ESE's works engine tuner

[Sully60]

As I've found with the switch from old #6 to new #6, a lot of the wheelie potential of a machine is down to piss poor suspension. Old #6 would wheelie in 3rd if you changed direction fast enough and new #6 is reluctant to wheelie even doing all out drag starts.

I suspect that's more to do with weight distribution than suspension. Even my slow RG 50 will understeer from the apex when the throttle is cracked, fun times! Add more pwer and it would get rool fun!

[koba]

I suspect that's more to do with weight distribution than suspension. Even my slow RG 50 will understeer from the apex when the throttle is cracked, fun times! Add more pwer and it would get rool fun!

I've notice the older bikes have thier weight alot further back, the rear brake is actually usable on the A100.

[SS90]

I have also heard of bikes tuned on the dyno expiring on the track, so I am a little worried about that.

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Ermm, smaller main jet aside....(you should be jetting for each day anyway), the only other significant changes you made involved retarding the ignition timing...... do you really think that this will cause the bike to expire Teezee???????

I personally would just go up 2 main jet sizes, (particularly if the track is at a significantly lower altitude than the dyno was, or perhaps if it was a cloudy day.......)..... and see how it feels...........

All you did when you changed your jet size on the dyno, was jet correctly for the atmpspheric conditions, altitude, air pressure etc)

..... and then you where able to measure the power difference....

Unlike at the track......

Where a "peaky" engine, feels more powerful than it really is!

Wind the rear shock preload and compression damping (if you have it) up to "FULL"..... see what happens to your power delivery.........

WHEEEEEEEEEEELIIIIIIIIEEEEEEEEEE!

A 20 HP 125cc air cooled engine with a24 carb is pretty good in my opinion!


But...how many NM do you have?????????

[TZ350]

I personally would just go up 2 main jet sizes,

But...how many NM do you have?????????

Yes I guess thats one thing I have learned, that a "peaky" engine, feels more powerful than it really is! This was common with 70's TZ's.

I will take your advice on the jet sizes. NM? I am afraid the dyno didn't give that info, it only graphed RW-HP against Km/h or at least on the screen that the operator was using.

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[Buckets4Me]

I've only just put it all together with this talk of Taupo. It just shows you the sad state of bucket racing currently that a 14hp bike came third in the GP on a big track. You should have been getting lapped every 8 laps or so by a dozen 20+hp buckets fighting for 1st. No offence intended, just an observation.

whent they watching from the side lines
broken thum
broken engine
broken gearbox ????

all the big guys from auckland anyway
and Dangerous

[SS90]

Yes I guess thats one thing I have learned, that a "peaky" engine, feels more powerful than it really is! This was common with 70's TZ's.

NM? I am afraid the dyno didn't give that info, it only graphed RW-HP against Km/h or at least on the screen that the operator was using.

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Oh...O.K.....

No disrespect intended......

Unfortunately, (in my opinion), you need to find another dyno.

From what I have read in your postings, the dyno operator you used is "on the money"... and will be an invaluable asset to your team.

But...the dyno programme he is using will not give you the full information you need.......

In one of my first posting I gave the information you need (in regards to how to measure horsepower (OR PS).....

It is a very easy calculation....

F5 DAVE used a Dyno to measure the power on his Trinity cylindered RGV framed "widow maker"...

I suggest you use the same Dyno.....

Dyno Jets Are old...but.....the programmes they use are VERY reliable...it just depends on what altitude they are...the old ones (like any in NZ), don't have a correction factor for each run......they use the same correction factor for every run.....

SHIT

At the very least, they are able to measure both Torque VS RPM, & HP VS Road speed......

This is want you want Torque VS RPM

If the dyno you use does not have an RPM pick up.....don't use it......

The operator you used (from what you have posted) is quite good.... maybe you could team up with him, and F5 Dave, rent the dynojet that F5 used and spend a few hours on that.

YOU CANNOT MEASURE HORSEPOWER......IT'S JUST A CALCULATION.....YOU CAN ONLY MEASURE TORQUE.......

TORQUE IS EVERYTHING

[F5 Dave]

Other end of the country & limited access anyway. But there are dynos in Auckers.

[TZ350]

YOU CANNOT MEASURE HORSEPOWER......IT'S JUST A CALCULATION.....YOU CAN ONLY MEASURE TORQUE.......

TORQUE IS EVERYTHING

I agree. Torque is everything. F5 dave lives about 750K's away so thats not an option. Commercial setups cost to many $$$$$'s, for me anyway. The dyno we used is home made and mechanicaly very good. The software is a bit old now but still does a good job for what they use it for. John who owns and operates it would quite likely be open to a software upgrade if there was someone compitent, willing and interested in doing it.

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[speedpro]

Geez you guys talk shit. Torque? horsepower? The only difference is a bit of maths. If on the day you increased hp at ???rpm or ??mph then the torque increased at ???rpm or ??mph. You achieved an increase. Does it matter if the increase is measured in horsepower or torque. At the track it most certainly won't matter.

[SS90]

John who owns and operates it would quite likely be open to a software upgrade if there was someone compitent, willing and interested in doing it.

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Yea, all it needs is an software change/upgrade!

The roller itself is just a balanced "known" weight, with a reluctor counting how fast it is turning!

As you know, you just need to combine that calculation with the exact RPM of the engine...

Maybe if someone got in contact with Graham Harris in Christchurch, he may be able to do something.

He wrote a programme for his dyno (which was DOS based)

His programme didn't even have an inductive engine RPM pick up, all you do is get a "ratio" run, where you run the bike on the dyno at say 3000 RPM, in the gear you want to do the run on, and measure the roller speed at this point (3000 RPM in third normally), against the tacho...then divide the engine RPM by the roller speed to get you ratio...enter that ratio, and you have the "missing factor" for your torque ( and therefore horsepower) calculation.....

A clever programme will do that automatically.

The advantage with the road speed Vs HP is that you are able to do a "all gear run"......

With an RPM Vs Torque run, all gear runs are not possible!

I hope I don't offend anyone when I say that Road speed Vs Hp readings are ALWAYS about 10% optimistic

Graham Harris's certainly is an old programme.....but it is able to give all the data you need!

(but not road speed Vs Hp), only Torque Vs RPM....

Expensive programmes can do both!


I am lucky enough to use a €4000 programme, and I know people who have copied it...(the programme) unfortunatly it requires an expensive "data box" as it uses a correction factor for each run.

However, this following link is an English translation of a German guys work, take a read, and, while it is a little strange, (recording the sound of the exhaust you say SS90...... are you crazy) I have done comparitive runs for power against this system with the expensive dyno I use, and it was pretty damned close...

The software is free to down load.... as well as instructions on how to build it....

The programme also is able to pick up readings from inertia drum dyno's as well, so you could build the set up, and use the home guys roller.......

No, that's not me in the pictures......

I use a "high tech" dyno, but some clever people here played a part in this programme....... and they tell me it is quite good..... I have compared results with this system against the dyno I use....... it was pretty damned close!

http://land.heim.at/pampa/252319/tmt/gsf_dyno.html

[koba]

Jumping out of the current theme a bit here but has this been mentioned?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermoelectric_effect

http://www.heatsink-guide.com/peltier.htm

I doubt it would be efficient to use on a motorcycle but its all kind of interesting.

OK, I just looked at how much power it needs, thats really not going to work!

[TZ350]

From SAE Paper:= http://www.sae.org/technical/papers/730186

The study concluded that squish velocity has a major effect on optimum ignition timing and rate of combustion pressure rise, with a lesser effect on power, ignition voltage, and spark duration.

.

[SS90]

Geez you guys talk shit.

Thanks Speedpro... that's very nice of you to say!

Because you are such an expert on Dyno's (and I of course don't know my arse from my elbow)... I guess you would know

Can you explain why 1) the dyno Teezee used is unable to display a torque reading....... 2) how he could go about getting that data, and 3) why it is so important to graph your torque curve

I would attempt to do so, but what do I know!

[craisin]

sometimes a software update would require a hardware update
eg more modern software may require XP and 400mhz CPU is minimum spec for XP.
Windows XP is a bit like your bike as if it is installed on a PC and you overclock it by putting a bigger CPU on the motherboard it has a tendency to crash and you need a fresh install.
Linux is free to download but you are better to download it on a linux machine and write it to disc and you install it with a network cable plugged into a Broadband connection.
they say you can configure linux to run on dial-up after the install but we failed on a mates machine as its a hassle.
I dont want to get involved doing software updates though

[Pudding]

Torque? horsepower? The only difference is a bit of maths.

“No Shit” Speedpro, torque and horsepower are different things. Torque and RPM are physical quantities, horsepower is a combination of physical quantities and is therefore a mathematical construct.

Geez you guys talk shit.

Talk is a social construct and a psychological construct for example, is the concept of

“Looking in the Mirror” where one attributes to others a failing in themselves like “Talking Shit”.

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