Straight-lining corners

[NighthawkNZ:Me]

Doesn't that also apply when not cutting corners?

Personally I don't bother cutting corners unless I am SURE that it is safe to do so. That usually means a corner that I know, that I have good visibility on and that I KNOW that I have good visibility on. The difference is between: "not being able to see any hazards" and "being able to see that there are no hazards" - if you don't understand the difference between those two things then don't cut corners!

And as Tom said

But those that hit objects while cutting corners did so because it seemed to them they had good visibility and no hazards existed - up until point of impact.

You may know the road, You may know the corner, and you may think that its clear, and it may seem clear...

There could be a car wanting to pull out into that lane and not see you, not expecting you to be there because simply put you shouldn't be

its just simply a bad habbit to to do... and again why would you want to straighten the corners anyway... they are the main reason you like riding...

[MarkH]

And as Tom said



You may know the road, You may know the corner, and you may think that its clear, and it may seem clear...

There could be a car wanting to pull out into that lane and not see you, not expecting you to be there because simply put you shouldn't be

its just simply a bad habbit to to do... and again why would you want to straighten the corners anyway... they are the main reason you like riding...

An invisible car? If there is anywhere where a car could pull out from that you cannot see then you do NOT have good visibility. If there are driveways where cars could pull out from that have thick hedges or whatever then you should stay on your own side of the road. The only corners I cut are exceptions, I do not make a habit of cutting corners. There are plenty of times where I could cut the corner safely, but I don't bother - I usually am not pushing things to the limit and can comfortably make the corners without using the wrong side of the road.


To answer the why - I am pretty sure people that cut corners to allow a greater cornering speed. But of course people shouldn't ride bikes to go fast.

[swbarnett]

If you are 100% sure it is safe then fine, otherwise err on the side of caution

You ride a bike, right? You'd better sell it if you want to be 100% safe. And for that matter, you'd better build a concrete bunker filled with cotton wool and never go out again. No, wait, even that's not 100% safe.

[swbarnett]

Do what you want, it's your life - just be aware it may not go according to plan...

This has to be one of the most intelligent comments I've read on here! If only the law makers could see the logic in this.

[Mooch]

Yeah, I've done a bit of mental thinking (because of too many drugs making me mental). Like, "Oh... the traffic's not moving. I could cut up the inside but if that truck moves forward, I could be squashed against the curb. I know - I could take a shortcut around it on the footpath!"
Or: "Yeah, I reckon I can fit between that car and truck..."
And: "Oh - he's seen me; he's pulled into the curb. I can go past safely." (right before he cracked a u-turn).

Careful thinking (or thinking things through more'n once) is probably a better bet than mental thinking.

Good piss take ! Careful thinking / mental thinking same outcome, at least you’re thinking... you’re more prepared. Let use know when you progress pass near stationary traffic. You might be ready for the next step

Either that, your an absolute expert in all things to do with riding in which case,can you teach me ...... Please ....I'm mentally prepared

[Mooch]

Cut the farkin corners when the road is clear and to hell with the coppers. Twice the road width = MUCH more cornering speed.

How's the 748R going , have you been able to tame the beast ?

[MarkH]

You ride a bike, right? You'd better sell it if you want to be 100% safe. And for that matter, you'd better build a concrete bunker filled with cotton wool and never go out again. No, wait, even that's not 100% safe.

Way to show your lack of reading comprehension there buddy.

If you re-read the bit that you cut out when you quoted me it should be obvious what my point was. Riding a motorcycle is dangerous and cutting the corners adds more danger than is necessary to have fun riding - don't do it (cut corners) if you are not completely sure it is safe. If you feel you can never be completely sure than just don't cut the corners. If you want to extend my point about avoiding risk to not riding at all then that would be your choice - the rest of us understand that SOME risk is necessary to living our lives.

I am sure that most KBers can understand there is a big difference between choosing not to cut corners because it is dangerous and choosing not to ride bikes at all because it is dangerous. Most of us understand that we do take risks by riding, but we don't need to extend the risk taking to riding like Ghost Rider - just because you take A risk it doesn't mean you should take EVERY risk!

[Oscar]

I am sure that most KBers can understand there is a big difference between choosing not to cut corners because it is dangerous and choosing not to ride bikes at all because it is dangerous. Most of us understand that we do take risks by riding, but we don't need to extend the risk taking to riding like Ghost Rider - just because you take A risk it doesn't mean you should take EVERY risk!

Quite right. I think some confuse confidence levels v. skill levels.

Straight lining corners is a thing I do occasionally, because I think I have the experience and the skill to do it.

Would I recommend it to a novice?

Certainly not.

What worries me is the possibility that the people who take this course have a confidence level that is inflated by a certificate received from Mr. Kirk.

Is this confidence commensurate with their skill?
Straight lining a corner is no place to find out...

[Usarka]

I overtook a campervan on a corner only to find the driver considered "straightlining" was a good idea.......

Every one does check their six before changing lanes don't they...?

[NighthawkNZ:Me]

I still don't get why you would want to take away the corners... basically it tells me not to ride with you as can not stick to your own lane, you have taken a corner to hot blah blah blah...

And I mean the government is straighten enough roads as it is??? why would you want to straighten it more... sheese

[Chrislost]

so, ummmm.
what the fuck is the point? if your going so fast that you need to use the other lane then you need to learn to turn a bike or slow down.

option 2 being the more roadworthy one, option 1 being the best.

by the way, most people straightline corners because they fucked up on the straight beforehand(toooo fasttt) brake hard, panic and ended up in the wrong place(ditch or oncoming lane)

my $.00002 worth

[Benk]

Thanks for the illustration Chris. Very graphic. And nice paint skills by the way.

I agree, and cant believe this thread is still kicking.

Whoops, just helped keep it alive again.

[swbarnett]

Way to show your lack of reading comprehension there buddy.

I comprehend fine.

For the sake of clarity I'll leave the rest of your post completely intact:

If you re-read the bit that you cut out when you quoted me it should be obvious what my point was. Riding a motorcycle is dangerous and cutting the corners adds more danger than is necessary to have fun riding - don't do it (cut corners) if you are not completely sure it is safe. If you feel you can never be completely sure than just don't cut the corners. If you want to extend my point about avoiding risk to not riding at all then that would be your choice - the rest of us understand that SOME risk is necessary to living our lives.

I am sure that most KBers can understand there is a big difference between choosing not to cut corners because it is dangerous and choosing not to ride bikes at all because it is dangerous. Most of us understand that we do take risks by riding, but we don't need to extend the risk taking to riding like Ghost Rider - just because you take A risk it doesn't mean you should take EVERY risk!

Riding a motorcycle is dangerous and cutting the corners adds more danger than is necessary to have fun riding - don't do it (cut corners) if you are not completely sure it is safe.

This is the bit I take issue with. First you say that "riding a motorcyle is dangerous" and then you claim that it is possible to be "completely sure it is safe", which is it?

[MarkH]

This is the bit I take issue with. First you say that "riding a motorcyle is dangerous" and then you claim that it is possible to be "completely sure it is safe", which is it?

I am now sure you are just deliberately refusing to understand for whatever reason you may have. "completely sure" in this instance refers to having confidence that you have been able to fully evaluate the corner ahead and been able to see that no hazards are present. "safe" would be a relative term, kind of like "safe to cross the road" where crossing the road is more dangerous than being in a concrete bunker but with caution it can be done with minimal risk to your life. Have you ever heard of the word "safer"? The existence of such a word suggests that there are different degrees of "safe" and that it is therefore not an absolute.

I doubt any one but you is having trouble understanding my point. I am saying that before cutting a corner you should be completely sure that there are no hazards that would make that manoeuvre particularly dangerous. What I mean by this is before cutting the corner you should be able to see all the way through the corner and beyond and be able to tell that there are no cars on the road coming towards you and no cars that could pull on to the road. It should be safe to cut the corner in that it is no more dangerous than staying in your own lane - if there is a significant increase in danger by crossing the centre line then you should ride on your own side. Generally you should not even bother worrying about whether to cut the corner or not and just have fun riding your bike on your own side of the road.

There are corners in NZ surrounded by flat farm land and with wire fencing so that you can easily see the entire corner as you approach. There are also corners that are blind (banks, buildings, trees, hedges, etc) and you cannot see if there is traffic coming the other way - I am saying that you should not cut these corners.

[swbarnett]

I am now sure you are just deliberately refusing to understand for whatever reason you may have.

No, I'm not refusing. I will admit that I'm being pedantic about the wording.

"completely sure" in this instance refers to having confidence that you have been able to fully evaluate the corner ahead and been able to see that no hazards are present. "safe" would be a relative term, kind of like "safe to cross the road" where crossing the road is more dangerous than being in a concrete bunker but with caution it can be done with minimal risk to your life. Have you ever heard of the word "safer"? The existence of such a word suggests that there are different degrees of "safe" and that it is therefore not an absolute.

Agreed, "safe" is a relative term, "completely safe" is not.

I doubt any one but you is having trouble understanding my point.

Of this I have no doubt. As I said above, I do tend to be fairly pedantic about using the correct words for the intended meaning.

I am saying that before cutting a corner you should be completely sure that there are no hazards that would make that manoeuvre particularly dangerous. What I mean by this is before cutting the corner you should be able to see all the way through the corner and beyond and be able to tell that there are no cars on the road coming towards you and no cars that could pull on to the road. It should be safe to cut the corner in that it is no more dangerous than staying in your own lane - if there is a significant increase in danger by crossing the centre line then you should ride on your own side. Generally you should not even bother worrying about whether to cut the corner or not and just have fun riding your bike on your own side of the road.

There are corners in NZ surrounded by flat farm land and with wire fencing so that you can easily see the entire corner as you approach. There are also corners that are blind (banks, buildings, trees, hedges, etc) and you cannot see if there is traffic coming the other way - I am saying that you should not cut these corners.

Now this I can completely agree with. No use of absolute terms where you intended a relative meaning.

Please forgive me if I'm being a bit anal about this. I don't like the implication that being "completely safe" (as in 100% safe) is even possible.

I think in the end our only disagreement has been the interpretation of terminology.