Get ready to hit your kids...

[Grahameeboy]

Consequeces <= smacking.

less than??..........

[Flatcap]

less than??..........

Clearly I was being too subtle.

Consequences do not always have to be smacking, however this should remain an option

[Grahameeboy]

Clearly I was being too subtle.

Consequences do not always have to be smacking, however this should remain an option

I agree with first point, not second...if a parent cannot sort their kid out in a non-smacking way then there is a problem...I know there is no manual, however, smacking is not necessary...it is low level violence which some parents excuse for discipline

[Flatcap]

I agree with first point, not second...if a parent cannot sort their kid out in a non-smacking way then there is a problem...I know there is no manual, however, smacking is not necessary...it is low level violence which some parents excuse for discipline

OK - define smacking from your viewpoint.....

[Grahameeboy]

OK - define smacking from your viewpoint.....

From what I have seen a sharp slap of the hand...still not necessary

[RDJ]

The term 'reasonable force' is subjective. What is reasonable? The goalposts change according to social concience at any particular time. The punishment I was subjected to as a child is neither here nor there right now. Right now it is a determining the future

Reasonable is indeed very difficult to define. But we can agree can we not with utmost certainty that the Lillybings and Kahuis were never subjected to reasonable force.

And none of the Bradford-inspired sophistries that (in summary) attempt to convince us all that there is an inevitable and irresistible continuum from smacking your child for playing with matches or running across the street and risking their death (to illustrate two common uses of the palm of the parental hand to canalise the cortex of the child of the 50s for the child's own protection and benefit), to murdering your child as per the above examples, have any basis in fact or logic.

Pain is an effective way of learning. If you don't know it hurts - it you don't feel it hurt / learn that it hurts - you leave your skin in the sun till it turns red and your fingers in the fire till they char.

[Flatcap]

From what I have seen a sharp slap of the hand...still not necessary

So what do you think a slap on the hand does to a child?

[Grahameeboy]

Reasonable is indeed very difficult to define. But we can agree can we not with utmost certainty that the Lillybings and Kahuis were never subjected to reasonable force.

And none of the Bradford-inspired sophistries that (in summary) attempt to convince us all that there is an inevitable and irresistible continuum from smacking your child for playing with matches or running across the street and risking their death (to illustrate two common uses of the palm of the parental hand to canalise the cortex of the child of the 50s for the child's own protection and benefit), to murdering your child as per the above examples, have any basis in fact or logic.

Pain is an effective way of learning. If you don't know it hurts - it you don't feel it hurt / learn that it hurts - you leave your skin in the sun till it turns red and your fingers in the fire till they char.

You think physical pain is an effective way of learning?

[Grahameeboy]

So what do you think a slap on the hand does to a child?

Only the child can answer that??

I have the advantage that I cannot smack Nats and know that you don't need to either...even when she is driving an 85kg wheelchair heading towards you!!

[Flatcap]

Only the child can answer that??

I have the advantage that I cannot smack Nats and know that you don't need to either...even when she is driving an 85kg wheelchair heading towards you!!

Come on - thats a cop out.

You are arguing against smacking, yet you are telling us you have no conception of what the impact of smacking is on a child?

[RDJ]

You think physical pain is an effective way of learning?

What I think is not as relevant here, as are the facts of neurophysiology and behaviour modification. Pain (as in developing a reflex aversive / avoidance response to stimuli previously experienced to be unpleasant, noxious and therefore worth avoiding) is indeed an effective teacher. Now people may reasonably disagree about whether pain should be administered by parents, as a way to develop risk aversion in children; but one surely cannot ignore the fact that the experience of pain is an effective modifier of future behaviour.

[Grahameeboy]

Come on - thats a cop out.

You are arguing against smacking, yet you are telling us you have no conception of what the impact of smacking is on a child?

No, I don't have a choice...

Nope, whether or not smacking has an impact or not to me is irrelevant, I just don't agree with the need to smack

[Flatcap]

No, I don't have a choice...

Nope, whether or not smacking has an impact or not to me is irrelevant, I just don't agree with the need to smack

So you are applying dogma rather that reasoned opinion.

Perfect

[Grahameeboy]

What I think is not as relevant here, as are the facts of neurophysiology and behaviour modification. Pain (as in developing a reflex aversive / avoidance response to stimuli previously experienced to be unpleasant, noxious and therefore worth avoiding) is indeed an effective teacher. Now people may reasonably disagree about whether pain should be administered by parents, as a way to develop risk aversion in children; but one surely cannot ignore the fact that the experience of pain is an effective modifier of future behaviour.

I don't agree....simple as that...sorry

[Flatcap]

I don't agree....simple as that...sorry

You forgot to say "SO THERE!"