ESE's works engine tuner

**SS90** · 10th April 2009, 04:35

Originally Posted by TZ350

I think we have lost sight of what Speedpro was saying. That the dyno is perfectly good enough for development work.

.

Anyways....

So what is your next step Teezee? Obviously you have a much more powerful engine than before... when is the next race?

I guess logically you need to gauge what it feels like now, so a race meeting is the obvious choice!

On another (old) subject.... this is a piston that a company in Italy are now using..... I like the concept actually!

**craisin** · 10th April 2009, 06:50

Originally Posted by speedpro

You'd definitely need the latest DOS emulator. Some sort of dual processor platform should be able to run it OK. Say 2Gb of RAM would help of course.

thanks speedpro
heaps of RAM and processor speed is the answer to a lot of PC woes.
I could donate older hardware if anyone was keen ,but its not the way forward

**TZ350** · 10th April 2009, 08:52

Originally Posted by SS90

Anyways....

So what is your next step Teezee? Obviously you have a much more powerful engine than before... when is the next race?

I guess logically you need to gauge what it feels like now, so a race meeting is the obvious choice!

On another (old) subject.... this is a piston that a company in Italy are now using..... I like the concept actually!

Thanks for a look at the piston. I wouldn't have thought of flowing the transfers like that. I have a cylinder that needs reboring and an oversize 0.5mm Wiesco piston that looks like it can be cut away a bit. Out of interest the piston you have shown me, are they for sale? I use a 56mm piston with a 14 or 16mm pin?

Getting to run the bike again next Sunday (2 days time) at Kaitoki. Then there is a points race at Mt Wellington the following Sunday so I will know a whole lot more by then.

The Yamaha SAE paper and MOTA measure the way the transfer ports point to the rear of the cylinder differently. The SAE paper measures it tangentaly and is a whole lot easier to do than MOTA's radial approch.

Its taxing me a bit trying to make good measurements of the port angles, but getting there. And I am keen to see if I can get some good torque and revs dyno data sometime so I can model the engine in MOTA and have a good base to research the port/chamber mods before actually cutting metal.

I was impressed with Johns dyno, many good bikes have been developed there. Avalons Honda RS125 gets developed there and she is running at the front of the GP125 class this year. The idea of graphing Hp against road speed works well and is fantastic for setting up the gearing, totaly impressed and will be going there again (lots).

My current barrel ex opens 81 ATDC 71% bore width and the RM pipe are not the best match and I want to develop a barrel with more modern port shapes and timings, like ex opens 86 ATDC 68% bore width, trans open 116 ATDC, inlet 145/55 and 1.5 primery comp ratio to run with the RM or a more modern chamber.

.

**SS90** · 10th April 2009, 13:10

Originally Posted by TZ350

Thanks for a look at the piston.

My current barrel ex opens 81 ATDC 71% bore width and the RM pipe are not the best match and I want to develop a barrel with more modern port shapes and timings, like ex opens 86 ATDC 68% bore width, trans open 116 ATDC, inlet 145/55 and 1.5 primery comp ratio to run with the RM or a more modern chamber.

.

I have emailed the company (fortunately they speak German) and asked for details about the piston.

Interesting about your timings.....86 Deg for the exhaust is pretty damn good!,and 116 for the transfers is about right too (in my opinion)....a very useable engine!, but you do realise that you will need to shorten your stinger length (considerably), as well as change the angle of your diffusers (both of them, as well as the length...) to make use of these timings..... right?....
Also, I could suggest a new header pipe as well..... (not being picky,just trying to help)

The exhaust width is a good idea, it will cost you torque, but will also reduce the temperature of the piston, so it's a fair exchange!

I have made an exhaust to the same specs as yours/ old school RM125 it was funny to calculate, compared to modern equations..... WOW!..... And next I am tuning a cylinder to the same specs as you have now as well.. (OK cast iron Polini, and it's 133cc's...and the inlet manifold has to be 134mm (can't change that), fortunately it does have a 24mm carb! But a customer is paying, as that is the only way I can do it), not perfect, but the closest I can do right now, and it will be interesting to see what I can get.... I assure you, the dyno I use will NOT read 19.5 PS......... it will be somewhat less...... we will see on that. My calculations are closer to 17PS......., but I believe it will have 15 NM....... Certainly not the best I can do (exhaust is a limiting factor, so is carb size, as is inlet manifold length as well.)

I will take a picture of the exhaust on saturday (tomorrow is a holiday...yay!) and post that (just for fun)

If you want some help with your exhaust, I am willing to lend a hand.

Nice work on the new port timings.....not "cutting edge", but not far off!

Oh yea....measuring port angles....... I feel your pain........I even made "moulds" from hot plastic once.........

**SS90** · 10th April 2009, 13:30

Originally Posted by craisin

thanks speedpro
heaps of RAM and processor speed is the answer to a lot of PC woes.
I could donate older hardware if anyone was keen ,but its not the way forward

Hi Craisin, How easy is it to write a dyno program???....... it's not really complicated mathematics, and there is already a roller needing a new program.... it just needs to be able to accept an RPM pick up, and you can do so much more!!

**speedpro** · 10th April 2009, 19:30

Originally Posted by craisin

thanks speedpro
heaps of RAM and processor speed is the answer to a lot of PC woes.
I could donate older hardware if anyone was keen ,but its not the way forward

My "piss taking" definitely needs work. It's DOS people!

An old 386 with 640Kb RAM will be fine. Any odd number version of DOS should be fine. I'm old, I can remember being impressed with my work 486 with 1.2Mb RAM.

If you are running one of those new "Windows" OSs just click Start - run, then enter "command". You are now in the world of DOS.

**craisin** · 10th April 2009, 20:10

Originally Posted by SS90

Hi Craisin, How easy is it to write a dyno program???....... it's not really complicated mathematics, and there is already a roller needing a new program.... it just needs to be able to accept an RPM pick up, and you can do so much more!!

Hi SS90 my path into computers began about 6 years ago when a friend gave me an old 386 running w95 It would break down quite often and a nephew said he would fix it if i would fix his car. In the end I was better in fixing PCs than my nephew
But what i didnt realise I had become a pirate as they say, so i bought a brand new PC to avoid being a pirate.
And i started using Linux on older PCs I have been given for helping people with their projects.
Ive taken the easy way and avoided using DOS as most people use young people as a way through computer programing to avoid red tape .

**craisin** · 10th April 2009, 20:52

Originally Posted by speedpro

My "piss taking" definitely needs work. It's DOS people!

An old 386 with 640Kb RAM will be fine. Any odd number version of DOS should be fine. I'm old, I can remember being impressed with my work 486 with 1.2Mb RAM.

If you are running one of those new "Windows" OSs just click Start - run, then enter "command". You are now in the world of DOS.

yeah right speedpro there are many way to skin a cat

but not ceiling cat cause he knows a lot about stroking and he doesnt let the secrets out

**k14** · 11th April 2009, 09:59

Originally Posted by speedpro

If you are running one of those new "Windows" OSs just click Start - run, then enter "command". You are now in the world of DOS.

Not quite, if you have vista you have to do a bit of running around to get it to work. Also "cmd" works just as well and its faster

You may have problems trying to run old dos programs in a 32 or 64 bit os though. May just be easier to get a 486 off trademe for $5.

**TZ350** · 11th April 2009, 20:55

Originally Posted by SS90

I have emailed the company (fortunately they speak German) and asked for details about the piston.

Interesting about your timings.....86 Deg for the exhaust is pretty damn good!,and 116 for the transfers is about right too (in my opinion)....a very useable engine!, but you do realise that you will need to shorten your stinger length (considerably), as well as change the angle of your diffusers (both of them, as well as the length...) to make use of these timings..... right?....
Also, I could suggest a new header pipe as well..... (not being picky,just trying to help) ...

Many thanks SS90 for looking into the piston.

I would be interested in your ideas. I am keen to plan then construct a new barrel/pipe combo for drive out of corners.

.