ESE's works engine tuner

[Flettner]

Sorry Neil, I'm not yet at liberty to answer direct questions like these.

I guess I know that, can't blame me for asking though.

[TZ350]

Page ... 1190

[Grumph]

Ryger Revisiting. Looking at the pics again:
1. Oil catch can/separator and vent, few hoses here and there
2. Piston has no engraving on crown, therefore a custom made unit
3. Spacer plate under barrel (I think this is the key to incorporating a new gizmo)
4. Reed housing still present as on VM engine. Maybe just for convenience to use existing crankcases. (could be completely blanked off)
5. Connection pipe between the old and new reed housings. Yes or no? Could be the bottom one, if it was wet sumped, is really going to the catch can. The top one, then going to a pressure activated fuel pump.
6. External of cylinder very much the same as a VM cylinder, other than the Ryger logo, inlet side stud bosses are higher and reed valve housing, with a carb bore axis that appears to be a bit lower than reed centreline. Probably got a Czech/Dutch version or long lost cousin of Neil to make the cylinder, possible scabbing key internal sand cores etc from VM
7. Deeply recessed and presumably spigotted into cylinder squish zone (as indicated by others) cylinder head.
8. Gearbox seems to have a regular breather, therefore possibly not connected to the engine lubrication.
9. Frits reckons the head is standard plus around 98% of all the bits. Given this, then because of the fact that it is spigotted, then the bore & stroke are the nominal 54 * 54
10. Ryger staters on deracehelden forum (with a really dodgy translation…. to me at least) that main bearings are plain, not sure if he also included the bigend, maybe there isn’t one?
11. Ignition coil looks standard, Grumph have I missed something??

Anything else fellers?

The pic shows an overlay of a scotch crank mechanism onto the crankcase drawing. To me, with the necessary material required to house the mechanism, then there is not much chance to fit this in. Can’t see anything of this size on the main pic, but the angle of the dangle is such that you can’t see this area, which would be below the old reed block housing.

BTW Frits, how did the Modena 24/7 and, separately, the direct inlet go? They certainly looked like 2 different concepts.

You'd know more than me about the ignition - but looking at the primary cover on the VM parts book, there's nothing extra mounted there, it's blank. Yes, I assume the coil mounts there on the studs as a convenient place to put it - But there is a complete extra piece added there - and it looks to me as though the crank comes out through it. I think I see a small PVL style rotor and magnets...WTF are you going to use for 30,000 sparks/min ? Compression ignition ? Piston doesn't look like it. If it's not ignition, it would be a convenient spot to drive an oil pump.
It's all a mystery to me....When was the tacho last calibrated ?

[peewee]

wobbly just a fast question about that cylinder im welding. would i be better off putting studs in the cylinder and fastening the head on with nuts rather than the original bolts that screw into the cylinder ? wasnt sure if the heat has weakened the threads and they wont hold the 20-25ftlb or so of torque without stripping the threads

thought of heating one of them old yamaha cylinders and torq some bolts into the cylinder and see if they strip the cylinder threads. might give me a good idea what ill be up against with this other cylinder

[wobbly]

If you are worried about the thread strength then simply run Helicoils into them.

[Flettner]

Can some of the transfers ( set high as the exhaust ) also become exhaust blowdown ports first then become transfers later in the cycle?
Talking Ryger engine

[Grumph]

Can some of the transfers ( set high as the exhaust ) also become exhaust blowdown ports first then become transfers later in the cycle?
Talking Ryger engine

IMO only if you have a moving sleeve...and some good cooling.

[husaberg]

You'd know more than me about the ignition - but looking at the primary cover on the VM parts book, there's nothing extra mounted there, it's blank. Yes, I assume the coil mounts there on the studs as a convenient place to put it - But there is a complete extra piece added there - and it looks to me as though the crank comes out through it. I think I see a small PVL style rotor and magnets...WTF are you going to use for 30,000 sparks/min ? Compression ignition ? Piston doesn't look like it. If it's not ignition, it would be a convenient spot to drive an oil pump.
It's all a mystery to me....When was the tacho last calibrated ?

Luc Foekcma makes an ignition systemcapable of over 20000 rpm, he is also involved in the Project.

https://www.facebook.com/luc.foekema...&type=3Special

Can some of the transfers ( set high as the exhaust ) also become exhaust blowdown ports first then become transfers later in the cycle?
Talking Ryger engine

If the Exhaust ports were/are at totally different heights as the transfers you don't need to though..............
In a conventional 2 stroke the cylinder area at bdc is rather jam packed with ports.

In the Frits FOS system there is a fair degree of separation.


Maybe it was actually the wrong way around?
Why do the exhaust ports need to be so high up the cylinder?
If the cylinder can be effectively filled and emptied.

[TZ350]

The Beast has come to the end of its road so I ripped its heart out.



The EFI thing was beginning to come good, with the part throttle runs looking Ok but the Beast had developed a habit of drinking its own gearbox oil and filling the workshop with clouds of smoke.

A sure sign the main bearings have gone (I brought the special phenolic brgs second hand of Ebay in 1988 for a $1) and the crank flopping around was causing the gearbox oil seal to behave like an oil pump. The same problem Chambers had with Av's bike recently.



The flywheel which was glued and screwed onto a GP hub seems to have held up, so that is a good thing.



Peeking through the center fuel injector hole I can see a crack in the piston skirt. A dab of weld will fix that.



And it looks like something small has been rattling around in the combustion chamber. Guess I will find out more when I get the motor apart but the piston and head will clean up Ok, the cylinder is still good. The piston will go back in, 2T's are so easy and cheap to work on.

When I have rebuilt the engine its going into my new NSR MC18 frame (that came from Husaberg) until I finish the air cooled RGV cylinder engine that I have been building for it. The Beasts old rolling chassis is scheduled to go to a new home. Where there may be a supercharged 100 in its future.

[Forgi]

Well there is two things that I can't understand.

It can be easily resolved that the crackcase to be separated and lubricated like in a 4T. The easiest resolution a scotch yoke crankshaft, only the con rod has to be changed and the original crankshaft can stay. It is hard to explain in english so here is a simple pic.

But the first what I can't understand (if it is wrong or right) that what makes the piston, the ringe and cylinder wall lubricated, as in the 4T neither the compression ring nor the upper part of the piston and the valves are lubricated. It's OK that the gasoline make them cool and lubricated but is it enough? As you say that there is no oil in the gasoline.

The other thing that I can't understand if the cylinder hasn't been modified how the hell the rev and the power could rise so much? The EGT has to be rise dramatically to reach the peak 17K instead of 13K. Also instead of the avarage 500-600 degrees have to be 1300-1500 degrees. It is obviously impossible!

[Sketchy_Racer]

So i've come to the conclusion that the Ryger 70hp special is nothing more than a test to see what us wacky internet heros would come up with for a bit of a laugh.

I can't figure out how the thing mechanically stays together at 30k rpm let alone the thermal issues that ought to arise with that power density out of such a little motor, or for that matter how there is enough time to get the air/fuel mixture into the cylinder in around 1 millisecond!

And oh god imagine how many G the piston is under during acceleration/deceleration from 55m/s

[Frits Overmars]

BTW Frits, how did the Modena 24/7 and, separately, the direct inlet go? They certainly looked like 2 different concepts.

Didn't I already tell? I thought I did. The direct inlet version evolved into the 24/7 version which produces 10% more power than the regular Modena engine (with the same obligatory 30 mm carb, pipe, compression volume etc.)
BTW Ken, nice analysis.

[Frits Overmars]

So i've come to the conclusion that the Ryger 70hp special is nothing more than a test to see what us wacky internet heros would come up with for a bit of a laugh.
I can't figure out how the thing mechanically stays together at 30k rpm let alone the thermal issues that ought to arise with that power density out of such a little motor, or for that matter how there is enough time to get the air/fuel mixture into the cylinder in around 1 millisecond!

There are a lot of things in life that I can't figure out but that doesn't mean they can't exist. But I can say that I won't lie to you folks unless it's April 1.

[husaberg]

There are a lot of things in life that I can't figure out but that doesn't mean they can't exist. But I can say that I won't lie to you folks unless it's April 1.

Science is unravelling puzzles.

RE the steam tech picture I posted, theoretically could that sort of thing work on a two stroke and make decent power?
The air flow seams pretty constant surely that must help a little.
Attachment 312491
Attachment 312492

[Frits Overmars]

RE the steam tech picture I posted, theoretically could that sort of thing work on a two stroke and make decent power?
Attachment 312491

If you advance the slider movement by 90° from the present phase, it could run as a two-stroke.
Attainable power would depend on dimensions and revs. The 120 rpm in your picture may be somewhat scanty .