ESE's works engine tuner

[WilDun]

Ahem,
Excuse me ....... What has happened? - pregnant pause, no recent posts! - on the ESE thread?? - I can't stand the suspense just got to say something.

TZ seems to have gone on holiday, Wobbly has thrown a Wobbly, Flettner has become overloaded with experiments, Frits is preparing for the Ryger onslaught in the new year, Motley Crue is trying his best, ........ me? well I'm just hanging around, still trying to get my head around how a two stroke works but now I am more confused than ever.
Did I hear it right? a two stroke doesn't need oil in the petrol anymore? - how come? .......... last I heard, it was a pint of oil to a gallon of petrol! I must have missed something but I'm too tired to go back over it all again.

Think I'll just have another beer!

[lodgernz]

Still no 30 Hp @ 10500 dyno chart for a 125, and not one statement of of facts about the 400 correct.
Sadly I wont be back to pass on any of my big headed knowledge as its obviously all wrong.
See ya.

Thanks a lot guys. Once again petty personal issues ruin it for everyone.

[SwePatrick]

Still no 30 Hp @ 10500 dyno chart for a 125, and not one statement of of facts about the 400 correct.
Sadly I wont be back to pass on any of my big headed knowledge as its obviously all wrong.
See ya.

Can´t take any negativity?
Just ignore them.
And continue.

[G10]

I don't think the piston that's been shown a few posts back is the answer to the Ryger puzzle, if it displaces 125 cc's on the top it only displaces about 85 cc's on the underside to pump the incoming charge. There must be more to the puzzle.

[WilDun]

Thanks a lot guys. Once again petty personal issues ruin it for everyone.

Well, I'm sure most people here don't take the posts personally - most of us understand that it's often hard to get things across in the written word, not as easily as it would be in face to face conversations, also we often don't really know what the person we are having a discussion with is really like.

Of course some people are more adept at getting things across in print than others - then in this forum it is possible to revise what you have said and perhaps change what could be construed as offensive to something less offensive.

Just come back Wobbly, many people did listen to you and the fact is, humans don't always agree and never will - understand that, don't get bogged down in small time controversy, just contribute, there are a lot of other interested people here too you know and if they don't like what you say, so what, most of them just won't comment if they disagree or don't understand!

Think you've got problems? think about Obama, Putin, and of course John Key having so much hassle with all those murderers, rapists, sex offenders and above all minor offenders incarcerated in Christmas Island!

No, you don't really have a problem !

BTW. If any of you think I'm talking shit, please don't tell me that, I'd rather not know!

[WilDun]

I don't think the piston that's been shown a few posts back is the answer to the Ryger puzzle, if it displaces 125 cc's on the top it only displaces about 85 cc's on the underside to pump the incoming charge. There must be more to the puzzle.

I don't think that it's all that important that it has a smaller displacement, it's probably good at lower revs but I think that harmonics take over at the higher revs - that's what I'm led to believe, but don't quote me, others can explain it no doubt.

Also, as regards pumping (or over pumping) issues - this is being restricted only by competition rules and so does not apply to two strokes in the wider world, some free thought can be applied there (ie if the higher moral ground of the four stroke world doesn't step in to scupper it!).
I'm really talking about stepped pistons in general of course, not that particular setup.

I realize of course that this is essentially a bucket racing forum and they do have rules, but just don't let that narrow our thinking!

[breezy]

Ahem,
Excuse me ....... What has happened? - pregnant pause, no recent posts! - on the ESE thread?? - I can't stand the suspense just got to say something.

TZ seems to have gone on holiday, Wobbly has thrown a Wobbly, Flettner has become overloaded with experiments, Frits is preparing for the Ryger onslaught in the new year, Motley Crue is trying his best, ........ me? well I'm just hanging around, still trying to get my head around how a two stroke works but now I am more confused than ever.
Did I hear it right? a two stroke doesn't need oil in the petrol anymore? - how come? .......... last I heard, it was a pint of oil to a gallon of petrol! I must have missed something but I'm too tired to go back over it all again.

Think I'll just have another beer!

i think they've all gone mate!!

[WilDun]

i think they've all gone mate!

No, not on this thread! they'll all be back again - just a little bit of a hiccup! ...... and it gives me the opportunity to say something too, whereas previously I just couldn't keep up!

Anyway if you turn the camera round 180 deg. you'll see a lot more coming in!

[ken seeber]

Ahem,
Excuse me ....... What has happened? - pregnant pause, no recent posts! - on the ESE thread?? - I can't stand the suspense just got to say something.

Willy, well done. I thought of doing something starting like “Just doesn’t seem the same….,” but I didn’t.

So, let’s get down to the matter. Turns out I’m a bit different at times. It also turns out there is a little bit of a difference in everyone, including all you guys out there. If we were all the same all around the world, the place would be a mess.

I think everyone was really enjoying the thread (easily tolerating the differences in us all) and contributing in all levels of ways. Some more abrupt, some more bragging, some wrong, some clearly wrong, some not quite so wrong in their words, but really, who gives a shit? The fact is that it was enjoyable and that a good load of info was being shared and commented on.

I say well done to the bunch of bucketeers who started this wonderful thread originally in 2008 and let it build up to where it is now (current perturbation aside). However, I miss Frits, Wobbly, TZ350, Hooser etc, etc and I want them back and back now. This thread is quoted and contributed to by many people all around the world. It’s great.

Let’s just get it going, keep it going and get the “missing in action” guys back. Please.

Cheers

[WilDun]

Willy, well done. I thought of doing something starting like “Just doesn’t seem the same….,” but I didn’t.
I want them back and back now. This thread is quoted and contributed to by many people all around the world. It’s great.
Let’s just get it going, keep it going and get the “missing in action” guys back. Please.
Cheers

Yes Ken, well spoken, I didn't manage to list all of the guys of course (sorry Husa, Smitty and the dozens of others).
Funny how even the slightest "nudge" can upset the whole applecart somtimes - all very hard to figure out.
So you guys had better sort that miniscule "tiff" you had, you don't even have to apologise or feel silly, just come back as if nothing happened and think of others in future.
As they say "shit happens" , it gets swept up and the stink disappears in no time!

I might add that it's very hard to know who is in contact with who in the PM's etc. and so I may have missed out on a lot.
People like myself who don't have a lot of personal contact through the Bucket Racing etc. with a lot of the guys, tend to be out of the "loop" (dare I even call it "clique") and so seem to be a bit behind in the latest developments, especially in this fast moving and perhaps sometimes confusing thread - but I agree that it has been great up till now despite its failings. - worthwhile resurrecting again and long may it reign!

[gamma500]

I really hope that this thread will continue, I've been reading this almost daily since 2010. I have learned so much, thanks to everyone!

[mr bucketracer]

Thanks a lot guys. Once again petty personal issues ruin it for everyone.

just for you i will come back , but i'm a do'er not a talker so hope thats ok with you , and i don't go fuck you i'm the best ! i like to learn new things , and even if i'm not on the same wave lenth i don't like been told i a fucken wanker or want ever , ok! sick of this shit !

[ken seeber]

Ryger confession time. Yep, the stepped piston I posted a few days ago was a mock-up.
Attachment 317198

Sort of a joke, but, more seriously, another contribution as to what might be inside the Ryger.
Some time ago, I did a range of sketches, one being as below.



Following that, after we found out it has a 90 rod and the piston skirt can be seen at all time after EO, we started thinking along these lines again. We then created a scale schematic layout of the engine based on all the knowns. To this then we added a stepped piston version that might comply, as is shown below:



From that, we just created the mock-up out of scrap and an hour of my time. One big question was, would the piece of skirt just break off? Well, referring to a spreadsheet we did on piston forces and accelerations, we can see at 30k, the peak acceleration is around 350,000 met/sec^2.



Then looked at the skirt.



From this the force acting on the shaded area (or base of the skirt) can be calculated. From F=ma, = (12.5/1000)* 350,000 = 4375 N. Given this force, acting on the area of 220 mm^2, the stress can be calculated from Stress = F/area = 4375/(220^10-6) = 19.9 Mpa = safe, given the UTS might be around 300 MPa. Hope I’m not fundamentally wrong here.
This is all based on no shock loads, no side thrust etc. In fact, given all this it could be simply made much thinner (less weight, less area = same stress), not too sure though if it could go to beer can thickness (Heineken of course?)

What it all tells is that we have no idea really, but all it does is to put some scale to a range of possibilities and raises more questions & points:

1. How the valving works?
2. Does the reduced under-piston working volume cause issues?
3. Although the volume is less, the primary compression ratio (formerly crankcase compression ratio) can be much, much higher.
4. Maybe this is adequate for starting and low speed running, but then maybe das dynamics, 24/7,HCCI, take over and do the trick
5. Maybe the exh port doesn’t go to BDC, allowing for a much shorter piston skirt and possibly another transfer port under the exhaust
6. How does the rest of the engine, particularly the rest of the piston, the rod and its bearings, survive the 30k, notwithstanding nice lubricating conditions?

52 days to go

Better do some real work.

[husaberg]

I found a rather interesting variable speed electric water pump.
I even have a couple here now thanks to a benefactor
Its used on all manner of BMW's as the primary water pump.

The specs are 2kgs and 125 liters /minute.

Quoting the pump specs more than 7500 liters per hour with back pressure of 450mbar'

Pin 1 is battery voltage
Pin 2 is PWM signal
Pin 3 is a test/BSD signal
Pin 4 is Ground

Supplying +12volts to Pin 1 AND pin 2 (and grounding pin 4) should make it run full speed after a 'timeout' period of about 3-10 seconds. To vary speed based on PWM input on Pin 2, you need at least 3ms of an inturrupted high pulse in order for it to awake the pump. Keep that in mind when you decide on the PWM frequency and/or your duty cycle percents.

It needs a controller to operate in variable speed mode but I am pretty sure something could be bodged up with a 555 circuit and a piggy back. Or an Arduino circuit.
http://www.nomad.ee/micros/pwm555.html

or
https://www.maximintegrated.com/en/a...ex.mvp/id/3530
http://www.reichelt.de/ICs-MAX-1000-...40&LANGUAGE=EN

http://www.tecomotive.com/download/manual_tinyCWA.pdf
The manual for this controller gives out the important specs

[TZ350]

TZ seems to have gone on holiday,

No not on holiday, the thread moves on faster than I can make stuff and post about it, I am just getting left behind a bit, that's all.

I have been working with Chambers on his RG50's for F5, trying some new ideas but we are having trouble cracking 14hp, still we will get on top of that. I hope to get the final parts needed from Flettner soon to complete the NSR110 engine. I am also putting the old fuel injected 125 air cooled back together. I have unfinished business with the EFI thing. And have to finish the NSR rolling chassis to test the new motor. Sort of busy but nothing new to post about.