ESE's works engine tuner

[dinamik2t]

Think someone posted this place for RA tools earlier & I'd bookmarked it but not stumped up the readies.

http://www.ccspecialtytool.com/182a-...dpiece-adapter

Yes, that's it!

I would prefer the electric grinders. I think they are more torquey than air'ed. Plus, rpm's of the 100,000 size are an overkill in porting. No more than 15,000-20,000 will be needed.

Firstly, it's the shaft motor - 1/3 or 1/4hp is ok. Then there are the handpieces and lastly the cutters. Carbide burrs, diamond coated, abrassives, rubbers.. those are some stuff to look for.

A medium quality motor would cost about 80$ from ebay. Best quality might be Foredom, but I favorise Wecheer!
The straight handpieces cost about 50$ each. The right-angle can be found only from CC (less expensive dealer) and it's quite expensive at 280$.
Cutters' and abrassives' value is dependant to their quality - meaning mostly duration over time. I have got most of mine from ebay at low costs. They're ok and still cut decently after 2 years.

Here, some links (random shops):
> http://www.traditionalwoodworker.com...info/247-3301/
> http://www.traditionalwoodworker.com...nfo/247-26511/
For aluminium > 3mm http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...ht_2227wt_1110
...................> 6mm http://www.ebay.com/itm/5-Pcs-per-se...ht_1370wt_1110
For iron > 3mm http://www.ebay.com/itm/Charming-1se...ht_1964wt_1110
...........> 6mm http://www.ebay.com/itm/5-pcs-10MM-T...#ht_921wt_1064
DIamond coated > http://www.ebay.com/itm/30pc-Diamond...#ht_768wt_1110

You could add a set of abrassives too and a few Cratex rubbers.
I made my 'collection' over a 2 years period, but it's ok.
Anyway, you get the idea. If you search for the keywords, there are tons of stuff.

[dinamik2t]

(double-posting to make it easier to read)

I hope I didn't sound much like a pro in the previous post - I am just a semi-experienced amateur with porting tools and what I said came from that little experience.

Some side notes with porting & tools.

If you want to do a port job on a cylinder, first measure its current state. I like to use a nice vernier caliper with at least 0.05 accuracy and a dentist's angled inspecting mirror to accurately determine port roofs - looking/measuring from above the plane of the ports can be misleading and half a mm can make a lot of difference!



Another usefull thing is to use a vernier caliper -with a stop- straigh on the liner. But you will have to cut the ID measuring teeth and a part of the OD teeth too to fit in a 54mm bore. Carefully on the port's roof edge, so that roof angle won't intefere. Always measure many times and take the mean value.
VERY IMPORTANT: measure as accurately as possible and mark the 4 points of the two planar axes (not this kind) on the liner. ie 12 o'clock in the middle of the ex (or in) side, then 3' 6' and 9' accordingly.

After you have decided what you want to do, you must draw everything on paper.
I am into perfection and I like to use a diabetes to design any new radiuses. Then I use a piece of thick paper or even better plastic and cut out the ports' shapes. That is to use it as a guide, exactly into the cylinder. Draw a vertical alignement line in the center of the Exhaust, to match it with the cylinder mark.



Greatly helps minimize mistakes and cut staight lines!
Always stop before your line ofcourse and do the finishing on a lower speed and a less metal-removing cutter (never actually done that, but it's eh.. a good advice).
I would like to try on thin metal sheet sometime. Even though it will take time to cut the desigh, it will give better accuracy in measurements and cutting.

The most difficult part is with the right-angle ofcourse. When shaping both axial and radial angles! I still haven't figured a good and accurate way to do that (+-5 degrees by hand can be achieved -I believe), but I have something in mind. I'll share it if I ever try it.

Finally, each time you're done with a part of the porting, you can pour some vinamold into the ducts and see what you've done. Helps checking volumes, shapes, radiuses, even angles - but it can't be used to measure as it's not very stable.

Here's a lame porting vinamold for demonstration purposes only! :P





p.s. never forget a mask for your eyes (only) and some cotton for your ears.

[kel]

The 4-Stroke boys might have to get their skates on.

Skates are on and ready. Believe Gavin, Grant and possibly Tim have theres on too.

[TZ350]

Skates are on and ready. Believe Gavin, Grant and possibly Tim have theres on too.

It should be a good day, might have to come down for a look.

[TZ350]

... I am just a semi-experienced amateur with porting tools and what I said came from that little experience. ...

I am impressed with the way you go about it and love the tools you have, looks like you do a very good job of the ports.

[Leed]

Mark Jordan's tool for cutting horizontal ports (in a KR-1S)....



The chunk of steel above the tools and in front of the barrel has been designed to slide into a barrel.
Mark can lock it off at any length and use it as a guide so that all ports are the same height.
Also if the grinder slips it reduces the chance of damaging the plating.

a modification to that cylinder insert would be a step to allow vertical cuts (or an angle step - for angular port edges)

[husaberg]

Think someone posted this place for RA tools earlier & I'd bookmarked it but not stumped up the readies.

http://www.ccspecialtytool.com/182a-...dpiece-adapter

Reciprocating tool (Below)
This will be old hat to the pros no doubt but cool measure 10 times cut once though. (Measuring twice would be ok for most people Not Me I am not that accurate)

TZ had some pics way back with rlffler files bent to suit i guess the idea was from tuning for speed.I will post when i find them

Today Tomas spent the afternoon looking at one of the spare barrels.

Pic-1 Tomas is blueing the barrel so he can mark the port heights.
Pic-2 the Honda RS125 Specs.
Pic-3 Tomas has used a degree wheel to set the piston position in degrees ATDC he wants and is scribing a line to show the correct port positions.
Pic-4 working from the top he cuts the port edge up to the line Pic-5.
Pic-6 working inside with a dremmel and riffler files bent to the finished angle of the port he blends the port edge back to the transfer duct to achieve the port (axial) upswept angle of 30 degrees for the main transfers that he wants.

There was surprisingly little metal removed but it was slow careful work it will take the rest of the week or so to complete it. Tomas says it,s most important to get the ports symmetrically even.

The other area to pay attention to is the MSV for combustion chamber turbulence and combustion dynamics and unmasking the transfers.

.

[F5 Dave]

yeah but cleaving the cylinder in twain makes the ports childsplay to get at. glue it together afterwards?

[crazy man]

my mate a jeweler made the nice's job of porting l'v ever seen. it ashame he did not know the port timing of what he was doing

[kel]

I have a couple of sets of riflers bought off ebay,

seem to sit filing for hours for just the smallest change. Prefer the dremel and carbide bits, they have a 90 deg head but it wont fit in a 50mm bore.
Husaberg, Giggles does actually have a dentist drill, not sure if it came from the back of a German car though

[husaberg]

I have a couple of sets of riflers bought off ebay,

seem to sit filing for hours for just the smallest change. Prefer the dremel and carbide bits, they have a 90 deg head but it wont fit in a 50mm bore.
Husaberg, Giggles does actually have a dentist drill, not sure if it came from the back of a German car though

I ve got some Dentist bits if he wants them, l but they are tiny they would be more useful for drilling small items like teeth.

Desaxe

I asked the panel a while back about offsetting cylinders ala YZF450 and Scott and Kawasaki ZX10R.


What i didn't know it comes from the steam age and a lot of aero engines were like this this is what i came up with today whist looking for something else.
I am still trying to model this with a 50mm 50 engine to see the results as my maths is crap and drawings are proving inaccurate.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desaxe

A desaxe engine, in engineering (usually automotive, but also steam engines), means one in which each cylinder is not positioned with its exact center (the bore axis) directly above the centerline of the crankshaft; instead, the cylinder is offset slightly. "Désaxé", in French, means "unbalanced"; it is not (despite remarks to the contrary) the name of the inventor of French origin.

If the offset is in the direction of rotation, it has the effect of increasing the leverage applied to the crankshaft during the "power" stroke, and reducing thrust wasted against the cylinder wall.
It also distorts the duration of the four strokes, or cycles of combustion. In a conventional engine, each of the strokes (intake, compression, power, exhaust) is nominally 180°, totaling 720° for the complete 4-stroke combustion cycle. A desaxe engine adds to the duration of the two downward strokes (intake and power), and subtracts the same amount from the two upward strokes (compression and exhaust), with the total remaining 720°. A typical desaxe engine will have events timed 185° - 175° - 185° - 175°, etc., with the differential roughly (but not directly) proportionate to the percentage of offset distance to stroke length.
The relative proportion of offset distance vs. stroke length ranges from very small to almost 20%; viz. an engine with an 80mm stroke may have a cylinder offset of 20mm.

http://ashonbikes.com/content/d%C3%A9sax%C3%A9-engines

Kawasaki’s new ZX-10R Ninja is bristling with state-of-the-art and new technology, but like so many ideas, some can trace their roots back a very long way. The Ninja’s engine uses a désaxé layout, which means the centre line of the cylinders is offset, and rather than crossing through the centre line of the crank as on most engines, it passes 2mm in front of it, on the exhaust side.
Horex VR6
Just like the crossplane crankshaft in Yamaha’s R1, this is an ‘innovation’ which was being used by the Victorians in their steam engines before the first petrol engine was ever thought of. Where the crossplane is designed to produce a more constant crankshaft speed, désaxé engines aim at giving the pistons an easier life.
During the power stroke, the cylinder pressure is forcing the piston down the bore, but the conrod is at an angle to it. This means the piston is being forced hard against the side of the bore, which every engine builder will know about as there’s always a lot more wear on one side of the bore and piston than the other. By shifting the cylinder to one side relative to the crank, the conrod’s angle with the piston is reduced during the downward power stroke, and the sidethrust is reduced with it.
This has two useful effects: one is a reduction in friction, improving the efficiency of the motor. The second is that because the peak forces on the pistons are smaller, they can be lighter, which in turn allows for lighter conrods and smaller bearings, also reducing internal friction.
Désaxé is often written De Saxé or something similar with claims made that the idea was invented by a Frenchman of this name. This is not the case, and it’s unlikely as one meaning of désaxé is a deranged person – roughly translated it means nutter! The other meaning is off-centre, which describes this cylinder arrangement.
There are other consequences. A small increase in the stroke compared with the crank throw has to be accounted for at the design stage. The power stroke takes longer, which is good for a high revving engine as it allows more time for efficient combustion, but it also makes controlling vibration more difficult as the secondary out-of-balance forces become more complex and asymmetric. The 1970s Hesketh V-twin used a désaxé design which was largely responsible for that bike’s excessive vibration, and the new VW VR6-derived Horex engine is also désaxé, although for packaging reasons rather than to deal with piston sidethrust.
The Ariel Leader two-stroke achieved désaxé advantages but by using gudgeon pins offset in the pistons – the cylinders were still centred directly above the crank.

http://www.iroquois.free-online.co.uk/merco/len.htm

The piston is of typical design, with a nicely filleted baffle and the lower third of the skirt relieved approximately 0.0005 in. The gudgeon pin is of 3/16 in. dia., fully floating, with brass end pads A drop-in cylinder liner, flanged at the top and having a wall thickness of 0.054 in., is used. The flange fits in a channel in the cylinder head, which is of a hemispherical pattern with centrally located long-reach plug and is held down with six screws.
The port timing of the Merco is fairly conventional, except, of course, for the fact that, in terms of crank angle, the opening and closing of the cylinder ports, due to the Desaxe layout, are not symmetrically disposed either side of b.d.c. The actual effect of this is that the ports open and close about 5 degrees later in the cycle, while the piston velocity is speeded up during the compression stroke and slowed down during [lie power stroke, thus giving more time for the expanding gases to do useful work. Rotary valve timing ts normal, with a total induction period of about 185 degrees.

And this
http://hellforleathermagazine.com/20...ed/#more-13281

We’ve been reading a lot about offset, or désaxé, cylinders this year, they seem to be the flavor-of-the-month for motorcycle engine technology, helping to explain the unprecedentedly high outputs from bikes like the 2011 Kawasaki ZX-10R. But, we’ve been unable to translate the relatively simple concept into anything less than very complicated words. This drawing does that for us. As you can see, the design locates the piston to the side of the crank centerline, creating a straighter path for the connecting rod during the power stroke and reducing its sideways force on the piston as it slides up and down in the cylinder. This means less frictional losses and an easier life for the pistons and rods, which can be made lighter, thereby reducing reciprocating mass. That helps the Ninja make a record 197bhp, but bikes like the Honda CBR250R and even the Horex VR6 benefit too.

And more curiously this on the Bantam thread.
http://bsabantamracing.editboard.com...-configuration

Hi all,
Mick gave us some good all round info on this old chestnut and the Phil Irvine piece from the late 60s is spot on ,as far as it goes .
To get bang up to date, some investigative work done to the Aprilia RSA125 engine suggests that the concept is not worth the hassle.
There is no question that rod angles become assymetric , but the benefit is negligible on this engine so a Bantam would`nt feel it !
Less obvious is the increase in piston stroke against the crank stroke indicating that from tdc to bdc is more than 180* and from bdc to
tdc is less than 180* . This then begs the question , just where is tdc ? All of this was arrived at using an offset of 10% of the 54.5 stroke .

Confused ? So am i .

Have a good 2012 , regards Trevor

not sure what you are trying to tell us Mike, but before we move on from this subject,I would like to clarify what we are saying
it does not produce any more power ?
more importantly it does make better or more effective use of the current power you are producing ? .
adding one point to the RSA 125 point trevor noted, an aquantance of mine said they only dropped it because they were told to! and it was somthing to do with the increased friction at higher RPM apparently needed to much cost /time - and the potential that it cancells out the advantages at higher rpm because of the extra friction.

! But he who should be listened to, said there are possibilities for engines only running to 10,000 and with a low number of gears. !

regards Derek

Can Frits add some info to the RSA bit of the story?

[koba]

With these basic tools I have even managing to cut in aux, side exhaust ports, we have not yet tried this cylinder properly.

Freaky. All those tools look so familiar, almost all of them are identical to ones in the workshop I use. Even the oil can looks identical.

[Frits Overmars]

...Can Frits add some info to the RSA bit of the story?

I can, and I think I did. But I haven't discovered a forum yet where I could get along with the search function. Entering 'offset' just got back to me with 'Sorry - no matches. Please try some different terms.' So it will be up to you to (re)find what I wrote about it.

EDIT: found it after all: http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/sh...-tuner/page392 , 27th December 2011 04:04.

[Frits Overmars]

Some side notes with porting & tools.... Always measure many times and take the mean value.

Suppose you measure the same dimension five times; four of them exact. Then taking the mean value is guaranteed to give you the wrong answer .
My way: measure five times, throw out the upper and lower extremes and then take the mean value.
But your next remark more than made up for everything:

p.s. never forget a mask for your eyes (only) and some cotton for your ears.

[dinamik2t]

I am impressed with the way you go about it and love the tools you have, looks like you do a very good job of the ports.

Many thanks TeeZee! I sure enjoy doing the stuff, if not anything else!

Suppose you measure the same dimension five times; four of them exact. Then taking the mean value is guaranteed to give you the wrong answer .
My way: measure five times, throw out the upper and lower extremes and then take the mean value.

Yes, I do reject non-logicaly-valued ... values! Thankfully, -I think- I learned the method of measuring and calculating different kind on deviations quite well from university - I 'm very proud of it
Let aside the silly fun part, it is really important to know a few basics about measuring stuff and take into account possible error sources. Especially on mass production engines, you could measure a width with 0.01mm accuracy and be very happy - but manufacturer would have positioned the X part in the engine with, say, 0.05mm accuracy and all your measures would be crap.
Or here in porting: make a mark on the paper to draw a line with 0.1mm accuracy, but neglect the fact that the pen's nose is 0.7mm, the knife produces another 0.5mm inaccuracy and that by hand porting tools, you can cut with 0.5mm accuracy.

But your next remark more than made up for everything

Hold on If the mean value is only one point you disagreed with, by 'everything' I take it you had more complaints with that post, eh?