ESE's works engine tuner

[Wos]

I have a friend who is having problems with a yz250 based kart engine running on methanol. Peak up is at 9250. This is the ignition curve he has. Attachment 354093
I think it’s too much and does not drop off.

He had melted pistons. Egt is getting to 620

An I on the right track to help him?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Seems to be a hpi ignition curve.

This cdi is available with second curve..switchable

But these universal cdi curves never fit perfect to application...

Also available for hpi inner rotor ignition are free prgrammable cdis

Or you use yamaha original ignition rotor stator and combine it with hpi cdi programmable for original yamaha ignition system..


Yz 250 original curv is only 20- 23 advance to 4000 then falling... reason seems to be to keep it rideable

Next game changer was to reduze squish gap from about 1,8 mm to 0,9 within keeping compression ratio...area 50 percent...


Grüße Wolfgang

[41juergen]

Seems to be a hpi ignition curve.

This cdi is available with second curve..switchable

But these universal cdi curves never fit perfect to application...

Also available for hpi inner rotor ignition are free prgrammable cdis

Or you use yamaha original ignition rotor stator and combine it with hpi cdi programmable for original yamaha ignition system..


Yz 250 original curv is only 20- 23 advance to 4000 then falling... reason seems to be to keep it rideable

Next game changer was to reduze squish gap from about 1,8 mm to 0,9 within keeping compression ratio...area 50 percent...


Grüße Wolfgang

Why don't you use a Zeeltronic or Ignitech, both are programable and you can adopt them to all needs...

[flyonly]

Why don't you use a Zeeltronic or Ignitech, both are programable and you can adopt them to all needs...

I am suggesting that. Maybe you can help with a related question. The flywheel has a magnetic pickup. Can these work with Zeeltronic and Ignitech? The kart has no battery so it would need to be an AC unit with an internal reg/rec. just not sure about the pick up


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Peljhan]

You have programmable unit for PVL and Selettra available from Zeeltronic.
https://www.zeeltronic.com/page/psr-p01.php

Supported generators:
- PVL 50ohm stator 1424, 58mm rotor
- Selettra P3356, 60ohm stator, 58mm rotor

https://www.zeeltronic.com/page/psr-p02.php
Supported generators:
- PVL 50ohm stator 1419, 1424
- PVL 171ohm stator 1443

I don't know compatibility with HPI ignition

[wobbly]

That HPI analogue ignition has around 8* retard from 6000 to 9500.
So if it is statically retarded to give 15* at 9500 there will be 23* at 6000.
If you run 18:1 compression that Methanol will be happy with in a watercooled ( been there , done it , works perfectly ), then there is nothing wrong with that ignition curve across most of the powerband.
I dont know what sort of power the ignition puts into the gap , but if its even marginal then a fine wire plug like a R7376-11 will help.
The next step of course is to run a P2 Ignitech paralleled to double the CDI energy with the same volts.

[flyonly]

Wobbly

Can you get a magnetic pickup that works with that stator and the ignitech. I am more used to the lump of steel on the flywheel that acts as the pickup


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Wos]

Hello together

Hpi inner rotor programmable cdi works without battery dc

Zeeltronic says

USER MANUAL
PSR-P02 PROGRAMMABLE CDI IGNITION
PSR-P02 is programmable CDI and is specially designed to work with PVL ignition
with inner rotor. It does not work with original PVL ignition coil and require ignition coil
for CDI ignitions. PSR-P02 also requires small 9V, or 12V battery. Current draw is
very low and it is about 25mA when engine running. Small 9V block battery is enough
for more than 10h operation, when shift light and power jet are not used.

??? Bad for long distance endurance races⅜

Why take another manufacturer?
Are ignitech or zeeltronic cdi better, more advatages in programming???

I ask this for my fellow ... he used hpi analog this year and he wants to go next step forward programmable for next race

[yatasaki]

I am suggesting that. Maybe you can help with a related question. The flywheel has a magnetic pickup. Can these work with Zeeltronic and Ignitech? The kart has no battery so it would need to be an AC unit with an internal reg/rec. just not sure about the pick up


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Throw away that Chinese made "ignition" and get yourself hpi or selletra .
Save yourself time and pistons, only thing that is usable here is HPI rotor machined for pvl stator.
Severa independentl race applications went disaster after exactly one year of installing/using this ignition.
Ignition curve goes berserk usually on prolonged wot (straights)

[Wos]

Throw away that Chinese made "ignition" and get yourself hpi or selletra .
Save yourself time and pistons, only thing that is usable here is HPI rotor machined for pvl stator.
Severa independentl race applications went disaster after exactly one year of installing/using this ignition.
Ignition curve goes berserk usually on prolonged wot (straights)

Ups...even hpi is not without damages...

The 210 series with light...outside rotor collapsed with new inner stator on our enduro at coil for timing...ääh...fuck...2 dissapointing races in 2 weeks ... ficken !



Please...give us answer which parts in special...which ignition went to disaster... and why ...sorry...not clear to me...

Try to avoid every Desaster in long lasting races

Thanks

Wolfgang

[TZ350]

.

Two strokes >104cc in the F4 Bucket racing class here in NZ are restricted to the equivalent area of a single 24mm carb.

Team ESE did a lot of work to improve flow through their 24mm carbs.

And recently someone did some comparative flow tests for us using a 28mm Keihin as a standard comparator.



28mm Keihin (3) flowed 23.2 CFM
24mm venturi insert (1) glued in the back of a bored out 24mm OKO. Gave 94% flow of the 28mm Keihin.
24mm OKO (4) with a std 24mm throat but the down side flared out to 28mm. Gave 86% flow of the 28mm Keihin.
24mm unmodified standard Suzuki GP125 carb (2). Gave 78% flow of the 28mm Keihin.

[F5 Dave]

Rob, I don't understand 1. The bellmouth appears cut off. The insert is long?
Is there any tapering?

[wobbly]

I have always thought running a PVL or Selettra stator with the Zeel was a Mickey Mouse solution , as you are using the existing HV source coil.
These are always compromised as the wire size and turns are limited to gain enough spark voltage , not ignition power.
The best solution be it a Zeel or Ignitech is a proper DC-DC converter , using a 12V generating stator.
TeeZee does a mod stator winding - but I think the best solution is an early 2000 rotor/stator off CR Honda MX 125/250 that had electronic powerjets and some had a
12V PV servo as well. Driving a reg/rec to give 14.2V charging thru a cap or battery.
These can be adapted onto near anything , as its a very common taper 1:10 . I even put one on a TZ400 twin with two triggers @ 180* off the single rotor lobe.

[TZ350]

Rob, I don't understand 1. The bellmouth appears cut off. The insert is long? Is there any tapering?

The insert is my best interpretation of a venturi. The lead convergent cone is aerofoil shaped. The constriction is 24mm and the tail is an energy recovering divergent cone. Like the X section of an aero wing.

The insert is glued and pressed in. It can't be removed from the carb body without wrecking the carb.

The insert is about 40mm long and the inlet tract to the rotary valve is about 68mm. The carb was enlarged in the area of the main jet to reduce the disruption to the airflow by the slide, Jet nozzle and needle.

The part of the bell mouth that was there for the air filter rubber boot, was cut off.



This class legal 24mm OKO that has been modified, gives 94% of the flow of a genuine standard 28mm Keihin.

It is probably time to do away with the 24mm carb rule. No other F4 bike has that restriction.

[F5 Dave]

I've found that front face important to flow as the carb sucks right around corners apparently. I've made rounded slip ons like a finger to cover the air-boot part but make the area circularish in cross section, with small gains on the dyno. Kneedit built up on shown would be an easy test.

[Grumph]

How big was your bored out OKO?

I used a 29mm flatslide carb off an RG250 with an insert on the engine side which was shaped as you've done - but only about 15mm long

Never flow tested it but results were pretty good.