MNZ announces Motards back in F3!

[Nicksta]

everyone here has valid points....
a worry i have is that it is left to the club/organisers to police the "road style" does this mean there will be racers protesting other racers? Flag marshalls monitoring the motards? or the rider's rep being inundated with racers complaining and how will it be judged/penalised?
the only other worry is that if they don't stick to the riding style I fear the consequences will be costly to other riders' bikes and bodies. I'd hate to see an accident where someone gets hurt because someone didnt ride in the right "style"... riding habits are sometimes hard to change.... can a motard rider really go from a motard race straight into an F3 race and remember to not back it in and put their foot out??

[t3mp0r4ry nzr]

Hello random lines, feet to run over, handlebars in the throat, finding bikes with 20ks less corner speed parked at the apex (and no way past), fast starting, crazy block passes in the first corner, slow laps holding up roadrace bikes

hell, sounds great.....to watch!! will leave the racing to you crazy cats, good luck, you will need plenty!

[t3mp0r4ry nzr]

everyone here has valid points....
a worry i have is that it is left to the club/organisers to police the "road style" does this mean there will be racers protesting other racers? Flag marshalls monitoring the motards? or the rider's rep being inundated with racers complaining and how will it be judged/penalised?
the only other worry is that if they don't stick to the riding style I fear the consequences will be costly to other riders' bikes and bodies. I'd hate to see an accident where someone gets hurt because someone didnt ride in the right "style"... riding habits are sometimes hard to change.... can a motard rider really go from a motard race straight into an F3 race and remember to not back it in and put their foot out??

MNZ dont care! offroad membership takes up 90% (correct me if wrong) of all MNZ membership. MNZ want a feederclass to get those 'muddies interested in road racing, racing in a class with little build up costs for reasons of getting more income for the coffa's (to be reinvested in offroad events, not the NZ road race champs heavens forebid) and at the cost of the F3 class and headache of the clubs running club events. as if their job wasnt hard enough to start with!

Poor F3 would have a complex. First it was too old, so modern pro-twin racers were let in, now its not exciting enough, so needs some argy bargy and carnage! Whats next


...now, need to find a motard

[Quasievil]

Im not defending Motards here (only just brought one) but people GET OVER THE FOOT OUT Thing !! a motarders foot isnt out at right angles its out infront of the peg, no further out than a sportsbikers knee.
so how about sportsbike racers keep there knee in and for that matter the elbows

lastly, very few motarders back it in anyway

some of you are being a bit bloody precious

[GaZBur]

...lastly, very few motarders back it in anyway

some of you are being a bit bloody precious

That is correct. As i said in my submission to MNZ I raced at the Burt Munroe last year. At Teretonga a few Motarders tried the foot out approach on a couple of corners for about 2 laps and stopped when they found everyone else whipping by on the outside. We would have been safe racing with F3 as we were all taking road racing lines and keeping the foot on the peg. The next day at Wyndham was totally different, due to right angle corners short straights and a dodgy surface there was lots of sideways action and mixing classes would have been carnage. I have ridden alongside sportsbikes at track days and had not problems with conflicting stye as there isn't any conflict on an open race circuit.

[Deano]

Youre right though with a F3 class and a Motard class I doubt I would run in F3 .................they to slow anyway

Bring it big boy !!

[GSVR]

I think the way the Victoria Club includes motards into the meetings is the most sensible way. Its unfortunate they don't have another class to cross enter into.

The motards are not an issue with the faster riders because their laptimes and straightline speed are no match for a well ridden and sorted F3 bike.

Where there is an issue is on small circuits with short straights e.g Old Taupo track, New Taupo Short circuit, Wanganui. There are some very good Motard riders and you end up with a situation like many of you may have experienced at trackdays where you catch a bike that is way faster than you down the straights but is holding you up round the corners. So every time you make a pass it is lost down the next straight and you have to make the pass again.

This is what happens to a motard rider who is has faster laptimes but is slower down the straights. Its not so bad at trackdays but in a race situation when several bikes are involved its a recipe for accidents. Great for spectators and battles can be good fun too. When you get a motard and a F3 bike that are doing the same laptimes but making the speed in different areas after the lead has changed several times the rider (mainly the motard rider who is getting blown off down the straight) starts to get more and more frustrated and starts making riskier passes. Add this to traffic catching up due to the baulking in corners and the situation gets worse. This combined with very different cornering techniques as well.

Motards are great but like motorcross require a more aggressive physical style. The bikes are made to crash well so riders are not as concerned about dropping them as if they do theres seldom much damage. A fully faired F3 bike gets dropped and theres ussually a bit of work to repair it.

Thats basically the issue as I see it. The arguement has been done to death on here. Whatever the rules are people should abide by them. I personally believe there are bigger issues in F3 and ProTwin but as I'm no longer riding think they are the concerns of the people that are active participants.

What is good is to see new people out there giving it a go and doing well.

Glen Williams will be shaking in his boots !!! (ha ha Glen )
Seriously who do they bother ?????

Just the modern generation I suspect ! G.

At club level only time GW ever gets to see a bike in F3 is when he laps them so he's highly unlikely to ever get into a battle with a motard. Starting from 1 on the grid and winning every race must be quite lonely. Atleast when he decides to do an F2 race he gets some action.

[slowpoke]

Bring it big boy !!

That thing is a KTM anyway isn't it Deano, so it's just like racing like? (keep that foot on the peg fella!)

Besides, Quasi isn't "big"....he's just short for his weight....

[svr]

I think the way the Victoria Club includes motards into the meetings is the most sensible way. Its unfortunate they don't have another class to cross enter into.

The motards are not an issue with the faster riders because their laptimes and straightline speed are no match for a well ridden and sorted F3 bike.

Where there is an issue is on small circuits with short straights e.g Old Taupo track, New Taupo Short circuit, Wanganui. There are some very good Motard riders and you end up with a situation like many of you may have experienced at trackdays where you catch a bike that is way faster than you down the straights but is holding you up round the corners. So every time you make a pass it is lost down the next straight and you have to make the pass again.

This is what happens to a motard rider who is has faster laptimes but is slower down the straights. Its not so bad at trackdays but in a race situation when several bikes are involved its a recipe for accidents. Great for spectators and battles can be good fun too. When you get a motard and a F3 bike that are doing the same laptimes but making the speed in different areas after the lead has changed several times the rider (mainly the motard rider who is getting blown off down the straight) starts to get more and more frustrated and starts making riskier passes. Add this to traffic catching up due to the baulking in corners and the situation gets worse. This combined with very different cornering techniques as well.

Motards are great but like motorcross require a more aggressive physical style. The bikes are made to crash well so riders are not as concerned about dropping them as if they do theres seldom much damage. A fully faired F3 bike gets dropped and theres ussually a bit of work to repair it.

Thats basically the issue as I see it. The arguement has been done to death on here. Whatever the rules are people should abide by them. I personally believe there are bigger issues in F3 and ProTwin but as I'm no longer riding think they are the concerns of the people that are active participants.

What is good is to see new people out there giving it a go and doing well.



At club level only time GW ever gets to see a bike in F3 is when he laps them so he's highly unlikely to ever get into a battle with a motard. Starting from 1 on the grid and winning every race must be quite lonely. Atleast when he decides to do an F2 race he gets some action.

All good points Garry, particularly re the differences between circuits, and have all been (pretty much) agreed to in a previous thread.
The concern is that the general interest of motarders has overridden the safety and other concerns of the existing class racers.
Interesting point re GW as well - it seems no one else is interested in running a national level F3 bike at club races.

[slowpoke]

One BIG positive as I see it is that it will mean everyone should get more racing. With motards absorbed into F3 that frees up time to run longer/more races for everyone.

[Deano]

One BIG positive as I see it is that it will mean everyone should get more racing. With motards absorbed into F3 that frees up time to run longer/more races for everyone.

"In race meetings where there are F3/ BEARS class races and also Super Motard class races then the genuine F3/ Bears bikes will have first call on the grid positions for the F3 races.

Any grid positions that are left vacant can be filled on a first entered (by post date of entry form to meeting) on the grid up to the maximum numbers on the grid as set by the club in the sub regs by Super Motard class bikes."


But with F3 fields in excess of 35 bikes (VMCC) there would be no room for SM's anyway ? That's how I read the above...

[Kevin G]

Amazing that you all have so many opinions now! The time to have your say has been and gone so now you live with it for the time period set. everyone on here had heaps of notice see http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/sh...ad.php?t=75283. it was in the racing fourm but has now been moved for reasons unknown to the motard section??

Maybe next time you might take the time to put your views forward to the right place.

I think the rule is fantasic and can only but help grow the sport, look at the big picture!

Kevin Goddard

[svr]

Amazing that you all have so many opinions now! The time to have your say has been and gone so now you live with it for the time period set. everyone on here had heaps of notice see http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/sh...ad.php?t=75283. it was in the racing fourm but has now been moved for reasons unknown to the motard section??

Maybe next time you might take the time to put your views forward to the right place.

I think the rule is fantasic and can only but help grow the sport, look at the big picture!

Kevin Goddard

The title of the thread gave no indication that Motards might be moved into a roadracing class and, as I (like others no doubt) thought it was none of my businesss, didn't read it or offer an opinion.

An aside, most delays at meeting are caused by crashes. This will increase the number of crashes

[GSVR]

Amazing that you all have so many opinions now! The time to have your say has been and gone so now you live with it for the time period set. everyone on here had heaps of notice see http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/sh...ad.php?t=75283. it was in the racing fourm but has now been moved for reasons unknown to the motard section??

Maybe next time you might take the time to put your views forward to the right place.

I think the rule is fantasic and can only but help grow the sport, look at the big picture!

Kevin Goddard

I'm really, really sorry. I apologize unreservedly. I offer a complete and utter retraction. The imputation was totally without basis in fact, and was in no way fair comment, and was motivated purely by malice, and I deeply regret any distress that my comments may have caused you, or your family, and I hereby undertake not to repeat any such slander at any time in the future.

[slowpoke]

"In race meetings where there are F3/ BEARS class races and also Super Motard class races then the genuine F3/ Bears bikes will have first call on the grid positions for the F3 races.

Any grid positions that are left vacant can be filled on a first entered (by post date of entry form to meeting) on the grid up to the maximum numbers on the grid as set by the club in the sub regs by Super Motard class bikes."


But with F3 fields in excess of 35 bikes (VMCC) there would be no room for SM's anyway ? That's how I read the above...

D'OH! Good onya, just burst my bubble why dontcha?! Take away my delusions and I'm left with nothing


....hang on I just had a brain fart: unless we do away with the separate Motard race and just run a combined F3/Pro-twin/Motard race. Those who don't qualify get bumped into Clubman's....