ESE's works engine tuner

[JanBros]

made my own Excel to calculate FOS-pipes :



calculates the latest FOS pipes, you can add a Wobbly exhaust duct, and compare the original FOS-pipe with 2/3 stage versions.

the 3 pipes can be overlayed in the graph so it is very easy to compare them.

free for all : http://users.telenet.be/jannemie/FOS...E%20black.xlsm

if the experts would like to read the text on page 2 to make sure I'm not talking jibberisch , I would be even more thankful

[SwePatrick]

SwePatrick,

1851 Cylinder? I am interested in removing 3-3.5 mm from the top of Cylinder (72mm Bore) but was not sure there was enough material....it looks like you removed more than 3.5 mm? Is there enough material left at the studs water jacket area if the bore was a 72mm? Also when going to a 72 bore it removes some of the hook in the transfers (Mains & Seconds), is there enough material there to grind the hooks back in with out hitting the water jacket?

The exhaust does not appear to have hardly any coolant flow area as Wobbly confirmed is much needed. What are your plans for the sub/auxiliary exhaust ports? Is there much material between the water jacket & Port?

Ohh,, i dunno name of cylinder, but it is an -98 casting.
And from ~94 to 02 it is the same casting, just minor differences in porting.
I would say you have about 4-5mm before breaking into water, but test/feel with a weldingrod you bend and try to localize waterjacket.
Near/above bolts for bolting it into the the engine it is about 2-3mm at certain places, be careful.

The deck on the cylinder is open, and the 'bungs' or what to call them for the studs are about 22-23mm long downwards from deckplane.
My cylinder is milled off 20mm as is on pictures.
This because i need to mill it 11mm(due to destroked crank), but i don´t trust the studs will sit securely in cast aluminium that is about 12mm.
Therefor i decided to make a new deckplate in the same process as i make the new liner.
Then weld shut the waterjacket against the deck around on the outside..

And finally bore it to spec needed for nicasilplating.

Rgds.


Edit:
I dunno if you can make anything out of this picture.
i try to show with lines were original shape of transfers was.
Green arrows shows were to be careful, but they arent perfect located on picture,, they needs to be lower down, more in height were the nuts are that bolts down the cylinder.

[SwePatrick]

nice project mate.

maybe you can find out what material the cyl is and make a new sleeve from the same material. then weld the sleeve in place and replate it. try to use some kind of heat sink on the top deck if you can, as it will reduce distortion up there. also preheating the cyl to say 93c in a oven also helped me a lot. afterwards I would put it back in the oven so it didn't cool rapidly but im not sure if this did any good

I´ll weld the deck before bore the cylinder to spec for plating.
I planned to heat up whole cylinder after all welding is done to stress relieve it before boring out the liner, and let it cool down slowly.

It is actually the best cylinder by far i have welded in, really easy to weld.

And i came to think of it,, alloy and plating, the plating companies often offer repair of cylinders, with that in mind i guess it is no problem to plate on the welds, But i´ll do as Frits said anyway, just to make sure.
Otherwise i have to make a steel liner.

Rgds.

[katinas]

made my own Excel to calculate FOS-pipes :



calculates the latest FOS pipes, you can add a Wobbly exhaust duct, and compare the original FOS-pipe with 2/3 stage versions.

the 3 pipes can be overlayed in the graph so it is very easy to compare them.

free for all : http://users.telenet.be/jannemie/FOS...E%20black.xlsm

if the experts would like to read the text on page 2 to make sure I'm not talking jibberisch , I would be even more thankful

Thank you very much for your efforts.


Just remember experimentation with exhaust two years ago. I decide to made a new pipe for my Honda Ns 250, so calculating 3 pipe examples. But after all ended with not accurate copy of Honda RS125 (reed) and Aprilia RSA 125 (rotary) pipes (0,8 mm of stainless). Of course dimensions not suitable for NS cylinder, but I just want to feel how these very different shapes pipes work.

Before, tested with STD and Sugaya racing pipes. STD stopped working after 9800 rpm. Sugaya with very nice power band until 10500 rpm.
Both RS and RSA pipes revs to 12000 rpm and worked much better than STD, but Sugaya better at 9500 rpm.

But most interesting difference was between Honda RS and Aprilia RSA pipes: with Honda pipe, was always strong kick from 10000 rpm and this was main difference. Aprilia RSA pipe feels very linear, without any escapades, something nice is in it . I did not notice any difference on max power.
And the same story repeated, when tests these pipes on Suzuki RGV 250 !!! (very different from NS 250).

For 125 and 250 reed engines Honda type maybe more appropriate, but would be very interesting to try Aprilia RSA pipe on 4 cylinder 500 reed type engine.

Of course many other factors exists, but these very simple test just for fun.

[Vannik]

Hi Frits

Exhaust width smaller and transfer time area from 132 to 128 give's more power in sim

How a sim handles blowdown and pretty much all porting:

1. A sim does not predict how much of anything you need, it tells you how well what you have will work,

2. It is not a design tool as such, although there is usually some guidance and design aids in the preprocessor that is used to construct the model,

3. A sim calculates all the flows, purities, temperatures, pressures and densities in all the ducts, boxes, plenums, cylinders and crankcases as the crank rotates. It cannot do this in one continuous calculation but it does it in small increments, typically less than 1 crank degree. At each increment it calculates all the open areas of all the ports and the flow through that port during that time step as a function of all the thermodynamic conditions at that time step. It also calculates the flow and pressure wave movement in all the ducts in that time step. Then it sums all the flows in and out of each plenum, cylinder and crankcase to determine the new states in each as the starting value for the next step.

4. At the end of each revolution it calculates the power, torque, delivery ratios etc for that revolution.

So the sim will not tell you if you have to little or too much time.area of anything, it will just predict less power than what you would get if it was correct and it is up to the simulatee to use his knowledge and all the outputs from the sim to figure out what next.

[dutchpower]

Thanks Neels

The change in the sim was more a bout of Frits last sentence

So is that a good sign !!!

[wobbly]

Wow,I have been called alot of things in my time,but not a simulatee.
One thing that many simulatee's dont have a handle on is the effect that Blowdown has on the scavenging pattern.
As Frits correctly states, when the transfers open,there is more residual combustion pressure above the port than there is case pressure below,within the duct.
Thus we have instantaneous back flow,until the pressure delta is reversed.
You can see this effect on screen as a small "bump " in the transfer pressure ratio as they open.
The lesser the Blowdown STA at the test rpm, the bigger the bump at TPO.

This may seem like a very bad thing, in any scenario.
But it gives the tuner the opportunity to change the way the individual transfer pairs affect the "leaning tower " column up the cylinder back wall.
The transfer that opens first,flows last,due to the inertia of the reversed flow,then having to be re accelerated back in the opposite direction - that is out of the port, not inward down the duct.
Thus the bigger the stagger, the longer this open port "time lag " is in effect - and the greater the effect on the scavenging pattern.

Open the A transfer first, and the B transfers will start to flow pretty much as soon as they open,a few degrees later.
This is classic stagger, and it has been shown in practice to widen the effective powerband at the expense of outright peak power.
Reverse stagger as was employed in the Aprilia RSW/A has the B transfer opening first, thus the much more upward pointing lower A ports are flowing well before the higher B's can.
This has a much more positive effect on peak and overev power capability, not only due to the scavenging effect, but also as the B ports were much wider,lifting them gave a huge increase in STA.

Classic stagger is a useful tool in a situation where you dont have a powervalve, and want to generate some useful mid power - as is the case with KZ2 kart engines.

[Frits Overmars]

Wow,I have been called alot of things in my time,but not a simulatee.

Cheer up Wob, it could have been worse. Let's be glad he didn't call us simulants .

[philou]

Aprilia 500 RSW

[dutchpower]

Oke Wobble and other simultee

128/126/126 give 0.198 more KW then 130/132/132 ( Cannot make more blowndown is that what happen )

Think need powervalve !!!!

[Vannik]

Cheer up Wob, it could have been worse. Let's be glad he didn't call us simulants .

Where I work a "simulant" is a block of TNT, the mass of which determines the size of the mine it simulates, so quite an explosive situation.

I am open to a better word that will work as a single and have a plural

[EssexNick]

I think stimulants is more appropriate.

[Haufen]

taking the addictive nature of Neels software into account, I'd vote for "the product" and "the user"

[Frits Overmars]

taking the addictive nature of Neels software into account, I'd vote for "the product" and "the user"

As a Dutchie I can relate to that . I don't know about South-Africans though. Maybe we have to keep looking for simulatee-alternatives.

[senso]

This is the assembled ECU
You can get the kit cheaper controls fuel and ignition with data logging.
https://www.diyautotune.com/product/...assembled-ecu/

you can also just buy the bare ecu cards
http://megasquirt.info/products/diy-kits/microsquirt/
https://www.megasquirtnz.co.nz/
http://microsquirt.com/viewforum.php...2bfaeae1858585

Take a look at rusefi, runs on a STM32 Devboard, the developer is pretty open and talkative, a friend of mine as an on-going 2 stroke injection project using rusefi, and it works, still needs lots of tunning, but it sure works with a cheapo honda 125 TB with injector, a reluctance wheel welded to the flywheel, some random car crank position sensor and he hacked together a TRIAC and cap for the ignition, with an in tank fuel pump from the same honda 4 stroke donor bike, I think it all came from CBR 125 parts from uk ebay, all in all, he spent less than those ready made kits.