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Thread: ESE's works engine tuner

  1. #24241
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    The direction of crank spin has a huge influence on the bikes stability on corner entry and exit.
    This is the precession effect,and we tried it experimentally when arguing about the crank spin of the BSL500 design.
    Get a bicycle wheel and hold it in front of you by each end of the axle, spin it forwards or backwards then try to turn the axle to the left or right.
    The precession force is huge considering the inertia of a tiny bicycle wheel/tyre, one direction of spin and the wheel "falls " into the turn direction
    Spinning the opposite way its all but impossible to get the axle to rotate left or right by hand at all.
    The amount of resisting force involved is simply staggering when you try this.
    Ive got a thing thats unique and new.To prove it I'll have the last laugh on you.Cause instead of one head I got two.And you know two heads are better than one.

  2. #24242
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    Good article Breezy, thank you.

  3. #24243
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    Quote Originally Posted by wobbly View Post
    The direction of crank spin has a huge influence on the bikes stability on corner entry and exit.
    This is the precession effect,and we tried it experimentally when arguing about the crank spin of the BSL500 design.
    Get a bicycle wheel and hold it in front of you by each end of the axle, spin it forwards or backwards then try to turn the axle to the left or right.
    The precession force is huge considering the inertia of a tiny bicycle wheel/tyre, one direction of spin and the wheel "falls " into the turn direction
    Spinning the opposite way its all but impossible to get the axle to rotate left or right by hand at all.
    The amount of resisting force involved is simply staggering when you try this.
    Try the same experiment with two wheels, one in front of each other. Spin them in opposite directions and see what if anything changes.

  4. #24244
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    Fine idea, but even my wheelchair arms would struggle to hang onto a 4 cylinder crank spinning at 12,000 rpm.
    In your two wheel experiment, the resultant precession effect is dependent upon the relative magnitude of the opposing two forces, and they for sure are nowhere near equal
    when turning a ridden motorcycle.
    Ive got a thing thats unique and new.To prove it I'll have the last laugh on you.Cause instead of one head I got two.And you know two heads are better than one.

  5. #24245
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    So what if you removed the jackshaft and reversed the bike into the corner with the now contra contra rotation of the crank to the driven front wheel offset by the now rather sharpish steering? We'll knock one up. Drew can be first to test ride it.
    Don't you look at my accountant.
    He's the only one I've got.

  6. #24246
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    Quote Originally Posted by F5 Dave View Post
    So what if you removed the jackshaft and reversed the bike into the corner with the now contra contra rotation of the crank to the driven front wheel offset by the now rather sharpish steering? We'll knock one up. Drew can be first to test ride it.
    Been done - anyone else remember "backwardgate" as written up in Cycle mag ?
    I'm sure Husa will find it - but it's better put in the chassis thread I'd think.

  7. #24247
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    Here's an easy way to add on some hp. Not too sure though if it might reduce the expansion chamber efficiency so the nett result in no gain. However, the principle could be used elsewhere.

    Wonder how it fits into various bike and karting rules.


    http://newatlas.com/drum-charger-che...e-turbo/46648/

  8. #24248
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    Quote Originally Posted by ken seeber View Post
    Here's an easy way to add on some hp. Not too sure though if it might reduce the expansion chamber efficiency so the nett result in no gain. However, the principle could be used elsewhere.

    Wonder how it fits into various bike and karting rules.


    http://newatlas.com/drum-charger-che...e-turbo/46648/
    You know, I,ve often wondered if the end of the chamber was super imposed into the crankcase, with a membrane the same could be achived, a pules varried crank case volume.

  9. #24249
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    Quote Originally Posted by ken seeber View Post
    Here's an easy way to add on some hp. Not too sure though if it might reduce the expansion chamber efficiency so the nett result in no gain. However, the principle could be used elsewhere.

    Wonder how it fits into various bike and karting rules.


    http://newatlas.com/drum-charger-che...e-turbo/46648/
    There is also my Italian friend NICOLA BRAGAGNOLO making turbo kits for most 300cc bikes.
    He uses a real turbo and intercooler.
    Very well made!

  10. #24250
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    Quote Originally Posted by breezy View Post
    "There’s very little all the factories agree on, but engine rotation is one of them After sunshine, rain and fresh air, my favourite natural phenomenon is gyroscopic effect. This is because we wouldn’t be able to ride motorcycles without it. If you don’t believe me, try this next time you’re out riding: when you stop at a traffic light, don’t put your feet down. (And don’t send me the bill.) A motorcycle’s spinning wheels create gyroscopic effect that keeps the machine going straight. The more speed, the more gyro and the more stability. This is all good, unless you are racing. Most racers don’t give a hoot about straight-line stability: they’re happy to hold on like gorillas on the straights, just so long as the bike will turn left or right in the blink of an eye. And this is why all premier-class Grand Prix manufacturers – possibly for the first time in history – now run their engines backwards. It may also explain why Marc Márquez’s COTA and Argentina victories were so huge – bigger than any dry-track wins from last year. When an engine runs forward (like most streetbikes) its crankshaft rotates the same way as the wheels, thus adding to the gyro effect, which makes it more difficult to turn into a corner or change direction. The obvious way to reduce gyro effect is to reverse the direction of engine rotation, so the reverse-rotating crank reduces the total gyro effect created by the fast-spinning wheels. The beneficial effects on the dynamics of a motorcycle are significant: 2the bike will turn quicker and change direction faster; a huge consideration in modern racing when most racetracks are very tight and twisty. A reverse-rotating engine also reduces wheelies, because the crank’s torque reaction pushes the front wheel down during acceleration, rather than lifting it (although this is less important than in the days of two-strokes, when crankshaft inertia was greater.) However, nothing is for free in racing. If you run the engine backwards the engine needs an extra jackshaft to keep the rear wheel turning the right way. That shaft absorbs a significant amount of horsepower, as well as increasing engine weight and dimensions. In theory, a reverse-rotating crank also increases understeer in corners, making the bike run wide on the exit, which can prevent the rider from getting on the throttle. But presumably all these costs are worthwhile because this year Honda reversed the engine rotation of their RC213V, the first time they’ve run an engine backwards since the days of the 500s. The last time Honda went backwards was in 1987. The first NSR500, born in 1984, was a real handful, partly because its V4 two-stroke engine ran forwards. The torque reaction from the forward-rotating crankshaft lifted the front during acceleration, causing plenty of problems for riders who spent too much time fighting wheelies instead of thinking about the next corner. The NSR ran backwards from 1987 and won eight of the last 13 500cc titles."

    A bit off topic and random but...
    All true but the 3 cylinder NS500 ran backwards as well.
    I should note however, when the Screamer was reintroduced in the later 90's they kept the Balance shaft as Doohan said it steered better with it in place, that balance shaft of course ran forward.
    Nearly All the other GP500's other thean the swiss auto had twin contra rotating cranks
    Quote Originally Posted by wobbly View Post
    The direction of crank spin has a huge influence on the bikes stability on corner entry and exit.
    This is the precession effect,and we tried it experimentally when arguing about the crank spin of the BSL500 design.
    Get a bicycle wheel and hold it in front of you by each end of the axle, spin it forwards or backwards then try to turn the axle to the left or right.
    The precession force is huge considering the inertia of a tiny bicycle wheel/tyre, one direction of spin and the wheel "falls " into the turn direction
    Spinning the opposite way its all but impossible to get the axle to rotate left or right by hand at all.
    The amount of resisting force involved is simply staggering when you try this.
    The Velo Roarer had twin cotra rotating crankshafts mounted accross the frame with a direct shaft drive it is said to have steered beatifully.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    The MotoCzysz was a bike design that tried to minismise the gyro effect.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    http://motoczysz.com/motorcycles/c1_prototype
    Regardsless of crank rotation the biggest conributer to the gyro effect on a bike is as far as i am aware the wheels.
    All the honda CR125,250,500 shared very similar fame specs, the smaller cranked turn far better due to it small crankshaft the actually CR500 willfully resists any changes in direction.



    Kinky is using a feather. Perverted is using the whole chicken

  11. #24251
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  12. #24252
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flettner View Post
    You know, I've often wondered if the end of the chamber was superimposed into the crankcase, with a membrane the same could be achived, a pulses-varied crankcase volume.
    Could be done, but that would mean using the crankcase as a pump. And since its dead volume is so big, it is, and would remain to be a very poor pump.
    Besides, the gases exiting the tailpipe of an expansion chamber aren't pulsating very strongly any more.
    I see more advantage in using the blowdown pulse of one cylinder to pressurize the mixture-filled exhaust duct of an adjacent cylinder that is about to close its exhaust. It's what you see in multicylinder outboard motors where there is no room for multiple expansion chambers. And that primary blowdown pulse would certainly be stronger than the reflected pulse from an expansion chamber.
    The trick would be to concentrate as much primary pulse energy as possible onto that adjacent exhaust that is about to close, waste as little pulse energy as possible in pressurizing other adjacent exhaust ducts, and still attain a sufficient pressure drop for the first cylinder's blowdown and scavenging phases.
    One could try this scheme with a 180° twin, but it would require exhaust timings well past 200°. The ideal engine for this would be a 120° triple, like the one you've got lying around, Neil .

    Come to think of it (I just had my first cup of coffee) we could use a rotating drum in front of the exhaust ports, parallel with the crankshaft, with passages that control which blowdown pulse is going where. That drum could double as a balance shaft.
    It wouldn't be quite in accordance with KISS, but I think it would be justified if it would improve power and at the same time enable us to omit three expansion chambers.

  13. #24253
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    Interesting...

    I thought it would be a neat idea to use the reverse pulses from the pipe to charge the crank case when the pipe was outa sink, but I have no idea what the hot gases would do to the fresh charge in the crank case, but if the comprex works maybe this could. Now though after what fritz just said, my idea seems less fun...

  14. #24254
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flettner View Post
    Good article Breezy, thank you.
    thanks... but... i had included quotes around the article to indicate its a quote... sadly not my thoughts , but lifted from another source...

  15. #24255
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    Quote Originally Posted by ken seeber View Post
    I know where you are going with this, good idea.

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