Learner Ride - Sunday 30th November

**Eng_dave** · 23rd November 2008, 07:57

Just woke up and its dry as, windy but dry anyone wanna still go?

**Eng_dave** · 23rd November 2008, 08:07

Just checked the weather acording to the met office no rain till tuesday but what do they know? Yeah im eager so what.

**motorbyclist** · 23rd November 2008, 11:11

well fuck me it turns out intuition is better than weather forecasters yet again

unfortunately i had to call it the night before as some riders wanted to know how pissed they could get last night

frankly it's pretty bloody windy at the moment too

if you know where i live pop round before 2pm and we can still go to shelly beach for lunch

**racefactory** · 23rd November 2008, 11:57

Where is your place? So who is coming?

**racefactory** · 23rd November 2008, 12:07

shit i might meet you then at the end of the kumeu motorway joining onto SH16.

got to get my air filter and shit back on in time...

got no fucking texts for 027!!!!!!

**motorbyclist** · 23rd November 2008, 12:14

pm sent

i'll be stopping at the bp just south of kumeu

**racefactory** · 23rd November 2008, 12:46

bro im not gonna make it by 2... who's coming? If there's lots of you guys fuck it just leave without me

**motorbyclist** · 23rd November 2008, 18:57

righto, was a nice ride, began raining as soon as we headed out of course, so we only went to shelly beach and back.

food was great though

Originally Posted by GSXR Trace

why can't the learners get practice in the rain? take it slow, its good experience for them
not saying can't also do dry practice following weekend... but why not do both?

as an interesting experiment (restrospectively speaking) we had trademe900, experienced newbie on an NC30, macros87, with 6000km scooter experience but all of two weeks on his zxr250a, and my 15y/o brother Chris, who has been riding dirt bikes since primary school and is 5 months into his learners on an fxr and now hornet250, and me on the riffer

trademe did quite well as expected (ie not really a learner despite the plate)

macros had a few hairy moments on the road to shelly beach due to inexperience compounded by a well placed fear of slippery surfaces. pumped tyres from 20psi to 33 at the first stop we made, which helped a fair bit.

chris was fine but hit some tar bleed on the road back from the beach in a slow right hander and the front slipped out. luckily no injury but there's a nasty dent in the hornet's tank that will need to be bogged and painted. same corner had tyre marks in the ditch from cars suffering the same fate. might be a reason to finally address the front tyre being the wrong size

in light of this i gave a few lessons on what makes good chipseal in the wet and to watch out for bleed, and a bit on making lines to avoid those hairy moments.

looking at the accident there really isn't much that could've been done rider wise - road conditions and possibly the tyre, with apparently just enough speed to start a slip, are to blame here.

so a few more mental notes made for the big ride this coming sunday - weather permitting - and proof that learner rides are cancelled for a reason; could've been much more that just the one bike going down today.

**racefactory** · 23rd November 2008, 19:14

Can't believe i actually made it in time just as you guys were filling up at the BP!

Glad your brother wasn't hurt- all in all, good wet weather experience...

Just how the fuck do you do this then??

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=se9DOJQyW00
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7OOpE...eature=related

Second video is the same guy.. with pillion on the back...both knee down in pissing rain. When i get my new tyres i want to try it like that in a car park. I reckon if i've got it cranked over like that in the wet just once then I'll have so much more confidence knowing that the extra turning is always there...

**motorbyclist** · 23rd November 2008, 20:13

Originally Posted by trademe900

I reckon if i've got it cranked over like that in the wet just once then I'll have so much more confidence knowing that the extra turning is always there...

but it isn't always there

as we saw today we can slip at even the lowest of speeds and leans - it largely comes down to surface

**gijoe1313** · 23rd November 2008, 20:28

Poos and wees, sorry to hear about that! Apart from that it seems like you guys had a nice enough ride out.

Glad to hear your bro wasn't too badly injured and its good to know that the lil'ol'hornet was good to go and get him back home again!

**Blakomen** · 23rd November 2008, 20:50

Originally Posted by motorbyclist

well i hate to say this, but the ride will have to be postponed until sunday the 30th of November

lol and then what do you know, now i cant make it XD

unless i give up a 3 month paid internship...

**Grahameeboy** · 23rd November 2008, 20:56

Originally Posted by motorbyclist

but it isn't always there

as we saw today we can slip at even the lowest of speeds and leans - it largely comes down to surface

That stuff is a buffer..caught some going straight and wiggled a bit...

**racefactory** · 23rd November 2008, 21:47

Originally Posted by motorbyclist

but it isn't always there

as we saw today we can slip at even the lowest of speeds and leans - it largely comes down to surface

Yeap for sure. I should have added- on a well maintained chip seal road.

For me it was a good lesson in road surfaces in wet:

Hotmix is excellent shit in dry due to increased contact patch but it is a slippery surface when wet due to the water unable to disperse anywhere and is therefore left as a surface between the tyre and the road.

tarseals and white lines as we all know obviously the shittiest surfaces in the wet due to very bad draining properties- they are smooth as fuck and therefore water sits on top of them in a slick film.

chipseal the best surface in the wet. But only GOOD chipseal. This surface i think has best water draining properties as the water sits between the chips providing more useful 'dry' surface area for the tyre contact... even if there is actually less total surface area than hotmix in dry.

However... chipseal can also on the other hand can be bad if it is in poor conditiin. because it is made out of stones, they can become loose and that is bad shit. Also the surface can wear very badly creating ridges or crests in places... But worst of all, is when chip seal wears down so much... the tar has come through to the surface. that is what we saw today wasn't it? first impressions things look ok but later on after the crash we saw that the chipseal was worn down to the tar and so he was in effect riding on a very poorly drained surface,.. front wheel skids on the layer of water and lowside.... . hot mix on the other hand doesnt have these inconsistent kind of properties and is more predictable despite having less total grip in wet.

Those things kind of sunk in today...

The smoothest surfaces you can find will be the BEST due to increased contact area in the dry but the WORST in the wet due to poorest water dispersion/drainage as a result of less ''pores'' for the water to sit in. I think that's right..

That brings me to the question... what are race tracks made out of? I guess they need to have a balance between wet and dry so something in middle of hot mix and chip seal?