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[Lou Girardin]

Influence can extend far beyond what officially is available to you however. Some serious lobbying by senior staff both in terms of age and rank would be a great thing.

It better happen soon. Public approval now stands at 53% and falling.
Until Robinson and his fanatics gained power it was never below 90%.

[MikeL]

Yes... that is correct... but he should NEVER have been charged. This is what is wrong here. We are being told that is not ok to defend yourself and your property. If someone comes into my home and I am around then woe be them.... and if someone hurts my stepkids... they will not be fit for court let alone anything else! What is wrong with that?

What is wrong with that is that you automatically assume that certain circumstances justify any degree of retaliation. If the farmer had shot and killed the thieves, do you still think he should not have been charged?
Exactly what circumstances justify shooting to kill or seriously injure? Where do you draw the line?

And that's a rhetorical question, because where you personally draw the line is not the point. Nor where the police draw the line. It's a matter for the courts.

And btw I believe in this case the judgement was fair.

[Indoo]

It better happen soon. Public approval now stands at 53% and falling.
Until Robinson and his fanatics gained power it was never below 90%.

I think Robinson and his 'managers' have burnt a few bridges with the handling of the 'porn crisis'. Theres a problem within the force of people gaining positions through politics, not merit and thats seen a rise in cops at the top out of touch with the cops on the street. It makes a huge difference when your working for bosses you respect.

[Lou Girardin]

And that's a rhetorical question, because where you personally draw the line is not the point. Nor where the police draw the line. It's a matter for the courts.
And btw I believe in this case the judgement was fair.

While I do agree with you in principle, the problem is that defending these charges often bankrupt people. Hardly justice being served.
It would be a lot fairer if full costs were awarded in the event of an aquittal.

[Clockwork]

Sorry, I thought this was a motorcycle Forum!

Your point being?
I didn't change this topic of this thread, but even if I did are you saying that we can only discuss motorbikes here?

[Clockwork]

You mentioned sell offs... they started with Lange!

Yeah! but they finished with Clarke and we all know Dr Don would like to start them off again.

[Clockwork]

Why shouldn't he have been charged? Isn't it better to put the matter before the courts and let the justice system decide if the actions were justifiable in the circumstances?

I agree entirely with you there Spud, but shouldn't the same logic have been applied to Keith Abbot?

[MikeL]

While I do agree with you in principle, the problem is that defending these charges often bankrupt people. Hardly justice being served.
It would be a lot fairer if full costs were awarded in the event of an aquittal.

Absolutely. It seems inconsistent to me to acquit but not award full costs.

[drummer]

Why shouldn't he have been charged? Isn't it better to put the matter before the courts and let the justice system decide if the actions were justifiable in the circumstances?

The police did the right thing and so have the courts, (so did the farmer as far as I'm concerned).

absolutely NOT... that is what is wrong... he should not have been charged for defending his own property!

[drummer]

Yeah! but they finished with Clarke and we all know Dr Don would like to start them off again.

Um... what about the privy council... she sold off the bloody court system!!!!!!!!

[drummer]

Absolutely. It seems inconsistent to me to acquit but not award full costs.

Totally... the farmer should also receive compensation... what happened to him was a disgrace... and I can not believe for one moment that some cops... (Stand up Spud) believe that this is fair...

[Clockwork]

absolutely NOT... that is what is wrong... he should not have been charged for defending his own property!

So you think its Ok to kill someone if you are trying to stop them from stealing your property?

[Clockwork]

Um... what about the privy council... she sold off the bloody court system!!!!!!!!

Not really the same subject is it. I'm not defending anything this Government has done, everyone will have their own views on that and no one will ever agree 100% with any Government (except maybe the Prime Minister). I was simply telling offering you a reason why people still support Labour over National despite all the PC Bull.

[drummer]

So you think its Ok to kill someone if you are trying to stop them from stealing your property?

The farmer didn't kill anyone... in my view he used reasonable force. I look at it this way... if you come on my property with the intention of harming myself or family or stealing property then you have NO rights. Lets examine the case we are talking about... the half lifes who came on were proven to have been stealing the farmers quad. Therefore the farmer in my view had every right to do virtually anything to these pieces of scum. Morally he didn't have the right to kill them... that is one where I would draw the line.

If i stole your SV.... and then you caught me riding it... what would you do?

[Clockwork]

The farmer didn't kill anyone... in my view he used reasonable force. I look at it this way... if you come on my property with the intention of harming myself or family or stealing property then you have NO rights. Lets examine the case we are talking about... the half lifes who came on were proven to have been stealing the farmers quad. Therefore the farmer in my view had every right to do virtually anything to these pieces of scum. Morally he didn't have the right to kill them... that is one where I would draw the line.

If i stole your SV.... and then you caught me riding it... what would you do?

I sure as hell wouldn't take pot shots at you as you were riding away!!!!

He bloody near did kill somebody and he wasn't defending himself or his family

Ok so maybe a quad bike is worth more than a life, what' the lowest value you would put on a thiefs life? How much does he need to steal before being eligable for your death penalty?