MotoGP 2011 250cc 2stroke replaced by 600cc 4 stroke, its official.

[sub_low]

"On Friday 27th June at the A-Style TT Assen the FIM made the following announcement:

The Grand Prix Commission, composed of Messrs. Carmelo Ezpeleta (Dorna, Chairman), Claude Danis (FIM), Herve Poncharal (IRTA) and Takanao Tsubouchi (MSMA), in the presence of Mr. Paul Butler (Secretary of the meeting), unanimously decided to introduce the following change to the FIM Road Racing World Championship Grand Prix Regulations.


Replacement of the 250cc class
For application from 1.1.2011, the Grand Prix Commission accepted the following proposal, taken by the majority of members of MSMA: 4-stroke engines of 600cc maximum and 4 cylinders maximum. A request will be sent to all manufacturers. The candidatures of the manufacturers interested in taking part in the new class must be sent to the FIM and Dorna by July 31, 2008 at the latest. More precise technical specifications will then be discussed and established

Bugger!!!

guess nows the time to go buy an RS250 to put in storage for a bit of fun in the future before all strokers are well and truly gone

[Coyote]

It doesn't make sense to have a class so close to the now 800's. Wouldn't 400-500 be a better choice? (No, I'm not biased).

They always give 4 strokes the advantage to let them dominate. It happened to Motocross sadly.

[James Deuce]

They need similar lap times to keep the interest up. Can't say it will work for me. It will no doubt be about as interesting as whatever replaced F3000 as the feeder class for F1.

You know.

Not Interesting.

Full on 400cc prototypes would make sense given Japan's licensing restrictions. Honda have no balls since Soichiro died.

What's the point of Stuporsport and Stuporstock 600s now? Talk about misdirected energy.

[sub_low]

Yeah your not wrong i cant get my head around it either. Especially when the idea to go 1litre 4stroke not long ago was due to on paper that equates to a 500 2stroke. Then they pull it back to 800 to enable the safe use of the power thus making the lap times fall. In this case it seems the other way, they are going over the mark.

I guess due to the smaller displacement of the 250cc a 500 4 stroke just wouldnt have it. who knows. One things for sure though it could mean a whole new line of 600's with some VERY cool fetures as the technology trickles down to production models. I love the sound of a 600cc
V4 sitting on my driveway.

[Sully60]

Some interesting points have been brought up in this Julian Ryder article...


http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2008/Jun/080624b.htm

[sub_low]

Some interesting points have been brought up in this Julian Ryder article...


http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2008/Jun/080624b.htm

Yes good artical, makes ya think dont it.

[Coyote]

I guess due to the smaller displacement of the 250cc a 500 4 stroke just wouldnt have it. who knows. One things for sure though it could mean a whole new line of 600's with some VERY cool fetures as the technology trickles down to production models. I love the sound of a 600cc
V4 sitting on my driveway.

That would be cool. A modern V4 400 would be even better (this time I'm being biased).

What's the point of Stuporsport and Stuporstock 600s now? Talk about misdirected energy.

They're so dead set on getting 4 strokes in they're not really thinking of the implications. It's like the dog with the steak looking at his reflection in the river.

[lostinflyz]

for 100000 pounds you get very little. a few scrapes of metal and a couple of days with a welding robot.

with them being budget 600's more than likely will mean that they are supersport bikes with ohlins and slicks. id rather watch supersport (most the guys this year are pretty nutter)

but either way honda will end up spending millions and dominating. how long till the budgets get to several million pounds. With any prototype machine u want to win so you keep spending till you win.

[xwhatsit]

Max four cylinders -- so these will be low-spec, standard sort of 600cc inline fours. No crazy V5 monsters like in the higher classes. Keep costs down, standard sort of engine. 400 or 500 too highly strung? Also, standard ECUs, rev limit, minimum weight according to article. Article also says, designed to be cheap bikes, €100,000, instead of €500,000 to lease even a current 125.

So cost is at heart. Mega expensive to run current 250 2T. Sure the stroker boys here will tell you `nah, it's cheap to rebuild a 2T, look at MX, 4-strokes are way too pricey to rebuild', but I suspect they're not running a front-running 250GP MotoGP team spending €4.5 million to lease this year's bikes. It makes sense -- big capacity, low-stressed (by the maximum valve lift, maximum revs limits blah blah) four-stroke engines are going to be cheaper. Don't forget it's mainstream tech as well -- I'm guessing here, but I imagine producing next year's über-fast 250 2T is sort of a niche thing, bleeding edge technology, lots of money spent on R&D. Whereas a four-cylinder four-stroke with these limits set on it -- every man and his dog is making one of those. So smaller budgets again.

Bit sad to let money dictate where a sport is going, but then again it is the feeder classes, apparently the fields are shrinking. Spend the money on the big-bucks top class. Two-strokes are great, but it's understandable.

What is odd is the apparent clash with Soopah Sprot etc. Still a fair bit of differentiation between the two -- proper race bike chassis, aero, more interesting engines (although it does say `production sourced' components). I don't think MotoGP cares much, do they?

[James Deuce]

There's far too much bollocks going into the thinking around the top end formulas.

800cc MotoGP - Do what you want. Spend as much as you want.

400cc MotoGP2 - Max 4 cyclinder. Spend as much as you want. Replacs 250 two strokes.

200cc MotoGP3 - Max 2 cylinder. Spend as much as you want. Replaces 125 two strokes.

Bit like the original GP rules. 500cc. 350cc. 250cc. 125cc. 80cc. 50cc.

Logic doesn't come into it though. "We need to maximise viewer potential."

Why? They all end up looking the same and performing the same if you "Nascar" the rules. The people who do the best job should be allowed to win. In my not so humble opinion. Close racing isn't as exciting as the technical scope and rider talent needed to win.

If you want close racing you have Superbikes which should be road bikes. No S or R Homologation specials.

[xwhatsit]

Logic doesn't come into it though. "We need to maximise viewer potential."

Why? They all end up looking the same and performing the same if you "Nascar" the rules. The people who do the best job should be allowed to win. In my not so humble opinion. Close racing isn't as exciting as the technical scope and rider talent needed to win.

If you want close racing you have Superbikes which should be road bikes. No S or R Homologation specials.

There's the cock-up, yep. Confusing what sort of viewers they have. MotoGP viewers are more like F1 viewers -- high technology, peak of human ability, blah blah. Superbike is more like tin-top racing. Close, lots of passing and leader changes, bangs and crashes.

People don't watch F1 to see Hamilton bashing Kimi off the track in a silly ill-thought out move. They watch it because it is the peak of racing -- bleeding edge.

This seems to be an effort to appeal to a different audience. Putting TV viewers above the purpose of the class is odd -- trying to poach the other class's viewers?

[Oscar]

The Technical Director of MotoGP, Mike Webb is a Kiwi and a good friend.

This class is far from decided as the factories have to present their ideas (within that formula) for discussion.

[Mort]

People don't watch F1 to see Hamilton bashing Kimi off the track in a silly ill-thought out move. They watch it because it is the peak of racing -- bleeding edge.

yes and they leave in droves when its dull racing with dull characters.

[jade]

guess nows the time to go buy an RS250 to put in storage for a bit of fun in the future before all strokers are well and truly gone

Im leaving the country to go do some boatbuilding in a week...
wont be back for quite a while... my RS is going into storage on wednesday, Ill never sell it

[yod]

http://www.motogp.com/en/news/2008/N...50cc+from+2011