ESE's works engine tuner

[bucketracer]

there is but I dont think it's been shown (more fun that way and it realy pisses SS90 off) 22 hp out of an air cooled 100

was run at Taupo ( last to nearly first in the first 3-4 corners ) till it threw the rider on the ground
thats why we are now working on the suspention

Yes, it binned Chambers then tossed Avilon a bit later in the same corner.

[Buckets4Me]

TeeZee has only got five fingers on one hand to count with.......

he will have to use the other hand and take his shoes off shortly

[Bren_chch]

Yes, it binned Chambers then tossed Avilon a bit later in the same corner.

We heard it seized

[bucketracer]

..........more fun that way and it realy pisses SS90 off...........

Don't get distracted Teezee, where is the dyno run of your "plenum that works"

I'm not going to hand feed you .....…. If I did, where is the fun in that ...……. At this point I am going to dissapoint every one.......

TeeZee’s not going to hand feed you SS...……. If he did, where is the fun in that...

[Buckets4Me]

We heard it seized

when where what it ran all day Avalon rode after the restart and finished (was around third on the first lap from the back of the field but didn't like how it bucked and swayed in corners so drifted back further)
Avalon just refused to ride it again after that race



you will have to come up next year and see for yourself

[Buckets4Me]

while I respect that many people would have a real intertest in this "Kiwi guy in Germany" at this stage I am not willing to do that.

However, I will "help the boys back home"

HA HA HA real interest my ass

stop making me laugh it hurts to much

[CookMySock]

I don't want to ridicule, I could have done that when you puffed out a megre 15PS because you where way to over advanced and rich, and you spent 2 months thinking you had so much power it was over heating......

Snort, LMAO!!!

Steve

[Squiggles]

I dont think anyone else cares about the dyno run. chasing your tail?

I do... followed this thread for so long i'll feel ripped without it

[Bren_chch]

i dont think there is a dyno run on chart

[TZ350]

We heard it seized

No, Avilon fell and the race was re-started, on the restart she went from last to very close to the front in the first lap but drifted back as she battled with the bikes handling.

Thats when we knew for sure we were never going to be able to do it with the Suzuki GP chassis.....

[TZ350]

i dont think there is a dyno run on chart

Correct........John Conners dyno is not equipped to print graphs.......

Picture is of Bucket4me warming NedKellys bike up on Johns home Dyno.

[Bren_chch]

oh the specifics!

[TZ350]

oh the specifics!

Only because you and Squiggles have asked. I thought it was only that twit SS90 that was interested.

I can say that it didn't blow up and its first dyno test session, if not spectacular was at least encouraging.

Its the first cut and I would have liked to have completed some more development........

A lot of our recent work was inspired by some sensible and constructive posts earlier from Sonic_V they are worth another look….……

There has been a lot of kart classes over the years that have used restrictive carbs. They all use the venturi principle plus the intake tract length tends to be longer than when a non restrictive carb is used.

As for venturi in your intake, I would suggest a taper from the choke of the carb out to 30mm should be adequate, keeping included angle below 14degrees as has been mentioned elsewere. I suspect that once the intake is flowing better, that you will be able to close the disc valve earlier. This is the area that needs looking at………………

0.00017 is spot on for an engine were you require a good spread of power. Basically, you have a 25hp exhaust port there. (for an air cooled engine) The fact that you are five short indicates that your problems are elsewere. Pulling the engine speed down via a longer exhaust system is likely to find some of this power plus your intake work should find most of the rest. I have found it possible to make excellent power with exh time/area as low as 0.00016 plus a nice spread of power.

This is from memory, and remember Johns dyno only graphs rwhp against road speed so rpm has to be calculated.

The original engine with a std 24mm carb and an inlet duration of 225deg made 19+rwhp at 11,250 rpm.

The same engine was fitted with a barrel that has enlarged transfers and a reduced exhaust duration as suggested by SS90 and a 24mm venturi carb as suggested by Sonic_V which was fitted conventionally on the side, it made 21+rwhp at 9,500rpm. It ran best on a 130 main jet and was a strong runner at Taupo.

Same engine, same carb same 225deg inlet duration but with the plenum chamber, it was frighteningly fast up the drive on Taupo gearing but suffered badly from a flat spot below the power band at about 4-5k rpm.

Sonic_V in one of his early posts had suggested an inlet closing point of 60deg ATDC, for a duration of 205deg.

Same plenum engine, same carb but with 205deg inlet duration it still suffered from a lesser but significant flat spot below the power band at about 4-5k rpm.

Reducing the closing point to 45 then 35 degrees ATDC for a duration of 180 reduced the flat spot but it still made the bike unrideable in competition.

Increasing the inlet tract length inside the plenum by 35mm cured the flat spot and it was rideable on the track at Mt Wellington in the wet.

Now Dyno Time….

21+rwhp at 9,500 rpm from the conventional engine with 225 deg inlet duration Sonic_V venture carb SS90 barrel, Honda RS125 chamber and 130 main jet.

20+rwhp at 8,500 rpm from the same engine fitted with the plenum and 180deg inlet duration and it ran best on a 185 main jet.

Interestingly the plenum engine made much more hp below the power band, about 4-5hp every where and this extra low down grunt probably accounts for the wheel spin when giving it some big throttle during testing at Mt Welly.

Testing stopped when we realised that there may be a lubrication problem as most of the pre-mix oil was being left behind in the plenum. To do any more development I will have to build an auto lube motor to go with the plenum.

As the BMEP for 20rwhp at 8,500 is a whole lot better than for 21 at 9,500, it will be interesting to see where the plenum idea goes with more inlet duration and barrel/chamber mods as suggested by Sonic_V for max power at 10,500.

Team ESE are building some new chassis and I have taken the plenum off old Blue to use in the new bike.

So there you have it, encouraging but not spectacular….. "yet"………

Gentelmen do you want to place your bets?

[SS90]

Interesting.

The unusually large mainjet phenominon I have noticed when you "over carb" an engine.

For example.

Say you have a 125cc engine that produces 26PS with a 28mm carb, and a 138 mainjet, the same engine may well produce the same (peak) power (with flatspots in the midrange...some call it "resonance hole") using a (as an example 36mm carb), but requiring a 185 mainjet.

The same power (or less, or what ever) with a bigger carb, and massive mainjet?

That doesn't make sense at all.

Think about it at full throttle a 138 mainjet flows xxx liters per minute, a 185 significantly more.

No way that 185 mainjet is actually flowing what it can, therefore, why does the carb/engine combo require it, just run run somewhere close to cleanly?

In my experience, it comes down to signal strength.

In situations such as this, you can swap jets as much as you like, but there are resonance issues causing the problem, and big jets just mask it, not remedy it.

[TZ350]

.

I have noticed this about you before, you obsess about things, it’s a bit disturbing.

Forget the blars, forget the main jet, all this has been covered before.

Unlike other motors where at resonance the air bounces back and forth in the inlet tract at least three times, picking up fuel each time it passes the jet,

I think the air flow through the plenum carb is all one way, so it has to pick up all its fuel in one go on the way in, hence the bigger jet.

There is clearly an intake tract resonance issue here. The resonance issue is with the 34mm tract from the motor into the plenum.

The blars were cured by changing the length of the inlet tract inside the plenum.

The larger jet is required because the air flow is all one way into the plenum.

There is now no problem with the blars and no stand off in front of the carb at any rev's.

You have seen the video……

Dad was out on a job so we had a bit of fun at lunch time, probably get our arses kicked later for fu..king around at work.

In the first moments of the clip you can see how easy it is to start from cold, and that there is no blow back from the carb.
The Magic Vacuum Cleaner 01 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YxiEo8cgopg

Warming it up before a bit of a blurt up the drive.
The Magic Vacuum Cleaner 02 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p4ef-WUO1Qs

You now have the dyno report and any more work on the plenum will have to wait until we have an auto lube motor and a good chassis to put it in.

Engines are not our main focus at the moment.

Now if you actually know, any tricks about converting an FZR250 chassis and suspension into a realy good bucket your input would be more welcome.

Otherwise we will have to ignore you as a time waster and mock you in the talk shit thread.......