MotoGP 2011 250cc 2stroke replaced by 600cc 4 stroke, its official.

[James Deuce]

The Technical Director of MotoGP, Mike Webb is a Kiwi and a good friend.

This class is far from decided as the factories have to present their ideas (within that formula) for discussion.

The 600cc framework that they are discussing just doesn't make sense. To the average viewer, whom the Marketing arm (and let's not think for a minute that the Technical guys, all due respect to Mr Webb, appear to be driving this change) are attempting to appeal, the sport has created a class that is "only" 200cc smaller than the "big" bikes. Irrespective of all the technical intricacies that will keep a separation in lap times to a substantially noticeable difference, the average viewer isn't going to see the point, even if it is explained to them. I can see eyes glazing now when I'm asked to explain that one to friends and workmates who have only a passing interest in the sport.

[Tony.OK]

I wonder if they'll go all electronic too,traction cont etc..........
Seems like they are heading down the same road as F1 did........I'd rather see the 250's because they are all about rider skill,not who's got the best electrickery.

[gammaguy]

. Don't forget it's mainstream tech as well -- I'm guessing here, but I imagine producing next year's über-fast 250 2T is sort of a niche thing, bleeding edge technology, lots of money spent on R&D. Whereas a four-cylinder four-stroke with these limits set on it -- every man and his dog is making one of those. So smaller budgets again.

erm.........correct me if i am wrong,but wasnt MOTO GP meant to be the class where cutting edge development and new ideas were developed and proved in the toughest arena of all?
Now it seems it is fast becoming a reflection of what everyone is riding on the street,so instead of leading and innovating,it is merely following.This also throws up the question,where will world superbike end up?
I reckon Soichiro Honda and Barry Sheene,to name only two,would have a few things to say about the way the "premier"road race class is heading.
This is a prime example of what happens when engineers and petrolheads are replaced by accountants and "marketing experts"

[Oscar]

The 600cc framework that they are discussing just doesn't make sense. To the average viewer, whom the Marketing arm (and let's not think for a minute that the Technical guys, all due respect to Mr Webb, appear to be driving this change) are attempting to appeal, the sport has created a class that is "only" 200cc smaller than the "big" bikes. Irrespective of all the technical intricacies that will keep a separation in lap times to a substantially noticeable difference, the average viewer isn't going to see the point, even if it is explained to them. I can see eyes glazing now when I'm asked to explain that one to friends and workmates who have only a passing interest in the sport.

The change is being driven by the Japanese factories.
The only European alternative presented was 450-550 V-Twins.

Expect the new formula to tightly regulated (intake restrictions etc) and prehaps even production based (in terms of the basic engine block).
The tension is between giving the factories what they want and cost to the private teams.
A claiming rule has been discussed.

[James Deuce]

A claiming rule has been discussed.

Oh God no.

[Crasherfromwayback]

The change is being driven by the Japanese factories.
The only European alternative presented was 450-550 V-Twins.

Expect the new formula to tightly regulated (intake restrictions etc) and prehaps even production based (in terms of the basic engine block).
The tension is between giving the factories what they want and cost to the private teams.
A claiming rule has been discussed.

My major grip is that if I wanna see bikes like that I'll go to a Superbike meeting and watch the 600 proddie based supersports race.. I love GP's because they're racing 250 strokers...that AND the GP bikes of course!

[Grub]

A claiming rule has been discussed.

Now if I knew what that meant, I might be concerned too James

[James Deuce]

If your bike is better than mine I can take it off you.

[codgyoleracer]

Will be interesting to see the field sizes in a few years time as the 4-strokes take-over. Cost to do the R&D & build/maintain, will be waaaaay greater than the 2 smokes..........

[Mental Trousers]

The 600cc framework that they are discussing just doesn't make sense. To the average viewer, whom the Marketing arm (and let's not think for a minute that the Technical guys, all due respect to Mr Webb, appear to be driving this change) are attempting to appeal, the sport has created a class that is "only" 200cc smaller than the "big" bikes. Irrespective of all the technical intricacies that will keep a separation in lap times to a substantially noticeable difference, the average viewer isn't going to see the point, even if it is explained to them. I can see eyes glazing now when I'm asked to explain that one to friends and workmates who have only a passing interest in the sport.

Just imagine the conversation between 2 Nascar diehards watching bikes.

Elma: Watcha watching?
Earl: MotoGP2
Elma: Wat do they race?
Earl: Six hunnards
Elma: Aint that those SuperSports?
Earl: Nah. They're Six Hunnards too, but different
Elma: How?
Earl: Dunno. Some tek-knee-col stuff
Elma: So they're different but the same size huh. Who makes em?
Earl: Same companies
Elma: So there's Suzuki, Honda, Kawasaki, Yamaha ..... umm is that right
Earl: Yep. Near's I can figure
Elma: ......
Earl: Yep

Displacement has always been a point of differentiation between the Grand Prix classes and the Production based classes. The GP classes have traditionally been smaller engines with an equal or higher power output to the larger Production engines. That has always made the GP classes the elite. But that won't be the case any longer.

I would've thought a spec engine would be the best way to go:

All bikes will have a naturally aspirated engine with aaa stroke, bbb bore, ccc valve lift, ddd valve area, a single sparkplug per cylinder and will all use the same ECU.

[tri boy]

This just proves I'm making the right decision being involved with an expat who is trying to build up his classic two stroke racing team. (three sidecars, and an unknown qty of two wheelers).
Fuck the big players, grass roots is where it's at in all sports.
(stay tuned for further details on the team. But don't expect too much this year)

[CHOPPA]

600s are going to be great! Atleast we can see more development filter down to us, our 600cc bikes will get better and better the 250s dont have any influence on modern bikes. I guess we might see some funky engine configurations to set them apart from the supersports, its a great thing for the sport

[xwhatsit]

I guess we might see some funky engine configurations to set them apart from the supersports, its a great thing for the sport

Well no, unfortunately, as written in the article, one is limited to a maximum of four cylinders and a bunch of restrictions such as camshafts, ECU, max RPM etc. `Production sourced' components too. So they're going to be pretty standard sort of straight and vee fours.

[CHOPPA]

Well no, unfortunately, as written in the article, one is limited to a maximum of four cylinders and a bunch of restrictions such as camshafts, ECU, max RPM etc. `Production sourced' components too. So they're going to be pretty standard sort of straight and vee fours.

it would be interesting to see some v4 600s....

[NordieBoy]

Sounds far to restrictive for a MotoGP class
MotoGP should be along the lines of
"The first proposal to surface came from a joint front of IRTA and Dorna. Basically, it is for in-line four-stroke engines with a capacity of somewhere between 625 and 650cc. Components will have to be sourced from 'production sources' and teams will be supplied with a standard control ECU and data logging to enable policing of a rev limit. Cranks, con rods, valves and camshafts will all have minimum weight limits, there will also be an overall minimum weight limit, and there will be controls on valve lift, etc all with the objective of keeping costs down."