ESE's works engine tuner

[Flettner]

A bypass-jet will make the system sensitive to the viscosity of the fuel. The obligatory fuel for the model engine I was working at contains 20% castor oil, making its viscosity quite temperature-dependent, playing havoc with needle settings. I wanted to eliminate this dependence so I decided against a bypass.
Connecting the gear pump to the engine would give a fuel flow that rises linearly with engine rpm but that is not what's needed, so I chose to decouple the fuel pump rpm from the engine rpm and regulate the pump rpm via the afore-mentioned lookup table.

I guess so, but seeing as you have a computer on board, just give it a fuel temp sensor so as to take account of viscosity changes?

[Flettner]

Which is why some used GP tems that experimented with Fuel injection in the nineties huge pressure (45 bar from memory)and a duel system that feed on intermintent engine revolutions.

You don't want pulsed injection anyway ultimately.

[SwePatrick]

I dunno if posted before, Ryger plot

http://citsengine.com.au/?page_id=64
https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...&v=ndWWHzE1Eek
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4Lk...layer_embedded

[husaberg]

You don't want pulsed injection anyway ultimately.

Not sure with the overlapping that it would ultimately be pulsed much at that speed and pressure.
Cagivas system is detailed in here they are out of order. (But they can be scrolled through.)
http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/al...hmentid=302540
Looking through it wasn't Cagiva that used the skip a stroke alternating injection someone did but I can't remember who?
Incidentally Moto Guzzi had a mechanical direct injection in the 1930's via air.
http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/ne...y&p=1130654830

[crbbt]

I like the idea of continuous flow injection.

Would it work with port injection?

Or would you need a second solenoid/rotary valve to close the nozel when the transfer ports are closed?

I've just started learning programming at uni. Seems logical haha

[Lightbulb]

Frits, years ago, F2D control line combat motors used to have direct fuel continuous injection into the backplate of the engine. It was supplied with a bladder made from surgical tubing,(still being used today). Anyway, when they went to the 4mm restricted venturi engines, they have been able to make more power but putting the fuel into the venturi at a constant flow from the bladder. So the fuel is now pulsed with the air. It is still set by a guess of how much richer it needs to be before it gets into the air. I'm not sure what the real answer is, but being able to control the flow is one thing, but a mechanism for measuring the engines parameters is another. We saw a system back in 2007 , but the guy was having problems with the system in certain situations. It turned out that a lean of peak situation would fool the engine management and it never recovered once it happened. They also had issues when getting over the lean stage when piping up and getting it going on the line.
Neil

[speedpro]

What about continuous injection to an injector, with variable pressure, feeding through a disc controlled port/opening. This would give the control through the variable pressure and the timing of the pulse through the disc. With the disc controlled port closed the fuel would have to have a return path to the tank on the injector side of the disc valve as you wouldn't want the fuel flow to be interrupted but kept constant for any given pressure. Sounds a bit complex when I think about it but easily doable, maybe even by a suitably positioned port into the crankcase through the standard disc valve. The disc would not control the fuel flow, only whether it entered the crankcase and when.

[SwePatrick]

Well...

Today i did a couple of pulls.
First i made the clutch not being able to slip cause i found that it was correct that dyno slipped.



Then i mounted pvl ignition instead as ignitech is still bugging me.
Made a pull with mild ignition, therefor peak torque is lower.




Then i though i´d aim for 42hp at sprocket.
Adjusted ignition a little bit tougher, well..
The engine sounded really nice, really really nice i should say.

Made one more pull,,, *BAM*!!!
Dynoshaft broke *lol*



Is this the baddest mt5 engine ever or what?

Yes a flat curve is what to wish for.
But i thought the abrupt stop in raising torque to an almost flat curve is a limiter.
And when i anlyzed the dyno rpm curve against the engine rpm curve i saw that, gear ratio altered from 10.3 to 10.6 just in the area where the curve flattens out.

'Locked' the dyno has gear ratio 10.3, no slippage.
This means when engine is revving 10300rpm the dyno revs 1000rpms.
And when slippage occur the engine revs 10600 and dyno revs 1000rpms.

A small value maybe, but it makes it 'not correct'.
I will sort this out and make a pull again to se what it does without slip.

rgds
Patrick

[Frits Overmars]

Frits, years ago, F2D control line combat motors used to have direct fuel continuous injection into the backplate of the engine. It was supplied with a bladder made from surgical tubing,(still being used today).

That is more or less what we see in F3D. The fuel is contained in a rubber bladder; the bladder itself is contained in a tank. Pressure from the exhaust pipe (about 1,2 bar abs) is fed in between the tank and the bladder, squeezing the fuel out of the bladder. This cruel continuous injection has the advantage of increasing the fuel flow when the engine power and the pipe pressure rise. The downside is that there is no fuel flow at all until the engine is running, so how do you start it?
Every F3D flier has a circular brand on his index finger from keeping the tailpipe closed while spinning he engine .

[teriks]

Every F3D flyer has a circular brand on his index finger from keeping the tailpipe closed while spinning he engine .

Mostly so after you stall the engine for some reason and are in a hurry to get it up and running in time for takeoff..

[2005bully]

Frits...

There is a very simple non conventional 2 stroke mechanical fuel injection patented by a Barry Holtzman. Its concept may be applicable for your project...
The unit I had was very compact, yet able to feed a 125cc on methanol. It was roughly the dia of an ink pen and somewhere around 20 mm long. It screwed into a 3mm hole drilled
in the cylinder wall, which was located so the piston uncovered it about 60 degrees atdc. Output of the injector pump was plumbed into the crankcase. Engine compression was sufficient to operate the pump for starting purposes.
In operation each injection pulse is directly proportional to the pressure of the previous power stroke. It functioned remarkably well. I ended up sending it to a customer for testing and never got it back.

The patent number is US 6725845 B2

Here is a link to Google patents.... https://www.google.com/patents/US672...zDBhsQ6AEIIzAB

Kermit Buller

[wobbly]

Hey Kermit, in my view that idea is absolute genius, I hope Miss Piggy gave you what you deserved.

[Flettner]

Frits...

There is a very simple non conventional 2 stroke mechanical fuel injection patented by a Barry Holtzman. Its concept may be applicable for your project...
The unit I had was very compact, yet able to feed a 125cc on methanol. It was roughly the dia of an ink pen and somewhere around 20 mm long. It screwed into a 3mm hole drilled
in the cylinder wall, which was located so the piston uncovered it about 60 degrees atdc. Output of the injector pump was plumbed into the crankcase. Engine compression was sufficient to operate the pump for starting purposes.
In operation each injection pulse is directly proportional to the pressure of the previous power stroke. It functioned remarkably well. I ended up sending it to a customer for testing and never got it back.

The patent number is US 6725845 B2

Here is a link to Google patents.... https://www.google.com/patents/US672...zDBhsQ6AEIIzAB

Kermit Buller

Didn't Maytag washing machines have a similar system? They used to run twostrokes before electric. Could you imagine the lady (opps washer person) of the house firing up the Maytag, must have been quite an event.

I think they used some sort of crank case pump to feed the fuel in, it was a form of fuel injection.

Imagine opperating that!!!! O the noise, the smoke, the vibration

[Ocean1]

I think they used some sort of crank case pump to feed the fuel in.

Crank case pressure driven diaphragm pumps, pretty common in chainsaw type applications.

I'm struggling to remember details of a fueling system for a 2T rock drill which had to run at any angle...

[Flettner]

There is a better image

Unbeliveable, wonder if they use HCCI as well?