Bleeding heart liberals

[sels1]

go re read what I wrote, recidivist offenders, means those that re offend, doing the same crime, everyone deserves the benefit of the doubt at least once!,

There are civilised ways to deal with repeat offenders, preventitive detention for one

and I can tell you that it is because I want my kids to have a decent life that I think this way,

I think we all want a decent life for our kids- thats why I want to see less violence in society. Govt. and the Justice system has to lead by example, and not be involved in the violence itself.

how many kids do you have?,

3 grown up ones, quite a few nieces and nephews, and lots I have taught/coached or otherwise been involved with.

and how many times have you been the victim of serious crime?

Not much, but I've thought about it, and I dont think it would change my stance. So long as we have a decent properly resourced justice system,there is no need to kill anybody. Two wrongs have never made a right.
This is my last post on this thread - I will leave you with a couple of quotes to ponder.

"Non-violence leads to the highest ethics, which is the goal of all evolution"
Thomas Edison (Inventor of electric light etc)

"The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its weakest members are treated" Mahatma Gandhi (statesman and philosopher)

[avgas]

we need batman

[moko]

And lets all think about the injustice of this situation next time some wanker says "lets defend all our speeding tickets etc to clog up the court system, that'll stop the cops from dishing out so many tickets.

It won't!

All it will do is help facilitate further injustices like this one.

Straying o/t here perhaps.I dont know what the situation is in N.Z. but you`re entitled to a copy of the picture from the camera as evidence,occaissionally there has been fraud(false plates or whatever,even computer balls-up)so it makes sense to do so.BUT if you go to court and argue the toss and are then found guilty the penalty is a lot higher so it`s really not worth the effort.There were loop-holes but they were pretty soon ironed out so most now just accept their fine or whatever.My biggest problem with cameras over here is that they seem to have replaced traffic police and trust me after the third jerk has jumped the lights,cut you up or blinded you with the one working headlight they`ve got in the average journey to work then you`d miss them as well.

[scumdog]

Ok, great arguments but, I do believe that the good ole US of A has an terrible crime rate & the death penalty. So what does that say?

Does anybody know what happens to murderers in Singapore (and other similar countries)? - I bet their 'stay' in prison is pretty short!

BTW Going by the logic in the above quote the reverse must be that there must almost be no punishment because there is not much murder in Singapore.

[toads]

[quote]There are civilised ways to deal with repeat offenders, preventitive detention for one[quote]

well this is ridiculous in the case of an intellectually disabled recidivist sex offender isn't it?, or any sex offender for that matter, 24/7 supervision for the entire life of the person, is probably more cruel than castration.
and with regard to the quotes mentioned well I don't think that either of the famous people who made those statements were referring to the worst of people ( serious criminals) when they made those statements, here's one for ya
"evil prevails when good men do NOTHING", can't remember who said that but bending over indefinately backwards to help people who, for whatever sick reason destroy the lives of others is not the direction our country or any other country should be heading. Help should be directed to the victims of crime, who are far more needy and deserving of resources than the perpertrators of the crime.

[matthewt]

Does anybody know what happens to murderers in Singapore (and other similar countries)? - I bet their 'stay' in prison is pretty short!

BTW Going by the logic in the above quote the reverse must be that there must almost be no punishment because there is not much murder in Singapore.

Last guy that was executed when I was there (93-96) was a drug smuggler on his way to Europe, thought that because he was only going to be in Singapore in "transit" that he'd be OK. Once convicted (no jury in Sg) he was hung 2 weeks later.

Crime stats in Sg don't really compare to anywhere else in the world largly because of :
a) the population density - Imagine all of NZ crammed into an area the size of Lake Taupo. I'm not an expert but I think this makes a whole lot of things logistically harder to do.
b) you can't trust the Sg government to post the real figures anyway.

Sg is really a benevolent dictatorship. Although you have to give them credit, if they say they'll do something, they do it.

Cool thing is that gun control is very simple in Sg, only the cops are allowed them. No exceptions.

[F5 Dave]

we need batman

Nah he was a leftie pinko & kept preaching that criminals could be reformed yet there they were re-offending every week, same Bat time, same Bat channel.

Hey maybe the death penalty is too harsh, but I don’t see why we can’t have tiered prisons & the repeat offenders & those likely to re-offend are put in a small cell & left there with regular feeds of nutritious brussel sprouts, their own tv, toilet & shower. If they break anything -too bad.

Surely this could be done cheaply. These guys would only be drawing the dole & ruining people’s lives & costing taxpayer’s dollars in police time & court costs. Problem is it is all on someone else’s budget.

I can’t get with the argument that longer sentences don’t work. I mean is their argument that the people on the outside commit more crimes to keep the averages up while the criminals are detained?

The thing is once you really F’up someone’s rights, destroying or taking their life then you deserve to progressively lose your own.

I think any Judge, Lawyer, social or medical worker who is responsible for letting these guys out should have to have them stay at their place for a couple of weeks, then we’ll see how carefully they screen these guys.

[Ms Piggy]

I dunno how many of you have heard of a woman called Celia Lashlie. She has some pretty radical ideas about the prison system and offenders. Basically she believes that we (the community) are all partly responsible for criminals and their behaviour. I can see some of you leaping up and down from here! She has a book which I posted previously under the "Read a good book lately?" Reading her book made me do a lot of rethinking about my attitudes - I still get angry & repulsed by rapists & violent criminals but, IMO violence isn't the answer.

Just thought I'd revive this thread b/c I've just about finished reading a really good book.

It's by Celia Lashlie, she was the 1st woman prison officer in N.Z and caused a huge stir back in 2001 when she made a comment a little blonde haired, blue eyed boy who she knew would end up in prison.

Her book is called The jouney to Prison, who goes and why.

The reason I liked it was b/c it was practical and real, this woman is not some flowery bleeding heart liberal, she has written to book from her own experiences of the prison system and observations she has made. She also challenges us as a community that we're responsible as well.

It's an easy read as well.

[Deano]

Im a big hypocrite so I would just kill any paedophiles/rapists who tried to mess with my kids, then use the old temporary insanity clause to get off.

If evolution still applied to humans this would be seen as natural selection - weeding out the weak and depraved, and thus improving the gene pool.

[F5 Dave]

There there, Deano, insanity must be a terrible burden on you. Can we get you some compensation to rub on that?

[Ms Piggy]

Im a big hypocrite so I would just kill any paedophiles/rapists who tried to mess with my kids, then use the old temporary insanity clause to get off.

If evolution still applied to humans this would be seen as natural selection - weeding out the weak and depraved, and thus improving the gene pool.

Yes well of course I freely admit I have never been a victim of crime so, all this talk may be nothing more than hot air.

The only problem with natural selection though is, it may weed out the weak but not necessarily the depraved.

[Indiana_Jones]

Time for the people to storm the Kremlin (AKA the beehive) in Helengrad (AKA Wellington)

-Indy

[Deano]

There there, Deano, insanity must be a terrible burden on you. Can we get you some compensation to rub on that?

Sorry about boxing day - I came down with a temporary case of soon after you came over for a chat. Then you disappeared....

[Deano]

The only problem with natural selection though is, it may weed out the weak but not necessarily the depraved.

I consider all peter files and rapists depraved.

[MSTRS:Me]

The thing is once you really F’up someone’s rights, destroying or taking their life then you deserve to progressively lose your own.

I think any Judge, Lawyer, social or medical worker who is responsible for letting these guys out should have to have them stay at their place for a couple of weeks, then we’ll see how carefully they screen these guys.

Abso-fucking-lutely!! Pointy thing pressured on noggin there. THe other side of that coin is to jail the do-gooder that signed the release papers of a reoffending crim