G Mail

**James Deuce** · 27th January 2005, 14:12

Originally Posted by Biff Baff

wowww, calm down bro - I apologise if you feel that I was being patronising. I certainly didn't mean to be and sorry you took it that way. But would I say what I said to your face ? Sure I would. In a heart beat.

I most certainly did not call you a liar Jim, nor do I think you are, nor did I mean to infer you are. I'm simply telling you what I know, based on over 10 years working in the field of network security.

Relax dude.

Absolutely not. You've assumed that I'm a know nothing idiot, and you've effectively communicated that in what you typed. If you've used electronic media to communicate you would understand that it doesn't convey tone.

Telling me to "relax dude" is as patronising as the original content I'm pissed about.

You know nothing about me, you don't know what governance issues affect telecommunications in NZ since various post-Sept 11 laws have come into effect, and you don't know what I do for a job. I was attempting to give a high-level appreciation that I do know a bit about network security, current monitoring habits of "friendly" governments, and the unscrupulous behaviour that many "third" world based telcos engage in to make an extra buck. My "career" if you can call it that, has largely been around network design, implementation, project management, and server support, for Telcos, Government departments, and Govt quangos.

**Biff** · 27th January 2005, 14:45

Originally Posted by Jim2

Absolutely not. You've assumed that I'm a know nothing idiot, and you've effectively communicated that in what you typed.

No I didn't assume that at all. You're an end user that knows his job, facing operational difficulties on a daily basis. My job was (is) identifying what those difficulties were (are) and delivering solutions in order to make your life easier. You don't know what I have in my bag, I don't know what's on your shopping list.

Originally Posted by Jim2

If you've used electronic media to communicate you would understand that it doesn't convey tone.

I obviously have and I appreciate that my post did not carry my tone. Likewise you’ve jumped down my throat when all I was attempting to do is tell you what’s out there should you be interested in shopping.

Originally Posted by Jim2

Telling me to "relax dude" is as patronising as the original content I'm pissed about.

Sorry - I was trying to lighten things up a bit.

Originally Posted by Jim2

You know nothing about me, you don't know what governance issues affect telecommunications in NZ since various post-Sept 11 laws have come into effect, and you don't know what I do for a job. I was attempting to give a high-level appreciation that I do know a bit about network security, current monitoring habits of "friendly" governments, and the unscrupulous behaviour that many "third" world based telcos engage in to make an extra buck. My "career" if you can call it that, has largely been around network design, implementation, project management, and server support, for Telcos, Government departments, and Govt quangos.

I don't know you, but I know my job. My career has been forged on staying ahead of the game, developing solutions and providing consultancy to governmental organisation in an attempt to counter perceived threats to national security. I specialise in network security & defence and national security communications from a technical & strategic perspective. Hell that's why your government has welcomed me into this country. I know plenty about post 9/11 from a UK and US national security perspective. More than I would or could ever tell you. But what the hell has this rant here got anything whatsoever to do with GMail???!!!!

I've apologised here and I've also sent you a PM apologising. The bottom line is that we both know our stuff and unfortunately you've misconstrued my posts as an attempt to undermine you.

That’s me done. I need a break because I’m rattled here. Shame we couldn’t meet face to face in order to discuss this. Incidentally we may very well be able to soon by the sounds of it as I'm in Wellington shortly where I'll be providing some national security related consultancy work to a certain govt organisation. Maybe then we’d be able to have an informed discussion without one or the other of us getting all worked up because of a simple misunderstanding, and before you get all aggro again, that is not a threat. I happen to like informed debate.

**Daisy Duke** · 27th January 2005, 14:54

Jim, for what it's worth I know Biff well. He's a close family friend. He's a sweet guy an I honestly don't believe he meant any offence, it's not in his nature.

Biff, don't scream at me for standing up for you, but Jim has obviously taken you sharing your knowledge as an attempt to make him look stupid. I know you're not like that. Next time stop showing off and keep your mouth shut!!

**Biff** · 27th January 2005, 14:55

Shit DD. Now it look's like I need girlie help!!

**Daisy Duke** · 27th January 2005, 15:29

I don't think you need any help Biff. But you do need to learn some peoples ego's are easily dented!

**Coyote** · 27th January 2005, 17:35

Originally Posted by Biff Baff

Shit DD. Now it look's like I need girlie help!!

Oooooo, you had to have a girrrlll help you

**Biff** · 27th January 2005, 17:53

Originally Posted by alarumba

Oooooo, you had to have a girrrlll help you

Now look what you've done Daisy. Now my reputation as an erm, mmmm, whatever, is in ruins. Thanks (that's sarcasm by the way).

**SPORK** · 27th January 2005, 18:15

I use gmail simply because it has the best interface/storage/contact management out of all the free web mail services. I doubt it indulges in any more snooping than seemingly benign (sp?) services.

Thanks for your concern, but I'm sure if I want to send details for my invasion of America, I would use a safer option.

**Monsterbishi** · 27th January 2005, 19:18

I gave up thinking about how secure the internet is back when I worked with a couple of ex GCSB guys at a computer firm in Blenheim, even back then when the internet was fledgling to say the least, all traffic could be monitored, and there wasn't a single encryption routine that they couldn't get past in a short amount of time...

Although since I lived out at base Woodbourne I also got to watch each morning as 8 white merc vans with tinted windows all headed out to the spybase at the same time :>

**James Deuce** · 27th January 2005, 20:51

Originally Posted by Monsterbishi

I gave up thinking about how secure the internet is back when I worked with a couple of ex GCSB guys at a computer firm in Blenheim, even back then when the internet was fledgling to say the least, all traffic could be monitored, and there wasn't a single encryption routine that they couldn't get past in a short amount of time...

Although since I lived out at base Woodbourne I also got to watch each morning as 8 white merc vans with tinted windows all headed out to the spybase at the same time :>

Yes, and that's my point. If it's been thought about by someone it's already being done. If it's being countered, it's too late, because they've moved on to something new.

I just got in from a nice long ride, and I responded to Biff's PM before I read this.

I'm a bit stung that you would PM me privately and rather than wait for the response, pop in and have another dig. That's not cricket old chap.

**wkid_one** · 27th January 2005, 20:54

Who really cares about people monitoring your internet surfing - christ - with cellphones, credit cards, eftpos etc - big bother can find anything out about you they want. What difference will it make if they know what porn sites I go to!

**James Deuce** · 27th January 2005, 20:57

Originally Posted by wkid_one

Who really cares about people monitoring your internet surfing - christ - with cellphones, credit cards, eftpos etc - big bother can find anything out about you they want. What difference will it make if they know what porn sites I go to!

And that was my original point. If you have to be an encryption professional to avoid it, then that still leaves 99.99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 9999999999999999999998 Of the world's internet using population "exposed".

**mikey** · 27th January 2005, 21:06

SCRAP SCRAP SCRAP

ARE WE GOING TO SEE A SCRAP BETWEEN THE IT GEEKS??????

**Biff** · 27th January 2005, 21:09

Originally Posted by Jim2

And that was my original point. If you have to be an encryption professional to avoid it, then that still leaves 99.99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 9999999999999999999998 Of the world's internet using population "exposed".

I think that despite all the hot air here we're all in relative agreement. The kind of encryption mechanisms capable of protecting governmental class traffic is simply not available to "mere mortals" like us.

Anyone can listen at anytime is a good rule of thumb for all electronic communications.

Thanks for the PM Jim. No harm done.