ESE's works engine tuner

[guyhockley]

Cagiva cylinder from 1988-89:

[Tim Ey]

I have a question: Does an owner of a Honda NSR250 cylinder or head may print this out

and check if bolt patern and other dimensions are a match?
TeZee probably?

Thanks a lot!
Tim

[guyhockley]

My original post has a lot of links to interesting 2T EFI projects like this one:- EFI CR250 https://youtu.be/VlHyRcmlLgU

http://www.supermototecnica.com/2015/09/10/sviluppi-del-sistema-iniezione-diretta-indiretta-due-tempi/

Seen this one, already?

http://www.snowmobile.com/products/f...600s-1775.html

[guyhockley]

Originally Posted by husaberg
Most of the RGV300s are simply made out of the RG150 cylinders.

No, they are just bored out and replated standard cylinders (with all the compromises that brings)

Certainly the case in the UK, but then we have RG125s to suit our licensing laws.

[guyhockley]

Just found these.

[guyhockley]

and a few more.

[2T Institute]

Gordon Jones had a set of rgv 350 cylinders that got sold to Richard Vanagas in the UK. I know where some TZ/TZR 350 Hummel cylinders/heads are for sale

[husaberg]

No, they are just bored out and replated standard cylinders (with all the compromises that brings)

[IMG]

Certainly the case in the UK, but then we have RG125s to suit our licensing laws.

Thats just silly much easier to use RG150 (i know the UK had them as Grey imports) ones or better yet modded Artic Cat ones

I have a question: Does an owner of a Honda NSR250 cylinder or head may print this out

and check if bolt patern and other dimensions are a match?
TeZee probably?

Thanks a lot!
Tim

I can't see youtr picture but nsr125 heads don't bolt on to NSR250 even though the cylinders can be fitted to each other

RG crank centre is quite different to the RGV, is it easily interchangeable?
Here's a Hummel 375 with a 54mm crank:
http://www.geckomotorcycles.co.uk/ma...-bore-kit.html

Google vincent crabtree rgv250 big bore
http://www.apriliaforum.com/forums/s...-Kit-E-Mids-UK
http://www.apriliaforum.com/forums/s...ankshaft/page4
https://sites.google.com/site/vpcrab...ki-rgv250-vj21
https://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/s...post1130586696
https://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/s...post1131030948
i have some stuff he sent me somewhere as well.
He seems like a nice fella, i think hes a doctor or something similar
i posted it on this thread in reply to a question from either sketchy racer or Richban

Gordon Jones had a set of rgv 350 cylinders that got sold to Richard Vanagas in the UK. I know where some TZ/TZR 350 Hummel cylinders/heads are for sale

You were going to try modding a RG250 crank to go in a RGV weren't you?

In one video (can't recall which though) it was mentioned that it might be a Mikuni patent and that is also the reason they switched to Mikuni carbs for the '17 models.

Yeah i seen that also it was in a link i post about 10 days ago.

I do not understand how any firm could obtain a patent, for a technique where there are clearly examples of people who experiment with variations on the same theme since years...
Is this bluff poker from KTM ?

pretty anyone can patent something as long as its novel and they pay the fee, it doesn't have to be their idea, they can also buy the pattent licence
History is littered with people stealing and patenting others ideas RCA used to do it big time with TV ad Radio.

[Flettner]

Yes but if it's 'prior knowledge' ie been in public view, not secret (250,000 views on just one YouTube clip) then it can not be claimed as novel. I don't care what KTM do so long as they don't stand on my toes when I build my commercial run of engines
Anyway I'm sure if I get to that point I'll have a mark three system. All these patented systems we are looking at deliver the fuel toward the piston or directly into the lower cylinder. Our YZ is the only one that points the injectors discharge at the incoming transfer flow. Best air fuel mixing and somewhere to store the extra fuel when the injectors on time exceeds port open time, or at least usefull gas flow time. Remember the delay in injection is only at lower engine speeds where short circuting is worst. Further more I think that at higher engine speeds there is an amount of fuel that finds its way into the A ports because there is a time when there is no port airflow but the injectors are firing, fuel get into the A port inlet. The first gas out of the A port into the cylinder is just air then the fuel behind it. That's why KTM are using this system, I'm sure they have worked this out also.

[guyhockley]

Could be the KTM patent?

https://patentscope.wipo.int/search/...d=WO2015113096

Roland Kirchberger is a university professor so possibly a bit like Blair at QUB, maybe.

[koenich]

as husa and mols pointed out, patents are a hole other animal. the claims could just consist of some details and thats it...

[Frits Overmars]

I do not understand how any firm could obtain a patent for a technique where there are clearly examples of people who experiment with variations on the same theme since years...

Patent bureaus should investigate whether an idea is really original, before they grant a patent. But it seems that sometimes they don't bother: you get your patent and if it appears that you weren't the first, that's too bad for you: patent null and void, money thrown away. I've seen it happen on more than one occasion.

Could be the KTM patent?
https://patentscope.wipo.int/search/...d=WO2015113096

Could be a KTM patent, but not the KTM patent.

two fuel injection nozzles... whose nozzle axes extend... approximately in the outlet flow direction of the overflow channels... on the opposite sides...

The above patent specifically states that each injector is aimed at the air flowing out of the opposite transfer port, which is clearly different from Flettners solution,
and also different from the actual KTM TPI implementation.

[guyhockley]

Patent bureaus should investigate whether an idea is really original, before they grant a patent. But it seems that sometimes they don't bother: you get your patent and if it appears that you weren't the first, that's too bad for you: patent null and void, money thrown away. I've seen it happen on more than one occasion.

Could be a KTM patent, but not the KTM patent.The above patent specifically states that each injector is aimed at the air flowing out of the opposite transfer port, which is clearly different from Flettners solution,
and also different from the actual KTM TPI implementation.

Confession time - didn't have time to read it, posted it on the basis of the drawing... tea break, now. I'll have a proper look!
Oh, yeah, just looking at the other drawings, it's patently different (see what I did there?!)

[husaberg]

Patent bureaus should investigate whether an idea is really original, before they grant a patent. But it seems that sometimes they don't bother: you get your patent and if it appears that you weren't the first, that's too bad for you: patent null and void, money thrown away. I've seen it happen on more than one occasion.

Could be a KTM patent, but not the KTM patent.The above patent specifically states that each injector is aimed at the air flowing out of the opposite transfer port, which is clearly different from Flettners solution,
and also different from the actual KTM TPI implementation.

Have a look at this and all the citing and referenced patents
https://www.google.com/patents/US6691649

[jamathi]

Are 'big bore' cylinders really that good?
At Aprilia some of the boys working with me fitted big bore cylinders to their Rotax engined bikes.
The result was always the same: less power.....
Because of the big bore made a mess of the transfer ducts!