ESE's works engine tuner

[TZ350]

It's relatively simple to extrapolate the actual linear position of the piston from this but to do it properly I'd like to make a fixture to use a dial guage on it.

As I remember it, for a fixed ignition on the Team ESE Suzuki GP125's .....

1.5 to 2.3mm BTDC

1.5 or 16deg for squish head and 2 to 2.3mm giving 22-26deg for an open chamber head.

Beware .... timing lights take a fixed but finite amount of time to flash after the spark event and as the rpm goes up this delay makes the ignition look like it is retarding. How much??? well that depends on your particular timing light.

This false retarding as the rev's go up, is just something else to look out for.

[dinamik2t]

TZ, that pic was created from the drawings provided by Frits (the old APC cylinder)!

Here's a more complete one: (there is a small mismatch)

It includes the exhaust ducts.
But we already know from the APF 3d drawings, that the aux EX ducts' rear wall angles needn't have to be so steep.

[Frits Overmars]

Seeing as F4 is way too fast , F5 is dominated by the 50cc zealots from Wellington, if i have any chance of ever winning a title I will need to create my own class F6 49cc single speed pre 1960 that should narrow the field a bit.
Heres my entry, after reading in depth about small frontal area , light weight skinny tyres I have arrived at this formula

Attachment 275248 Attachment 275249 Attachment 275250 Attachment 275251

maybe some of the senior bucket guys like speedpro can shed some of their wisdom as he can probably remember them when they were new

I'm afraid your mass distribution is less than optimal; you might want to have more load on the front wheel.
Ever considered Solex racing ? (yes, it's another crazy Dutch thing. But the French picked up on it as well ).

[TZ350]

I have made a start on porting the cases. It's amazing how much metal is removed.

They are looking good Cots .....

[TZ350]

Ok this is what Wob suggested I should try for.

And after a whole lot of work ...... a small improvement but to do any better I need a small right angle drive so I can reach inside the cylinder.



A ports ...

The front of the A port sweeps back a little more than the std cylinder did and the rear wall of the A port has been moved a little more towards the center. On the std cylinder the rear wall of the A port pointed back towards the center of the boost port.



B ports ...

The front of the B port faces straight across the cylinder and the rear sweeps around and meets its opposit about half way between the rear wall and the center of the cylinder.

[Yow Ling]

I'm afraid your mass distribution is less than optimal; you might want to have more load on the front wheel.
Ever considered Solex racing ? (yes, it's another crazy Dutch thing. But the French picked up on it as well ).

Hi Frits, they look a bit chalenging to race, I have a Solex in the shed and also a Batavus Go Go, didnt realise the Solex was Dutch, might start loving it a little more now !. I thought the Solex was an accidentt waiting to happen, seems once you have the knack they have hidden potential.

[Frits Overmars]

I didnt realise the Solex was Dutch, might start loving it a little more now !

It originated in France, but there was a Solex factory in Holland as well, so we started doing crazy things with it.

I thought the Solex was an accident waiting to happen.

You bet: a flimsy frame, no wheelbase to speak of, and ditto brakes. But racing a two-wheeler with front wheel drive is something special. The Solex that we prepared about 20 years ago left black tire marks accelerating out of corners. It didn't do too bad at the Solexracing world championship either....

[jasonu]

Seeing as F4 is way too fast , F5 is dominated by the 50cc zealots from Wellington, if i have any chance of ever winning a title I will need to create my own class F6

49cc single speed pre 1960 that should narrow the field a bit

Heres my entry, after reading in depth about small frontal area , light weight skinny tyres I have arrived at this formula

Attachment 275248 Attachment 275249 Attachment 275250 Attachment 275251

maybe some of the senior bucket guys like speedpro can shed some of their wisdom as he can probably remember them when they were new

Only if it is a non competition engine

[twotempi]

49cc single speed pre 1960 that should narrow the field a bit

A new pre 63 class for the Classic Register ??????

[F5 Dave]

Seeing as F4 is way too fast , F5 is dominated by the 50cc zealots from Wellington, . . .

Zealot!?!

Oh you are a charmer Mike

[koba]

You could always try a MB50 ignition they to have build in retard and pit straight on and the keys and timing marks suit?
I had the standard figures i posted somewhere.i could save some head spininng.

Yet to find one for sale. Haven't looked that hard but over a long period. I can go to fixed as suggested too. I really do need to build a pipe soon, shit or not it will be better as kilos lighter and will allow me the room I need to jack up the rear end.

[F5 Dave]

WTF, they were consummate shitee. Used to run one on the H100, it was crap.

[koba]

You will spend more time and money friggin round with the old unknown ignition just over a longer period than biting the bullet for a programmable.
I went through this with suspension, spent countless hours rebuilding shocks, buying shims and seal heads. Finaly bought a set, bolted them on set the rebound and have not touched them since. They work 100 times better than my best efforts.

Haha, yeah I know the feeling!
I absolutely agree, except for the money part. Having said that the time penalty will be massive.

Still, I'm in it for the fun and I enjoy the workshop side too so I don't mind too much.
Money bled over a longer period is always easier to reconcile.

At this point it's going to cost me nothing but time to build a pipe that won't be as good as it could be but I can rectify that at a later point.
I know I can make my bike faster on track by building a new pipe that allows the rear end to be raised.
I'm currently riding a 14hp bike (20 is fast becoming average) with around 25deg rake on Kart tracks.

MOTA is a massive compromise especialy on the ignition side. However it will provide some useful info on the return wave timing which is what you should concentrate on. As Wob has said probably 100 times and it's worth repeating "big depression/lowest pressure at BDC" and return wave arriving before the exhaust port closes. Get that right then look to get the rpm peak where you want it, finaly jiggle the TL length %'s to what Wob has already posted. Viola no more shit pipe.

Cheers, I'm still getting my head around it all but will keep that burned in my brain next time I have a good MOTA session.
Also must balance that against how hard I can suck on my transfers without them losing control, yeah?

(Gosh that sounds awful!)

[koba]

WTF, they were consummate shitee. Used to run one on the H100, it was crap.

I was looking at anything that would be an upgrade to standard, bolt on aspect appealed. KX one seems to be OK, will run it for now until I go all out and buy something with a lightweight rotor and the ability to run an ignitech.

[2T Institute]

Ok this is what Wob suggested I should try for.

And after a whole lot of work ...... a small improvement but to do any better I need a small right angle drive so I can reach inside the cylinder.



A ports ...

The front of the A port sweeps back a little more than the std cylinder did and the rear wall of the A port has been moved a little more towards the center. On the std cylinder the rear wall of the A port pointed back towards the center of the boost port.



B ports ...

The front of the B port faces straight across the cylinder and the rear sweeps around and meets its opposit about half way between the rear wall and the center of the cylinder.

time to delete those dividers and start again, I don't think any amount of JB Weld is going to fix those ducts.