Racetech gold valve install - self-install?

[cowpoos]

Yeah mate, I agree with you. But I think I'm a little like you, where I'd like to either do it myself and learn from the process even if it costs more, or at least have it explained to me, rather than hand over the cash and ride the product home. Am I right here ? So theres my problem. The head wins or the heart wins - which one do you follow ? Yup.

Thanks Frosty.

DB

I reckon go for it Steven!! whats the worst that can happen??

Also I reckon you should remove all the warning lables off your bike and safety gear and household appliances,Tools infact anything with safty instructions and or warning labels...I think it would bode well for you to learn the hard way...after all all these people with mountans of years of experience [centrys in Dr Bob the tory pheasent plucker's case ] giving you advice are obviously full of themselves.


Okay...now for my unsarcastic opinion...sell the hyosung and upgrade. they are good bikes for the price....but are built to that price. the upgrade difference between yours as a trade and upgrading suspension...would probally net you a very nice second hand 600 or maybe a nice ducati 600ss or a cheap 748...all which would run rings around the hyosungs handling.

[TLDV8]

Fitting (fork) Goldvalves is not that hard if you have a lathe and mill to construct the tools needed to disassemble the forks which i think is a key part.

You need a spring compressor for starters on USD forks.



Once you have removed the cartridge you need to remove the carrier (hardly the right description) from the damper tube without damaging it in any form as it has a 2mm wall thickness (or less) the Goldvalve is fitted to that item.
You would need to check the condition of the fork while there,seals,bushs,run out etc etc.
You then rely on the stack recommended by RaceTech,i used a a C35 in the 2002 GSXR1000 forks on the yellow TLS,it is not quite right and this is where experience comes in,i am not sure what shim stack would be an improvement.
Not to mention,the GSXR Kayaba's (like TL1000 Kayaba's) seem to have a tolerance problem with the rebound needles,the compression needles also perhaps so they might need aftermarket replacements.
Be assured although i have good mechanical experience and the ability to make the needed tools and reassemble things,you would not want me to set the suspension settings on your bike
I can follow directions though which is why i will rely on Robert Taylor when it comes time to fit the suspension package he is constructing for my DR650.
There is no real harm (if sensible) in doing things yourself but quite often the most realistic route can be using a professional. (in my opinion only)
(Taking for granted the professional knows what they are doing)
It is somewhat a double edged sword as i am all for the Kiwi have a go tradition.
Only you know what you can or can't attempt.
Rear coil over dampers i guess are similar but from my experience are hard to bleed properly.(which means it wont work so off to a professional to do < am sure they love that )
Obviously any changes to shimming means total disassembly over and over.
I guess your own time is free,depending on your patience. (if you get it right in the end)

Robert is sending Emulators for the forks which i have not fitted before so that will be something new. (I am guessing the DR fork is old school damper rod.)

[Squiggles]

However, I don't need or care about a "ten orders of magnitude" improvement - a "two orders of magnitude" improvement will suffice.

Seeing as there is a fair bit of economics in your decision, say it costs a grand to do it professionally, and 300 to do it yourself. With a 10 fold improvement from the pro's, or a 2 fold improvement from you... You're loosing out a little there Only one of the options guarantees improvement without seat of the pants testing... "I spent all this money on it, it must be better!"

I'm quite happy to attempt work unless i think its out of my league (there are also those times when i just want it done by someone else, to save me the time/hassle)
I look at this, see i could do the install they've given, but i would want the best i could get from the product, and knowing that the install guides still arent going to give me that, i would entrust it to someone who could.

[CookMySock]

So I spend 300bux on my bike, learn something new, bike goes better, and I have fun. Not good value ?

If anything, I'll pull them apart and get my local techie to cast his beady eye over it and see what can be done with the cartridges. In a few months I'll be in a better position to choose too.

Anyone wanna buy some scuba units ?

DB

[Squiggles]

So I spend 300bux on my bike, learn something new, bike goes better, and I have fun. Not good value ?

Depends what you want from the bike, i hate having to touch my tl when it comes to things like this, ill take the advice of the pros on the options available, then have them do it

Got other bikes, $300 ones, to have fun and fiddle with

Enjoy your wee adventure

[Robert Taylor]

Robert Taylor said ''Its interesting that so few people have fitted the kits themselves'' Well, in fact I absolutely did not make that statement and who can reasonably tell what percentage of kits have been ''home fitted'' ?????

DB, I know its tempting to listen to everyones 2 cents worth but often its a little akin to going to your hairdresser for legal or medical advice. Sure a number of people will have successfully fitted kits and I suspect a good many had to swallow their pride and ask for help because the instructions by no means cover every little detail and eventuality.
There are so many subtle differences in flow path variations etc that the generic valving curves can often be several steps away, or as we have found in a number of instances we end up with a completely different valving arrangement to what Race Tech suggest in the progression curves.
The danger lies in listening to those who maybe have fitted one or two kits and then have made a blanket assumption that its simple and straightforward for everything. ( and then needlessly embellished their position with a little bit of sarcasm ) In my unapologetically considerable experience that is absolutely not so!
In the case of the Hyosung it is an ''orphan'' as far as ready documentation of the standard components as a term of reference, but I can tell you that the front fork springs are the first thing you should be ditching, $300 on just a gold valve kit is not going to adequately do the job, it may address the compression damping issue but it doesnt address the fork spring issue or any rebound issues.
Please note that any advice I am offering is in good spirit even though suggesting more money be spent is not always music to the ears. I make no apology to anyone for offering the technically correct solutions and for stressing the desirability of quality control.

[CookMySock]

Yes, no worries Robert. I make no bones about your expertise, experience, or any part of your operation.

Yes, I have read this evening that a correct rebound curve is vital to the successful operation of the damper, and a gold valve kit doesn't add this. I'm rather stumped by this revelation actually.

It is just a matter of following my heart on things. Is there any other way ?

I'll consider my many options and make my choice. Thank you to all.

This thread is about cars, but the suspension/tech side of it was VERY interesting.
http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=166909

Steve

[Robert Taylor]

Yes, no worries Robert. I make no bones about your expertise, experience, or any part of your operation.

Yes, I have read this evening that a correct rebound curve is vital to the successful operation of the damper, and a gold valve kit doesn't add this. I'm rather stumped by this revelation actually.

It is just a matter of following my heart on things. Is there any other way ?

I'll consider my many options and make my choice. Thank you to all.

This thread is about cars, but the suspension/tech side of it was VERY interesting.
http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=166909

Steve

Thats an interesting forum, thanks. Mirrors the same dealings we have with car shocks and yes the issues and techniques are pretty much the same, just a few different chassis dynamics to contend with.

[CookMySock]

Thats an interesting forum, thanks. Mirrors the same dealings we have with car shocks and yes the issues and techniques are pretty much the same, just a few different chassis dynamics to contend with.

Loving those graphs.. What a difference the rebound curve seems to make, and how similar the compression curve is over many digressive shocks - almost as if the compression curve is non-critical. Rebound is where the magic happens Robert ?

See, now I'm all tempted to find a geared electric motor, load cell, A/D card and make a dyno for fun.

Gah, reality check, brokeass! No workshop. Dreaming..

DB

[Robert Taylor]

Loving those graphs.. What a difference the rebound curve seems to make, and how similar the compression curve is over many digressive shocks - almost as if the compression curve is non-critical. Rebound is where the magic happens Robert ?

See, now I'm all tempted to find a geared electric motor, load cell, A/D card and make a dyno for fun.

Gah, reality check, brokeass! No workshop. Dreaming..

DB

In truth we do a lot of work with both but yes, there is a lot more importance to the shape and force values of the rebound curve than many give credit to.
Digressive compression curves are also not a ''holy grail'' Very often you need appreciable slope to the curve beyond the initial hold up knee and nose. This to ''catch'' over sudden movements and on a race track to aid brake dive resistance. This is where 25mm aftermarket cartridges have an advantage because there is more surface area of piston and more mass flow.

[DEATH_INC.]

I'm gonna say have a go at it yourself. Haven't done a hyosung but been inside a few shocks/forks and with common sense and a reasonable mechanical ability the install is easy enough. This isn't taking into account the 'black art' that is suspension tuning though....that's RT's department....

[XP@]

I've just had emulators fitted on my Transalp and it's made a massive difference. I've got one hell of a lot more confidence in the corners now, much nicer ride!

No, I did not fit them myself, deciding I would buy a bit of expertise from Kerri Dukie ( http://www.dukicperformance.com/ ) at the same time. The result is if they were set up correctly (well as far as i can tell!) the first time. I also had a very good, personal, "suspension 101" thrown in. Totally worth the extra fitting costs for reduced risk and right first time factors.

DB did you get yours sorted? if so, what was the verdict?

[CookMySock]

Naw we ran outa money and ended up in hibernate mode. Growl.

How much did you spend? Did you take the forks off and send them away, or did they do the whole job ?

Steve

[Shaun]

I'm gonna say have a go at it yourself. Haven't done a hyosung but been inside a few shocks/forks and with common sense and a reasonable mechanical ability the install is easy enough. This isn't taking into account the 'black art' that is suspension tuning though....that's RT's department....

And RT is the best in the country

[Robert Taylor]

I've just had emulators fitted on my Transalp and it's made a massive difference. I've got one hell of a lot more confidence in the corners now, much nicer ride!

No, I did not fit them myself, deciding I would buy a bit of expertise from Kerri Dukie ( http://www.dukicperformance.com/ ) at the same time. The result is if they were set up correctly (well as far as i can tell!) the first time. I also had a very good, personal, "suspension 101" thrown in. Totally worth the extra fitting costs for reduced risk and right first time factors.

DB did you get yours sorted? if so, what was the verdict?

Were they genuine brass Race Tech emulators or were they the mainland Asian rip off copies? If they are the Asian ones ask that they are swapped for the long term reliable US product. The Asian ones wear quickly and the poppet springs sack out. We know, we tested and analysed them.