've had issues with the "system " forever.

[Rotor]

Quote "The incentive is in having self respect, and setting a decent example for your kids. Any person who raises their kids long term on a benefit (other than sickness) should be ashamed. It's supposed to be a safety net, not a way of life."
that says it all its a privilege not a scam

[speights_bud]

The dole if we must have it should be dished out in tokens redeemable for the basics of life meat/veges etc no smokes/booze, that combined with when the compulsory insurance comes in you might as well hand over your car licence as you do in at least one state in the US as you wont be able to afford insurance.No booze/smokes and car might convince some to get off there arses and get a job.

Agreed, food tokens etc worked for our families back in the times of war etc, its used in the states and encourages money to be spent properly. why should i pay for someone on the dole to buy a lotto ticket?

I'm 19, living out of home, been working as a toolmaker/precision machinist apprentice for a year and a half now, being productive to my business and society.

Yet even after two Pay rises I'm still earning less than minimum wage, ( $11.60 hr) and so are many other apprentices, it's a pay scale that's used nationwide. when you combine living cost (rent $120, Petrol costs, food, power, phone & internet) there's bugger all left.

The Reason My Training organisation is able to pay me under minimum wage is because there is a loophole in the law which exempts training/apprentice
wages.

[MaxB]

Get off your arse and get a fucken job, never be a bludger - was the best advice my Uncle Norm ever gave me. Still holds true today.

There is a lot of truth in the belief that the benefit system is too slack. In a time of full employment I do not believe the dole should be a lifestyle choice. A lot of other countries have a time limit on the benefit. Maybe here?

People who have genuine hardship in their lives should still be helped but heaps of working families are doing it tough and the dole should never be better than working.

[avgas]

The Reason My Training organisation is able to pay me under minimum wage is because there is a loophole in the law which exempts training/apprentice
wages.

Oh no there isn't - they can only do that if they subsidize your salary with external tuition. Alot of apprentices fall into this trap as their boss tells them that they can get away with it.
I have had 3 friends fall into the same trap.
The have to pay you minimum wage.
Oh and FYI i used to pay guys with 2 years experience with tools, no school cert a minimum $38K/Year. In fact that company i know is always looking for guys to be service techs so PM me if you need details.

[speights_bud]

Oh no there isn't - they can only do that if they subsidize your salary with external tuition. Alot of apprentices fall into this trap as their boss tells them that they can get away with it.
I have had 3 friends fall into the same trap.
The have to pay you minimum wage.
Oh and FYI i used to pay guys with 2 years experience with tools, no school cert a minimum $38K/Year. In fact that company i know is always looking for guys to be service techs so PM me if you need details.

Perhaps i should have worded it slightly differently, I receive $11.60 an hour in my pocket (before Tax), an additional SIX dollars an hour (or thereabouts) is paid to my employer (training organisation) by my seconding company (the one i turn up to and do work at).

So yes, some of the money is used to pay for my paperwork courses like you suggest, however i fail to understand how there are people working for my training organisation which is portrayed as a "non-profit" organisation are earning Six figure Salary's all from my wages.

I'm charged out at $120 an hour btw.

I would have been better off to sign into the apprenticeship Employed by My Workplace with the training organization supervising my study.
That leaves the Business i work for to cover my course costs and i still receive a decent wage, Ie cutting out the middleman.

[Finn]

For most people in this category, there is no incentive. That's why this country is rooted.

The entire annual police budget is spent by social welfare in less than a month.

There needs to be a massive kulling.

[DMNTD:Me]

There needs to be a massive kulling.

You misspelt that last word mate

[Finn]

You misspelt that last word mate

I prefer it spelt with a "k" instead of a "c". Sounds more like kill.

[MIXONE]

For most people in this category, there is no incentive. That's why this country is rooted.

The entire annual police budget is spent by social welfare in less than a month.

There needs to be a massive kulling.

It ends up being $1 in $3 of the tax take goes to the MSD.Unfuckingbelieveable.

[DMNTD:Me]

I prefer it spelt with a "k" instead of a "c". Sounds more like kill.

Oh chortle chortle

...even I have a bloody job these days