So who's the terrorist again?

[mowgli]

once the oil supply reaches the tipping point, i.e it's no longer viable to extract it, refine it or sell it cos the masses cant afford it and HAVE to use alternate forms of energy, that is when the real fun will start. The massive fortunes accumulated by the oil controllers will have to be used to develop and distribute the alternatives or they will lose control of us all.

You won't have to wait that long. The Sheiks are already buying up multinational companies to secure non-energy market share well before the tipping point. The emirates will continue to get rich well after the oil is gone.

[alanzs]

I wish that this was true but some peope don't. I spoke to some Isralis when Netanyahu first got elected and they were so pleased and that they didn't want peace with the Palestinians. When I asked in amazement why, they stated that the blood bath that would ensue between the Ultra orthodox Jews and secular jews after peace with the Palestinians would be far worse than anything that had been seen before. This was because the Ultra's saw secular Jews as scum the same as the Palestinians.

And here was me always thinkiing that peace was good.

There's always people that want to push their agenda, no matter the cost. A few names for these people come to mind; extremists and fundamentalist.

[awayatc]

Extremists anywhere are a minority that cause the majority of all conflicts.
Not a single extremist ever has been or will be right....

[alanzs]

Extremists anywhere are a minority that cause the majority of all conflicts.
Not a single extremist ever has been or will be right....

Hallelujah, can I get a witness? Amen Brother Awayatc!...

Oooppps, I meant, you are right...

[mstriumph]

Not entirely accurate. According to the 2008 census conducted by Israeli Central Bureau of Statistics,
Israelis i.e. citizens of the state of Israel have the following ethnic makeup:

Ethnic group	Population	% of total (7282000)
Jewish	5499000	75.5%
Arab	1461000	20%
Other	309900	4.4%

mmmmmm - ok, given that a jew is anyone born of a jewish mother or acceptably converted, that still leaves us with several divisions and degrees of observance

the post i was responding to concerned the lumping of everyone into the same barrel [if you read his post you'll understand where i was coming from]
...... when i said 'strict jews' in my post, i was talking about the super-frum, the kosher of the kosherest ..... not your average jew-in-the-street, secular jews, reform jews, traditional jews or whatever - just the ones that get REALLY cross and barricade streets before the Sabbath and suchlike ...... so, if you can re-make your statistics on that basis, i'd like to see it....... but, as you aren't allowed to count them how DO they perform the census?..

[mstriumph]

.....................
Strange that when it is the Polish and other nationalities home being threatened all hell breaks lose but when a few 'rag-heads' lose thier home and try to defend it (with some help from thier neighbours) people get offended.

'rag-heads' is an offensive term to many, me included
but, that aside, i scarcely think that an all-round arab attack swearing to push the new state into the sea can be dismissed as people 'trying to defend their home with some help from their neighbours' ........

there's a lot wrong on both sides..... name-calling and emotive language don't help anything

[idleidolidyll]

Quotes of Value

“The greatest crime since World War II has been U.S. foreign policy.”

— Ramsey Clark
former U.S. Attorney General

[idleidolidyll]

Quotes of Value

“If ‘terrorism’ means ‘intimidation by violence or the threat of violence,’ and if we allow the definition to include violence by states and agents of states, then it is these, not isolated individuals or small groups, that are the important terrorists in the world.
“If terrorist violence is measured by the extent of politically motivated torture and murder, ...it is in the U.S.-sponsored and protected ‘authoritarian’ states — the real terror network — that these forms of violence have reached a high crescendo in recent decades.”

— Edward S. Herman
The Real Terror Network

[idleidolidyll]

Quotes of Value

“I suspected I was just part of a racket at the time. Now I am sure of it. Like all members of the military profession I never had an original thought until I left the service. My mental faculties remained in suspended animation while I obeyed the orders of the higher-ups. This is typical with everyone in the military service.”

— General Smedley Butler
USMC (Ret.)

[idleidolidyll]

Quotes of Value

“If they turn on the radars we’re going to blow up their goddamn SAMs [surface-to-air missiles]. They know we own their country. We own their airspace... We dictate the way they live and talk. And that’s what’s great about America right now. It’s a good thing, especially when there’s a lot of oil out there we need.”

— U.S. Brig. General William Looney
Washington Post, August 30, 1999
referring, in reality, to the brutal mass-murder
of hundreds of civilian Iraqi men, women and children
during 10,000 sorties by American/British war criminals
in the first eight months of 1999

[idleidolidyll]

Quotes of Value

“The trouble is that when American dollars earn only six percent over here, they get restless and go overseas to get 100 percent. The flag follows the dollar and the soldiers follow the flag.
“I wouldn’t go to war again as I have done to defend some lousy investment of the bankers. We should fight only for the defense of our home and the Bill of Rights. War for any other reason is simply a racket.
“There isn’t a trick in the racketeering bag that the military gang is blind to. It had its ‘finger men’ to point out enemies, its ‘muscle men’ to destroy enemies, its ‘brain men’ to plan war preparations and a ‘Big Boss’ — supernationalistic capitalism.
“I spent 33 years in the Marines. Most of my time being a high-class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. In short, I was a racketeer for capitalism.
“I helped purify Nicaragua for the international banking house of Brown Brothers in 1909-1912. I helped make Mexico and especially Tampico safe for American oil interests in 1914. I brought light to the Dominican Republic for American sugar interests in 1916. I helped make Haiti and Cuba a decent place for the National City Bank boys to collect revenue in. I helped in the rape of half a dozen Central American republics for the benefit of Wall Street.
“War is a racket.”

— General Smedley D. Butler
former U.S. Marine Commandant
in Common Sense
November 1935

[idleidolidyll]

Quotes of Value

“The hidden hand of the market will never work without a hidden fist — McDonald’s cannot flourish without McDonnel Douglas, the designer of the F-15.”

— Thomas L. Friedman
New York Times columnist
“A Manifesto for the Fast World”
New York Times Magazine
March 28, 1999

“The nationalist not only does not disapprove of atrocities committed by his own side, but he has a remarkable capacity for not even hearing about them.”

— George Orwell
author of 1984

“... the United States has given frequent and enthusiastic support to the overthrow of democracy in favor of ‘investor friendly’ regimes.
“The World Bank, IMF, and private banks have consistently lavished huge sums on terror regimes, following their displacement of democratic governments, and a number of quantitative studies have shown a systematic positive relationship between U.S. and IMF/World Bank aid to countries and their violations of human rights.”

— Edward S. Herman
economist, U.S. media and foreign policy critic
author of The Real Terror Network

[idleidolidyll]

American state terrorism is an old tradition

“The use of terror is deeply ingrained in our [national] character. Back in 1818, John Quincy Adams hailed the ‘salutary efficacy’ of terror in dealing with ‘mingled hordes of lawless Indians and negroes.’ He wrote that to justify Andrew Jackson’s rampages in Florida which virtually annihilated the native population and left the Spanish province under US control, much impressing Thomas Jefferson and others with his wisdom.”

— Noam Chomsky
What Uncle Sam Really Wants

“I did not know how much was ended. When I look back now from this high hill of my old age, I can see the butchered women and children lying heaped and scattered all along the crooked gulch as plain as I saw them with eyes still young. And I can see that something else died there in the bloody mud, and was buried in the blizzard. A people’s dream died there. It was a beautiful dream...”

— Black Elk
Oglala Holy Man
on the aftermath of the Massacre at Wounded Knee

The massacre at Wounded Knee, South Dakota took place in December, 1890. Soldiers of the United States Army Seventh Cavalry used gattling guns to slaughter 300 helpless Lakota children, men and women.

“...I have seen that we do not intend to free, but to subjugate the people of the Philippines. We have gone to conquer, not to redeem... And so I am an anti-imperialist. I am opposed to having the [American] eagle put its talons on any other land.”

— Mark Twain
October 15, 1900
The New York Herald
condemning the genocide of the Philippine people
which began in 1899 and lasted to 1902

“We have pacified some thousands of the [Philippine] islanders and buried them; destroyed their fields; burned their villages, and turned their widows and orphans out-of-doors; furnished heartbreak by exile to some dozens of disagreeable patriots; subjugated the remaining ten millions by Benevolent Assimilation, which is the pious new name of the musket; we have acquired property in the three hundred concubines and other slaves of our business partner, the Sultan of Sulu, and hoisted our protecting flag over that swag.
“And so, by these Providences of God — and the phrase is the government’s, not mine — we are a World Power.”

— Mark Twain

“America was born in blood. America suckled on blood. America gorged on blood and grew into a giant, and America will drown in blood.”

— Thomas W. Chittum
Vietnam veteran
in his book Civil War Two

[idleidolidyll]

Some people have to really solve extremely complex issues that require action in an amazingly complex world, not just rant in chat rooms on motorcycle boards.
Again, what would you do? I think everyone would welcome your thoughts on actions to successfully solve the issue you brought up.

you want me to solve all the problems of the world on the internet?
please, don't be ridiculous

i'm no deity, i don't have super powers; i only see hypocrisy, injustice and lies and ask people to open their eyes and their minds.
we are all small indeed compared to those who create the terror. we can make a small difference by identifying lies, propaganda and amorality and trying ourselves not to accept it. That's what I try to do and my posts here are just a part of that culture.

To sit back and allow lies and abuse to go unchallenged is tantamount to supporting the same.

What can we do? We can all speak out and reject the wholesale terrorism of states and corporations; terrorism far greater than any of puny groups like AQ, Red Brigade, ETA, IRA et al

Nobody is expected to lay down their life in some tragidrama in order to prove they have done something to combat the evils of the world. Some will of course but the real strength we little people have is the mass of our collective voices. If we say nothing, do nothing and allow the abuse to continue without question; we are fulfilling the 200+ year old expectations of Edmund Burke:
"For evil to prevail, all it takes is for good men to do nothing"

[Flatcap]

Quotes of Value

Old people don't need companionship. They need to be isolated and studied so it can be determined what nutrients they have that might be extracted for our personal use.

Homer J Simpson